New Fedral HST +P 38 spcl load for snubbies

knitepoetknitepoet Senior MemberPosts: 16,829 Senior Member
I just heard about this ammo today. It's a 130gr HST bullet, loaded to basically wadcutter length. "Deep bullet seating eliminates inconsistent powder burn rates"

It might be interesting to get a box and see how they stack up to the GoldDot SB
Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


Replies

  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    Maybe good to carry, not so much for reloads. No bullet profile for guidance into the chambers.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 22,782 Senior Member
    knitepoet wrote: »
    I just heard about this ammo today. It's a 130gr HST bullet, loaded to basically wadcutter length. "Deep bullet seating eliminates inconsistent powder burn rates"

    It might be interesting to get a box and see how they stack up to the GoldDot SB
    I'm gonna watch for them
    I don't get +P much anymore, but, can try them in a .357.
    I have a need for speed
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 22,782 Senior Member
    early wrote: »
    Maybe good to carry, not so much for reloads. No bullet profile for guidance into the chambers.
    That is true; but, if ya gotta reload fast it has hit the fan, so, I would take a different load for a reload.
    I have a need for speed
  • pjames777pjames777 Senior Member Posts: 1,027 Senior Member
    I'm currently of the mindset that multiple trigger pulls beat +P with SD snub nose revolvers. My eyesight isn't what it used to be so I can't rely upon one shot one kill....just saying. (Although my P229 .40 SW when carrying only has Federal Gold Dots.) Can you really get any benefit of +P out of a snub nose?
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 15,695 Senior Member
    pjames777 wrote: »
    Can you really get any benefit of +P out of a snub nose?
    And for tyros like me, what advantage would a .38 spcl +P load have over a .357 Magnum - in a .357 Magnum handgun, of course.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    Carry a 25 if it makes you feel good, but do not ever load it. If you load it, you may shoot it. If you shoot it, you may hit somebody, and if you hit somebody – and he finds out about it – he may be very angry with you. --Jeff Cooper
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    And for tyros like me, what advantage would a .38 spcl +P load have over a .357 Magnum - in a .357 Magnum handgun, of course.

    Less recoil, muzzle blast, and noise. I sometimes load my 357 with 38+p for HD or other close quarters.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 15,695 Senior Member
    early wrote: »
    Less recoil, muzzle blast, and noise. I sometimes load my 357 with 38+p for HD or other close quarters.

    So obviously its halfway (more or less) between std .38 and .357. Makes sense.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    Carry a 25 if it makes you feel good, but do not ever load it. If you load it, you may shoot it. If you shoot it, you may hit somebody, and if you hit somebody – and he finds out about it – he may be very angry with you. --Jeff Cooper
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 6,617 Senior Member
    Hmmm. . . I wonder how "eliminates inconsistent powder burn rates" counters "really long bullet jump to cylinder throat and forcing cone". . .

    Still, I like where this is going. . .

    .38 Special - originally a black powder cartridge that ended up with a lot of extra space in the case when smokeless showed up.

    Now we have this little number that addresses this fact with a deep-seated slug against a small charge of something presumably fairly fast-burning.

    What I fervently hope for is that we see a return of the .38 Short Colt (same idea as the .38 S&W, but in the more common .357" diameter instead of .360" and has the same case head as the Special) in higher pressure loadings for modern guns with shorter cylinders and smaller frames.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • bobbyrlf3bobbyrlf3 Senior Member Posts: 2,412 Senior Member
    I can't find HST rounds here locally for love or money.
    Knowledge is essential to living freely and fully; understanding gives knowledge purpose and strength; wisdom is combining the two and applying them appropriately in words and actions.
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    And for tyros like me, what advantage would a .38 spcl +P load have over a .357 Magnum - in a .357 Magnum handgun, of course.

    My go to for the wife is a .357 loaded with .38's as she is recoil sensitive.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »

    What I fervently hope for is that we see a return of the .38 Short Colt (same idea as the .38 S&W, but in the more common .357" diameter instead of .360" and has the same case head as the Special) in higher pressure loadings for modern guns with shorter cylinders and smaller frames.

    Or just make a 9mm autorim cartridge. .355 versus .357.....much easier.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,614 Senior Member
    I must have posted this 5 times...

    In a 2 inch barrel, a .357 doesn't have enough barrel length to generate the additional pressure a .357 provides. What you will get is whole lot of muzzle flash with a .357 snubbie. It needs at least a 3 inch barrel to develop enough pressure to make a difference and that makes it a little less pocket friendly.

    This chart from Ballistics by the Inch shows how a .357 makes its power by barrel length. Notice at two inches it is about 225 to 250 FPE.

    357mag.png

    FWIW, A 9mm woukd be better...

    9mmluger.png

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 6,617 Senior Member
    Tugar wrote: »
    Or just make a 9mm autorim cartridge. .355 versus .357.....much easier.

    Won't work in existing guns chambered for the .38 Special or .357 Magnum......much less practical.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • TrueTone911TrueTone911 Senior Member Posts: 5,729 Senior Member
    Tugar wrote: »
    My go to for the wife is a .357 loaded with .38's as she is recoil sensitive.

    Same here
    I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member.
    Groucho Marx
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 15,695 Senior Member
    Tugar wrote: »
    My go to for the wife is a .357 loaded with .38's as she is recoil sensitive.

    My wife isn't particularly recoil sensitive - BUT a .357 isn't her favorite load. Maybe she should try some .38 +P just for grins...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    Carry a 25 if it makes you feel good, but do not ever load it. If you load it, you may shoot it. If you shoot it, you may hit somebody, and if you hit somebody – and he finds out about it – he may be very angry with you. --Jeff Cooper
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Won't work in existing guns chambered for the .38 Special or .357 Magnum......much less practical.

    Don't care....what about the several 9mm revolvers that already exist?
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 9,078 Senior Member
    Tugar wrote: »
    Or just make a 9mm autorim cartridge. .355 versus .357.....much easier.

    Its been done
    http://www.ammo-one.com/9mmFedRim.html
    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 1,631 Senior Member
    bullsi1911 wrote: »

    Still makes more sense that bringing ANOTHER new cartridge to the mix AS WELL AS new guns to fire them.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,614 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    My wife isn't particularly recoil sensitive - BUT a .357 isn't her favorite load. Maybe she should try some .38 +P just for grins...

    .38 Specials with Trailboss is like shooting a .22.

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 16,829 Senior Member
    Well, I just ordered a box. Will test it vs the golddot short barrel load from my 4"
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 22,782 Senior Member
    knitepoet wrote: »
    Well, I just ordered a box. Will test it vs the golddot short barrel load from my 4"
    Ordered it where?
    I have a need for speed
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 16,829 Senior Member
    NN wrote: »
    Ordered it where?
    These were the only folks, that I could find, who had any in stock
    https://www.ableammo.com/catalog/federal-premium-personal-defense-handgun-ammunition-p38hst1s-special-hst-jhp-129-rdbx-p-153554.html
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • olesniperolesniper Senior Member Posts: 3,504 Senior Member
    knitepoet wrote: »

    Don't see a "+P" in there.
    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
    I will fear no evil: For I carry a .308 and not a .270
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 16,829 Senior Member
    olesniper wrote: »
    Don't see a "+P" in there.
    They may not list it in the description, but it's the exact same product number as the out of stock +Ps everywhere else
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 16,829 Senior Member
    They arrived today. They ARE marked +P and first impression is, that they're an updated, jacketed, HBWC loaded backwards.

    I can see myself loading one of my original Hydra-Shoks (A HBWC with a post) and comparing expansion and penetrations
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


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