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Thread: O'Reilly History

  1. #61
    Senior Member cpj's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Glen Beck is just as big of a D -Bag as Oreally. He was funny when he was strung out. Now, not so much.
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  2. #62
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    I know this is not exactly the same but David Letterman was doing several workers and admitted it and was a bigger star for it. My biggest concern about Oriely is he has been convicted in the press and is gone.

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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by kansashunter View Post
    I know this is not exactly the same but David Letterman was doing several workers and admitted it and was a bigger star for it. My biggest concern about Oriely is he has been convicted in the press and is gone.
    Exactly.

  4. #64
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Letterman wasn't accused of harassment so far as I know. He screwed around.

    My heart didn't bleed for O'Reilly after he paid out that first couple of million bucks for hush money. I consider that to be telling. Sarah Palin indicated in not so many words that the Corporate Upstairs at Fox needed to be cleaned out. When she was asked if she was harassed, what she didn't say was "No Way!' An interesting interview if you look it up, it's substantial.

    Roger Ailes got fired, Bill O'Rielly got fired for the same thing. Andrea Tantaros filed a suit against O'Reilly and maybe Fox and she'll probably win. Reading the petition sounds like something truthful and pretty awful.

    Some women don't let this bother them enough to file a lawsuit against a rich man, but some DO let this bother them to the point they want to sue. And they do. And apparently got paid $13M.

    O'Rielly is arrogant and a bully-boy, which doesn't make him more sympathetic.

    So far as I know, there's no crime here, unless it's a crime to pursue someone who doesn't want to see you. He won't get "convicted"; what he'll get is a loss of respect and probably a lack of income. His career is ruined unless he does something drastic to try to recover.
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  5. #65
    Senior Member Diver43's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    According to google, he is 69 years old and worth over 80 million. He will retire and be just fine.
    Don't know if he did anything wrong or not, his prior pay off makes it difficult to give him the benefit of the doubt.
    Last edited by Diver43; 04-22-2017 at 09:11 AM.
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  6. #66
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    The fact that there has been 13 million in hush money says worlds to me.

    I'm not giving better than 16% of my net worth to anybody without a damned good reason.

    You had a good run, Bill...now go away. Good riddance.
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by coolgunguy View Post
    The fact that there has been 13 million in hush money says worlds to me.

    I'm not giving better than 16% of my net worth to anybody without a damned good reason.

    You had a good run, Bill...now go away. Good riddance.
    Oh I'll bet this was not paid with his money. Both the network and himself must carry substantial insurance for just this type of issue...
    "Attack rapidly, ruthlessly, viciously, without rest, however tired and hungry you may be, the enemy will be more tired, more hungry. Keep punching." General George S. Patton

  8. #68
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by Wambli Ska View Post
    Oh I'll bet this was not paid with his money. Both the network and himself must carry substantial insurance for just this type of issue...
    You're likely correct, but that only means a change in percentage. Fox didn't let the face of the number one news show go for no reason. Sexual harassment is a serious claim that must be taken seriously, but you don't fire the top dog for merely being accused without cause. O'reilly is getting what he deserves and the fact that Fox dumped him this quickly and unceremoniously tells me they're not done shelling clams yet.
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by coolgunguy View Post
    You're likely correct, but that only means a change in percentage. Fox didn't let the face of the number one news show go for no reason. Sexual harassment is a serious claim that must be taken seriously, but you don't fire the top dog for merely being accused without cause. O'reilly is getting what he deserves and the fact that Fox dumped him this quickly and unceremoniously tells me they're not done shelling clams yet.
    Oh I agree. $13 Million, regardless of which pocket it comes from, is a LOT of hush money.
    "Attack rapidly, ruthlessly, viciously, without rest, however tired and hungry you may be, the enemy will be more tired, more hungry. Keep punching." General George S. Patton

  10. #70
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Don't care one way or another about O'Reilly except to say if he's guilty, good. If not, it's a shame.

    Here's what I'll say about women.

    As a criminal investigator in the Air Force, I investigated about 2 dozen rape allegations. Every one turned out to be an admitted "False Allegation." There are a lot of motivations for these allegations, and mentally unsound women are the greatest factor.

    Do women get raped? Yup. Do some lie about it? Yup. Do some not report it? Yup.

    In the 80s, OSI had a wonderful tool. A psychologically based check list that once completed by the victim, gave the investigator an nearly 100% reliable test as to the veracity of the complainant and the truth about the allegation. Once the victim was apprised of the inconsistencies and the questioning became a little more focused, the allegations fell apart in the vast majority of the cases. The alleged "Rape Culture" in the military does NOT exist.

