6.5 Creedmoor range report

bullsi1911bullsi1911 ModeratorPosts: 8,979 Senior Member
Saturday, I finally had time to get to the range and shoot some with the new Ruger American Predator in 6.5: http://forums.gunsandammo.com/showthread.php?35244-Ruger-American-Predator-6-5-Creedmoor-(Pics)

and do some dialing in with the DPMS LR-308 with some new ammo and do some tests with suppressor on and off.

First, I wanted to let Zee know that on my LR-308 when I put on the suppressor, the POI shift was 1/2" down. I find that acceptable on a hunting rig.

Next, it was time to get serious on the Ruger 6.5. All I had was one box of the Reminton 140 grain core locked that I was mostly wanting to turn into empty brass that I could load when I get the dies, and see if I could go out and use this on one of the last weekends of deer season. I fired one round at 50 yards, adjusted the scope, ran the target out to 100 yards, fired another, and adjusted the scope. Fired to confirm, and had it sighted in. Now, I snugged in on the rifle, sandbagged the toe of the stock and fired a 4 shot group. Why 4? Because thats all the magazine holds.


Holy Crap. Sub MOA. Right out of the box with the cheapest ammo I could find and the flimsy forend on a cheap bipod. The one 'flyer' was the very first shot in this group, and I'm not sure if that was me or if the stock was making contact with the barrel, or what. I fired a few more groups, and got very similar results. Then I screwed on the suppressor and fired two shots to check POI shift.



4" drop at 100 yards. Damn, thats a lot. However, it matches the 300 yard hashmark in the scope reticle, so that is doable for hunting suppressed.

When I removed the suppressor, it shot 2 rounds a half inch high, then settled down to put them all in the bullseye. I really think that the stock being so flimsy is causing that. I need to decide what I am doing with the stock... There are 3 options
MDT Chassis: https://mdttac.com/products/lss-chassis-system
Pro- Rock solid, good reviews, changes to AICS style mags
Con- $400 and you still have to buy the tube, buttstock, grip, and mag. Makes it unergonomic to get to the tang safety

Magpull Hunter: https://www.magpul.com/products/firearms-accessories/buttstocks/hunter-american-stock-ruger-american-short-action
Pro- Affordable, adapts to AICS mags, comes with one mag
Con- Trusted reports say the fore end is flimsy, and the stock is ugly

Boyd's AT-One: https://www.boydsgunstocks.com/at-one
Pro- Affordable, adjustable, rock solid
Con- Heavy, and keeps the cheese ball Ruger magazines


In summary- If you are looking for an accurate, affordable bolt gun, you should get one of these.

I'm off to Cabela's to get some more of that Remington ammo.
To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
-Mikhail Kalashnikov
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Comments

  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 9,681 Senior Member
    Wow! That's impressive. Keep us posted when you start to stretch out the range with your own loads. They will probably be even more consistent.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 18,968 Senior Member
    I experienced the same thing with a .30 cal suppressor last week. Put it on a .308 Win and experience minimal shift. Put it on a .260 Winchester and had a 3” drop in POI.

    Took the the can off and first shot was 1.5” high. Then, back to zero.

    Now, you having similar results has me wondering.........
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 9,681 Senior Member
    Something to do with extra heating/cooling?
  • Jeff in TXJeff in TX Senior Member Posts: 1,182 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I experienced the same thing with a .30 cal suppressor last week. Put it on a .308 Win and experience minimal shift. Put it on a .260 Winchester and had a 3” drop in POI.

    Took the the can off and first shot was 1.5” high. Then, back to zero.

    Now, you having similar results has me wondering.........

    Great groups, I can't wait to get the LH predator I order last week in 6.5 CM!

    If I add my .30 cal suppressor to my .243 win, my POI is 2" low. I'll dial up 8 clicks and I'm good.
    Distance is not an issue, but the wind can make it interesting!

