Page 1 of 6 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 158

Thread: Let's talk about dreamers

  1. #1
    Senior Member alphasigmookie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Arlington, VA
    Posts
    7,694

    Let's talk about dreamers

    There has been a lot said about "dreamers" lately, but how about some of us try to out ourselves in their shoes. Yes they were brought here Illegally by their parents as children. They have now spent the vast majority of their lifetimes that they can rember here. They have gone through school here, learned the language and many have graduated from high school or even college and they're working here. Some may not have ever learned their native language or at least not well. Most probably barely remember wherever they're from (not all Mexican btw). Now we want to pick them up and plop them back where they're from?

    Imagine if the government had come to you in your teens or early 20's and said, I'm sorry you're no longer welcome in the place you've spent almost your entire life and dropped you in the country where your ancestors were from and you could never come back. Everything from the life you had built here gone forever. How disorienting would that be? How unfair would that feel. I'm sorry I'm not ok with doing that to people even if their parents did commit a crime. I'm not ok with punishing people for the crimes of their parents.

    Deport the parents sure. If the kids are still minors I'd maybe even be ok with sending them back too. But if you've been here most of your life and this country is all you know and you're now and adult, leave them alone. Commit a felony sure send them back, sorry you lost your chance, but everyone else, we've got way bigger problems to deal with.
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho

  2. #2
    Senior Member Teach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Dellrose TN
    Posts
    17,691

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I'm serious about sending them all to California. Governor Moonbeam will welcome them with open arms, and the rest of the country won't have to deal with them. 8 million more parasites on the already overstressed Commiefornia welfare system ought to just about torpedo the whole state.
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite

  3. #3
    Senior Member knitepoet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    16,105

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Cry me a freakin' river.

    Sounds about like someone breaking in MY HOUSE, and bringing their kid along... and since they got caught, I have to raise the kid. Then since the kid can't be separated from their parent, I have to left the freakin' burglar move in too.

    Call me a cold hearted.... I don't care...

    ROUND 'EM UP and HEAD 'EM OUT!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by Seven habits of highly effective pirates
    Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.

  4. #4
    Senior Member early's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Thornton CO
    Posts
    4,871

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I don't personally know any. That makes their situation and circumstances surreal to me.

    I'm am however inclined to believe that any negative consequences their presence here is causing genuine citizens has been greatly exaggerated. I also am inclined to believe that the focused disparagement of groups of people is generaly for purposes of international deceit.

  5. #5
    Moderator Jayhawker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Manistee Natl Forest
    Posts
    13,204

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Simple solution for them....enlist in the armed forces, serve 4 years honorably and you are granted citizenship.....easy peasy....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Eupora, MS
    Posts
    1,294

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Are these "dreamers" able to just go to the nearest federal courthouse and begin the citizenship process without any repercussions? If not, then I think they should be able to. Not a shortened process. But.let them go through the same process a legal alien has to.go through.

  7. #7
    Senior Member NN's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    22,098

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawker View Post
    Simple solution for them....enlist in the armed forces, serve 4 years honorably and you are granted citizenship.....easy peasy....
    They cannot enlist because they are here illegally-----it would be a fraudulent enlistment.

    They have to go back where they came from, enter the US legally; then they can enlist.
    I turned in the key to the can of worms
    They just issued me a new key

  8. #8
    Senior Member NN's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    22,098

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by RugerFan View Post
    Are these "dreamers" able to just go to the nearest federal courthouse and begin the citizenship process without any repercussions? If not, then I think they should be able to. Not a shortened process. But.let them go through the same process a legal alien has to.go through.
    No, under present law
    I turned in the key to the can of worms
    They just issued me a new key

  9. #9
    Senior Member tennmike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Under a log
    Posts
    20,605

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    A lot of those so called 'Dreamers' are in their mid 40's. And a LOT of them are in gangs like MS13 and other drug gangs. Children, my shiny hiney! Send them ALL home post haste, and their several millions of illegal alien parents and relatives with them. This is a nation of laws. The laws apply to ALL or they apply to NO ONE. They've been educated on our dime, been on the dole, on our dime, and proudly fly that Mexican flag any chance they get and talk smack about the U.S. Let their U.S. educated butts GO BACK TO MEXICO and make Mexico great. If they want U.S. citizenship then they can apply through the proper channels AND GET THE HELL TO THE BACK OF THE LINE! There are a lot ahead of them that are applying the legal way, and those people don't need to be punished by having these Johnny Come Lately folk jump queue in front of them.