    You can thank representative Pat Schroeder for making the military do away with this investigative tool.

    The closest I got to an actual rape case was an Army woman who claimed to have awakened from a drunken stupor with a man doing the nasty on her. When she told him to stop, he stopped! She told me, "He was kind of cute. If he'd have asked, I'd have let him." The Staff Judge Advocate declared, "I can't prosecute this!

    The rape culture in the military does NOT exist. Nor does it exist on college campuses. It's a fabrication of feminists and the media
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  11. #71
    Senior Member coolgunguy's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    I think that "rape culture" could often be exchanged for "after action regret culture". It's far easier to blame somebody else than to look inward for answers to questions the 'victim' would rather not ask. Society had become VERY interested in assigning victim status to nearly everybody and I think this might be one of the results.

    I don't believe this is the situation O'reilly finds himself in though. I have no evidence of this, call it a hunch.
    Tim Mason

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    Re: O'Reilly History

    I've worked plenty of rapes...not "maybe" rapes. And a couple of false claims. In today's world, you treat all claims as if they happened. Women who are legitimately raped are confused and terrorized and are unlikely to get the details correct at first. If the claim is false, this will come out in the investigation. But to start off questioning the victim is unlike almost any other crime investigation. For some reason men can't seem to get this. Robbery claims for example is almost never questioned.

    Which doesn't have anything to do with Bill O'Reilly. He wasn't accused of rape.
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  13. #73
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Which is why the checklist was never applied to cases unless there was a certain ambiguity involved. Whch is why I wrote, "Do women get raped? Yup. Do some lie about it? Yup. Do some not report it? Yup."

    My claim is, "There is no rape culture" in the US military or on college campuses. I put allegations of sexual harassment in a similar vein, only because it's so often a "he said" - "she said" situation.

    But for anyone to assume that an allegation is iron-clad, simply because the topic is sexual harassment or sexual assault and the victim is a woman, is foolish, and leads to unfair and unlawful victimization.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain

  14. #74
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gene L View Post
    I've worked plenty of rapes...not "maybe" rapes. And a couple of false claims. In today's world, you treat all claims as if they happened. Women who are legitimately raped are confused and terrorized and are unlikely to get the details correct at first. If the claim is false, this will come out in the investigation. But to start off questioning the victim is unlike almost any other crime investigation. For some reason men can't seem to get this. Robbery claims for example is almost never questioned.

    Which doesn't have anything to do with Bill O'Reilly. He wasn't accused of rape.
    The claims of 'sexual harassment' also were several, if not many years ago, so I don't agree with the "confused and terrorized" part of your explanation in O'Reilly's case.
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by Make_My_Day View Post
    The claims of 'sexual harassment' also were several, if not many years ago, so I don't agree with the "confused and terrorized" part of your explanation in O'Reilly's case.
    Read the last sentence in the post you referenced.
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  16. #76
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    At the same time, the unproved accusation of sexual harassment can be as damaging to a man's career, as the unproven or unsubstantiated accusation of rape, which happens all the time. So, while the two situations don't fit the same legal definition, they often result in the same non-legal punishment.
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Difference is rape leaves evidence. Sexual harassment generally does not, unless the woman makes records of how she was harassed.

    And given a $13M payoff, it seems to be pretty clear there is some evidence to suggest these women had the goods. Nobody in their right mind pays $13M based on unsubstantiated claims.
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  18. #78
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    So, you're saying that claims of sexual harassment are not evidence based, but that settling a claim is clear evidence of guilt? Just want clarification.

    Also, rape often leaves no more actual evidence, than a false claim of rape following a consensual encounter.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain

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    Re: O'Reilly History

    I'm not saying that at all...please show where I indicated that. If the women in question had recording, etc., that's plenty of evidence. And I'm betting they did.

    Evidence of rape isn't always only DNA, although that helps. There is a lot of violence in rape and that generally shows. At least in the cases I'm thinking of.
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  20. #80
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Yes. In actual rapes there is "often" great physical evidence of force. Not always. The "threat" of force can demand compliance. That's a rape. What evidence remains, except that which would also remain if the encounter was consensual? How is the truth determined, when the accuser and the accused have differing recollections of the event? Can you not see the need for a tool which would help the police determine if the allegation has significant holes in it? We can polygraph the accused if he is willing. What if - and I've seen it numerous times, no deception is indicated? We are forbidden from suggesting the accuser take a polygraph.

    Absent actual physical evidence of force, I think the accuser should be compelled to provide at least that amount of accommodation, particularly when a man's life and livelihood is on the table.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain

  21. #81
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    You're really hung up on women falsely reporting rape and sexual harassment, aren't you? So far as I know, there is no tool to determine truth, and any "holes" in the claim will come out in the investigation.