    John 3: 1-21
  • WeatherbyWeatherby Senior Member Posts: 4,349 Senior Member
    Go get that gun bloodied.
  • shooter10mmshooter10mm Member Posts: 205 Member
    Hmmmm.........I put an AAC muffler on my bolt 6.5 Ruger Predator that was shooting 3/4" groups at 100 dead on, put the can on and got groups 5 inches low and right a tad. Had POI shift on a Remington 700.308 3 inches low also...... But every semi auto I run with the can is dead on?? No freaking changes at all? What the heck?
    "You miss 100% of the shots you do not take!"
    "As long as there's Lead in the air there's hope!
    " -- Ralph Adkinson(Daddy) The original Marlboro Man
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 8,979 Senior Member
    Weatherby wrote: »
    Go get that gun bloodied.

    I may be doing that this weekend.
    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • orchidmanorchidman Senior Member Posts: 7,309 Senior Member
    Great Shooter.

    Did you chrony the loads to see what difference in velocity you were getting with the suppressor on?

    All my rifles change their POI when I use a suppressor. After I sight them in sans suppressor I take the turret caps off, loosen the lock screws and turn the indicators to '0'.
    I then fit the suppressor and resight the rifle at the same distance, dial it 'up' and mark the dials with an 'S' so I know that it is 'on' with the suppressor attached.

    When I head out hunting without the suppressor I simply return the scope to '0'........if I am going to use the suppressor I 'dial' it up to 'S' and I am good to go.
    Still enjoying the trip of a lifetime and making the best of what I have.....
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 18,968 Senior Member
    I’m not worried that there is a shift in POI. I’m curious why we are seeing a greater shift when a 6/6.5 cal goes through a .30cal.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    Nice. Just picked up the 223 version of that rifle. Got some scope mounting to do...
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    Nice!

    On the subject of a new stock: I like every chassis system I've tried that DOESN'T use an AR buffer tube. Piss poor cheek riser options on traditional carbine butt stocks, and usually LOP is way too long using traditional choices such as the MagPul PRS. As such, while the MDT is a solid option I strongly urge you to go handle a Savage Stealth before committing.

    Maybe you'll get fortunate and KRG will introduce their Bravo chassis/stock for the American.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "It's far easier to start out learning to be precise and then speeding up, than it is having never "mastered" the weapon, and trying to be precise." - Dan C
  • cpjcpj Senior Member Posts: 36,709 Senior Member
    The Boyd's at one can be fitted for a AICS mag.
    "I'm here for the guns, hunting, and skirt wearing men."
    Zee
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 8,979 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    The Boyd's at one can be fitted for a AICS mag.

    How does that work?
    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • cpjcpj Senior Member Posts: 36,709 Senior Member
    bullsi1911 wrote: »
    How does that work?

    You send it to the place with $200 and they send it back to you. Timc had it done.
    "I'm here for the guns, hunting, and skirt wearing men."
    Zee
  • cpjcpj Senior Member Posts: 36,709 Senior Member
    "I'm here for the guns, hunting, and skirt wearing men."
    Zee
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    Is your barrel free floated? Mine is touching a bit and I may be reaching for sander.
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 8,979 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    You send it to the place with $200 and they send it back to you. Timc had it done.

    That quickly turns it into one of the most expensive options. BUT.... it's something I could do later, just ship them my stock and have it cut in.
    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 20,710 Senior Member
    Not that you don't want or need another stock, BUT, did you check to see if the factory stock is free floated? You know the drill, run a dollar bill down under the barrel to the chamber area. If it moves freely it's free floated. OK I know you know that, I'm just talking this through as I'm thinking it out. If the barrel doesn't touch the stock anywhere all the way to the chamber area, then the flimsiness of the stock shouldn't make any difference. Only if it is so flimsy that it can be inadvertently pushed with very moderate pressure and made to touch the stock while shooting. Your inaccuracy could be caused by where the stock contacts the recoil lug and where the action ring lies in the the stock it isn't a tight secure fit. But a little bedding would cure that. If the action and first two or three inches of barrel is a good tight fit, as long as the barrel doesn't touch the stock the flimsiness of the forend is not creating your problem. I've got a couple rifles with flimsy fore ends that are better than MOA, but they're bedded in around the recoil lug and action ring nice and tight and the stock does not touch the barrel anywhere.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 8,979 Senior Member
    JKP wrote: »
    Is your barrel free floated? Mine is touching a bit and I may be reaching for sander.

    mine touches some on the left hand side. I MAY just goof with the factory stock and wait until after SHOT show and see if anyone comes out with a better option.
    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • cpjcpj Senior Member Posts: 36,709 Senior Member
    bullsi1911 wrote: »
    That quickly turns it into one of the most expensive options. BUT.... it's something I could do later, just ship them my stock and have it cut in.