    We owe them nothing. They came here illegally, and that is breaking U.S. law. There has to be consequences for that. Even if they were brought here as children, they are still here illegally. They broke the law. When we start rewarding people for breaking the law then the law is as worthless as the paper on which it is printed.
    Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass.Mark Twain - Notebook, 1898
    Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no influence in society. --Mark Twain

  10. #10
    Senior Member Teach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Dellrose TN
    Posts
    17,691

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by early View Post
    I don't personally know any. That makes their situation and circumstances surreal to me.
    I do- - - - - -as a public school teacher for close to three decades I had the opportunity to interact with hundreds of them. The illegal kids were easy to spot- - - - -a bogus social security number beginning with "000" (assigned by the school system, not the US government, for record-keeping), plus virtually no understanding of the English language beyond rudimentary conversational ability and virtually no reading comprehension made them stand out like a polar bear in a coal pile. Keeping accurate records, with a mandatory 80% "pass" rate was important, so federal subsidy funds could be collected. For every overachiever the hand-wringers like to trot out for their 15 minutes of fame, there's a few dozen who ride the welfare system for all it's worth, commit petty crimes, sell drugs, or affiliate with various Hispanic gangs. "Dreamers" my rosy red anal vent- - - -more like "Nightmares"!
    Jerry
    Last edited by Teach; 01-23-2018 at 04:44 AM.
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    655

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I already e-mailed the White House about what to do, they can stay but no citizenship, make them permanent resident aliens, give them a "green" card (it's not green anymore), no citizenship but they can apply for citizenship after they meet the requirements.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Fisheadgib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    crusted in sand
    Posts
    4,810

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by knitepoet View Post
    Cry me a freakin' river.

    Sounds about like someone breaking in MY HOUSE, and bringing their kid along... and since they got caught, I have to raise the kid. Then since the kid can't be separated from their parent, I have to left the freakin' burglar move in too.
    I gotta agree with Paul. As I pointed out in a previous thread, the averages age of these "dreamers" is 26 and at that age, they have got to know that they are here illegally and they could take steps to make their presence legal but choose not to because they think that their presence could some day be legitimized without having to go through the same procedure that MILLIONS of other immigrants had to go through.
    Quote Originally Posted by snake284 View Post
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .

  13. #13
    Moderator Jayhawker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Manistee Natl Forest
    Posts
    13,204

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by NN View Post
    They cannot enlist because they are here illegally-----it would be a fraudulent enlistment.

    They have to go back where they came from, enter the US legally; then they can enlist.
    Not the case....there are "dreamers" who are currently serving and others who are veterans....no rules against non-citizen serving.....
    The military evens assists them with filing for citizenship....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"

  14. #14
    Senior Member early's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Thornton CO
    Posts
    4,871

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Teach View Post
    I do- - - - - -as a public school teacher for close to three decades I had the opportunity to interact with hundreds of them. The illegal kids were easy to spot- - - - -a bogus social security number beginning with "000" (assigned by the school system, not the US government, for record-keeping), plus virtually no understanding of the English language beyond rudimentary conversational ability and virtually no reading comprehension made them stand out like a polar bear in a coal pile. Keeping accurate records, with a mandatory 80% "pass" rate was important, so federal subsidy funds could be collected. For every overachiever the hand-wringers like to trot out for their 15 minutes of fame, there's a few dozen who ride the welfare system for all it's worth, commit petty crimes, sell drugs, or affiliate with various Hispanic gangs. "Dreamers" my rosy red anal vent- - - -more like "Nightmares"!
    Jerry
    This is at least a real account of someone's personal experience with them. It would be good to hear more from teachers and administraters in the public school system. Especially here in the Denver area.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.