    I have seen far more truthful claims of rape than I've seen false. Sexual harassment? Never worked a case on that. If you start off with any preconceived notion of false reports, you can't exist in 2017. Got to act on the premises that women do NOT falsely report rape. Sexual harassment is different because it's based on a woman's perception of whether she's being harassed. The collection of evidence is far different.
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  22. #82
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    I'm not "hung up" on anything, except the notion that false rape allegations don't exist and that in many cases there is no "allowable" tool to help to determine the veracity of the allegation. In two cases I worked, it's likely a man would have gone to jail, if the woman hadn't recanted. Yet, any suggestion that the allegation has to be true because a woman's word cannot be questioned in the case of a rape allegation has undoubtedly put many men behind bars. Just as false confessions have led to many improper convictions. There is way too much evidence of this to suggest that one cannot be compelled to confess, or that police malfeasance hasn't led to wrongly convicted persons. Particularly African American men accused of raping white women back in the day.

    A young man in St. Louis "confessed" to a rape/murder and the cops were mightily embarrassed when he recanted his confession and a proper police investigation actually caught the actual perpetrators.

    When it is suggested that there are certain classes of people we cannot question, then there will be no need for investigations.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain

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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Well, I think you're hung up. Perhaps for personal reasons on what you saw some time ago.

    All allegations (not just rape) must be treated as true until investigation proves otherwise. Man or woman. No one gets charged on allegations alone, that I know of. Not only is there no "allowable" tool to determine if a woman is lying, there is NO tool at all to determine truth...truth comes out of investigation. The assumption is that a woman won't falsely report a felony since they can be charged, and if the investigative time devoted to investigating the crime is a lot, they probably will be.

    I don't know how long it's been since you investigated rapes (or claims of rapes) but I suggests times and techniques may have changed.
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  24. #84
    Senior Member DanChamberlain's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    I retired in 97. At the time, if an allegation was proven false, the woman was not charged. It was felt that this would send a signal to other women who might not report actual rapes.

    And if you think I'm hung up, well schit...that's all that matters.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain

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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Dan, we're a couple of oldfart cops who have seen better days and a lot of changes in our lifetimes. I retired in 2009 and I'm not up to date by a long shot in modern police work.

    Do I think O'Reilly sexually harassed women? Yes. Do I think the proof is out there? Yes, but the victims who settled have signed an agreement not to reveal BO's statements as to culpability.

    Sexual Harassment without actual contact is, as you know, not a crime but a tort. And it's cost Fox and O'Reilly a lot of money to buy silence.
    Last edited by Gene L; 04-23-2017 at 09:33 PM.
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  26. #86
    Senior Member Make_My_Day's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gene L View Post
    Read the last sentence in the post you referenced.
    OK, point made. I just thought you were applying that line of thinking to O'Reillys complainants as well.
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  27. #87
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by 6EQUJ5 - WOW! View Post
    From my understanding she stated that she was (gasps) pro-choice.
    Nope, she is pro choice, but she called her employer, her company, her boss and all of her coworkers hypocrites because they have a different opinion on national TV, then doubled down. Which is why she is unemployed.
    Last edited by Varmintmist; 04-24-2017 at 07:35 PM.
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  28. #88
    Senior Member Varmintmist's Avatar
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gene L View Post
    Letterman wasn't accused of harassment so far as I know. He screwed around.

    My heart didn't bleed for O'Reilly after he paid out that first couple of million bucks for hush money. I consider that to be telling.
    Its not hush money, its "Taking this in front of a jury of people who cant get out of jury duty, pitting a evil corp. against this pretty little blonde lady, is going to cost us 10X the cost of buying these people off." money.

    I have seen it happen. Pretty blonde person drives up to a DRIVE UP payphone that was required to be there, at that height with the type of cord on it by the govt. park where it was at and the ADA. Person hangs up phone, backs out with cord wrapped around hand. Loses her hand. Gets a settlement from the company NOT because there was any fault on the part of the company, but because the "rich guy" is at fault or if not, the jury FEELS that they should pay the poor (whomever) because they have money.

    I think it would be a good estimation that 80% of these are for the payday only.
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    Re: O'Reilly History

    Obviously, they didn't sue for free. Not much of a point in a tort otherwise.
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  30. #90
    Senior Member Dr. db's Avatar
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    Interesting point I heard the other day: None of the women could muster the fortitude to say, "Bill! Knock this s@&) off! I don't like it! I won't put up with it!! I will sue if you don't stop!" Obviously the American feminist movement still has work to do.

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