    Just an option for discussion. And, I need someone to guinea pig that stock.
    "I'm here for the guns, hunting, and skirt wearing men."
    Zee
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 20,710 Senior Member
    bullsi1911 wrote: »
    mine touches some on the left hand side. I MAY just goof with the factory stock and wait until after SHOT show and see if anyone comes out with a better option.

    Whether you buy another stock or not, you should work through the problems and eliminate them as you go, because the inaccuracy may not be caused by the stock. Or it could be something as simple as stock bolt torque.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    bullsi1911 wrote: »
    mine touches some on the left hand side. I MAY just goof with the factory stock and wait until after SHOT show and see if anyone comes out with a better option.


    Already sanded mine some. It is now barely floated but I think I will probably get more aggressive with the sanding.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,056 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I experienced the same thing with a .30 cal suppressor last week. Put it on a .308 Win and experience minimal shift. Put it on a .260 Winchester and had a 3” drop in POI.

    Took the the can off and first shot was 1.5” high. Then, back to zero.

    Now, you having similar results has me wondering.........

    Using sub-calibers to your suppressor can allow for high velocity gas bypass of the bullet near the blast baffle. That can affect bullet stability a small bit. It’s not always the culprit, but can have some effect.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 8,979 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Just an option for discussion. And, I need someone to guinea pig that stock.

    I saw some reports online that there is no bedding at all in the boyds AT one stock. Not sure how that will work with the Ruger V-blocks, so I just emailed to see if thats true, and if there will be any option in the future to switch from the American magazines
    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • cpjcpj Senior Member Posts: 36,709 Senior Member
    bullsi1911 wrote: »
    I saw some reports online that there is no bedding at all in the boyds AT one stock. Not sure how that will work with the Ruger V-blocks, so I just emailed to see if thats true, and if there will be any option in the future to switch from the American magazines
    It will have the same metal blocks as the factory stock. Just like they do with the Savage Axis stock.
    "I'm here for the guns, hunting, and skirt wearing men."
    Zee
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    That Boyd's AT One may be in my future...firing up the Dremel on the factory stock this afternoon.
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    I won't describe it here but there is an easy trigger mod that you can find online. Brought mine down from 4 lbs (lowest the adjustment screw would provide) to 2.5 lbs. Of course any mod is at your risk...(pun intended).
  • cpjcpj Senior Member Posts: 36,709 Senior Member
    JKP wrote: »
    I won't describe it here but there is an easy trigger mod that you can find online. Brought mine down from 4 lbs (lowest the adjustment screw would provide) to 2.5 lbs. Of course any mod is at your risk...(pun intended).

    Same one I did on my American rim fire, I believe. Pretty sure the triggers are the same between center and rim fire. Made a nice trigger, takes 5 minutes, and can be put back to factory specs easily. No permanent modifications needed.
    "I'm here for the guns, hunting, and skirt wearing men."
    Zee
  • FFLshooterFFLshooter Member Posts: 283 Member
    Hmmmm.........I put an AAC muffler on my bolt 6.5 Ruger Predator that was shooting 3/4" groups at 100 dead on, put the can on and got groups 5 inches low and right a tad. Had POI shift on a Remington 700.308 3 inches low also...... But every semi auto I run with the can is dead on?? No freaking changes at all? What the heck?
    A suppressor and barrel are always machined true but not to one another. A few thousands deflection from machining out of eccentricity adds up down range.
  • 41magnut41magnut Senior Member Posts: 1,103 Senior Member
    I received similar results with my RA.

    No wonder Strum Ruger plans to discontinue the M-77.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    "The .30-06 is never a mistake." Townsend Whelen :iwo:
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