  15. #15
    Senior Member CHIRO1989's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Central MN
    Posts
    9,175

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    How many have applied for citizenship since DACA was enacted?
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I am not going to go into the nitty gritty details, but if they have served honorably in our military... hell yea, make them citizens. They earned it. Anyone else? I am not sure, but many probably would be a net asset to our country. As has been said above, many aren't. I am not too hip on this whole citizenship for everyone thing. Most are here (legally and illegally) for economic reasons, not for love of our country. Some are an asset to our country for economic reasons. I am cool with an expanded guest worker program and more permanent resident aliens in a way that would be in line with reality. There is no need to pass out citizenship like candy.

    Making laws that we can't (or won't) enforce seems to be what we got going on now, and is undermining our country.

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by CHIRO1989 View Post
    How many have applied for citizenship since DACA was enacted?
    In all fairness, the Feds can't even run a damn VA hospital... I doubt they would be easy to deal with on citizenship and immigration.

  18. #18
    Senior Member CHIRO1989's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Central MN
    Posts
    9,175

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermanator View Post
    In all fairness, the Feds can't even run a damn VA hospital... I doubt they would be easy to deal with on citizenship and immigration.
    Alpha wanted to talk about it, they(illegals) all seem to know DACA had them covered, I am interested in how many used this new found time to make things right and how many are crying because they are back to square one because they didn't when they(illegals) could've/should've/would've when the had the chance.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I got you. I am just mentioning that even if they had a chance, it may not have been all that easy and maybe impossible (or next to impossible). But I am speculating. I just don't know.

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    North Dakota
    Posts
    1,772

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I know a girl in Tehachapi that was brought into the US by her parents at 6 years old. When she turned 18 she started working with a lawyer to get her citizenship, when she turned 25 she swore in as a legal citizen.
    It can be done if they have the tenacity to actually do it.

  21. #21
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    And maybe not all of them want to be citizens, maybe they are only looking for legal status.

  22. #22
    Senior Member CHIRO1989's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Central MN
    Posts
    9,175

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    I want to add that I realize that DACA was not a path to citizenship.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11

  23. #23
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    The whole question of citizenship thing is letting Democrats frame the conversation on their terms. They seem to want to make everyone a new citizen/Dem voter. They act like citizenship is the only way to legal status because they are looking out for what is best for their party. We need to be thinking about what is best for our country. We already plowed a ton of money into education and maybe social services into these kids. Are they an asset or a liability? If they are an asset, do we really want to send them to Mexico?

  24. #24
    Senior Member early's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Thornton CO
    Posts
    4,871

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    That they're being used as a voting block or vilified to patronize another voting block was my initial impression. Such a perspective offers me no view as to who these people actually are.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.

  25. #25
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by early View Post
    That they're being used as a voting block or vilified to patronize another voting block was my initial impression. Such a perspective offers me no view as to who these people actually are.
    Agreed. I am sure Woodsrunner's point of view would differ greatly from some of the perspectives given here so far. Personally? I am just as clueless as you are. I have no idea.

  26. #26
    Senior Member Fisheadgib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    crusted in sand
    Posts
    4,810

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermanator View Post
    . We need to be thinking about what is best for our country. We already plowed a ton of money into education and maybe social services into these kids. Are they an asset or a liability? If they are an asset, do we really want to send them to Mexico?
    Their willingness to go through the steps to become a legal citizen should determine weather they are an asset.
    Quote Originally Posted by snake284 View Post
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .

  27. #27
    Senior Member Fisheadgib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    crusted in sand
    Posts
    4,810

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermanator View Post
    Agreed. I am sure Woodsrunner's point of view would differ greatly from some of the perspectives given here so far. Personally? I am just as clueless as you are. I have no idea.
    I'm curious as to why you would say this.
    Quote Originally Posted by snake284 View Post
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .

  28. #28
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisheadgib View Post
    Their willingness to go through the steps to become a legal citizen should determine weather they are an asset.
    Even a dirtbag can apply for citizenship. Besides, I am personally not too hip on the idea of a bunch of new citizens.

  29. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisheadgib View Post
    I'm curious as to why you would say this.
    Because he has spoken for Dreamers on this forum in the past. Back then, I even poo-pooed him.

  30. #30
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    13,331

    Re: Let's talk about dreamers

    Ok, not Dreamers. Actually anchor babies getting their mothers deported...

    http://forums.gunsandammo.com/showth...hlight=illegal

    My bad.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •