Banned Christmas trees

[Big Chief]

So why are Bibles still used in courtrooms. And why is "The whole truth, nothing but the truth...so help you God.........." used? True, you can opt out of using it, but isn't that a gross "Abuse" of the Church/State separation , the 1st Amendment ............

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separat..._United_States

"The First Amendment to the United States Constitution provides that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof ...." and Article VI specifies that "no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States." The modern concept of a wholly secular government is sometimes credited to the writings of English philosopher John Locke, but the phrase "separation of church and state" in this context is generally traced to a January 1, 1802 letter by Thomas Jefferson, addressed to the Danbury Baptist Association in Connecticut, and published in a Massachusetts newspaper. Echoing the language of the founder of the first Baptist church in America, Roger Williams—who had written in 1644 of "[A] hedge or wall of separation between the garden of the church and the wilderness of the world"— Jefferson wrote, "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."[1]

However, the Court has not always interpreted the constitutional principle as absolute, and the proper extent of separation between government and religion in the U.S. remains an ongoing subject of impassioned debate.[3][4][5][6]"

[mkk41]

So how does the alledged seperation of church and state relate to the tax-exempt status anything that passes itself off as a church , from property taxes on a shack in the woods , to sprawling multi-acre estates/mansions , to mega-millionaire televanglists?

And why do such obviously 'for profit' churches still get such exemption.

[KSU Firefighter]

I think what a lot of people tend to forget about 1-A is the Constitution was written in a time after we broke away from jolly ole England and fought for Independence. We still had that Church of England and Monarchy thing in our minds. That's why good ole America doesn't have an Official Religion, just like we don't have an Official Language.

If you want to say it's a communist/socialist plot......well even the NAZI's celebrated Christmas....took leave and decorated for the season, and plain Wehrmacht soldiers sang "O Tannenbaum" in their foxholes.

If the cry-babies don't want decorations on government bldgs......then let's go all the way and keep everything open on the 24-25th.....government, banks, grocery and department stores....etc.....no day off for ANYBODY!

How well would THAT go over eh?

I will be working on the 25th, and we do have a tree decorated in the station, ( that I bought at the big yard sale held in my zone every year). Every single complainer about said tree has been invited to bring in their own "holiday" display,( Ramadan, Hannukah etc.) so far, no takers. I think most that complain about the trees are just looking for an easy way to start an argument. As long as the lady with the nineteen grandkids can have their pictures plastered all over her cubicle, I can have my "decorations" too.

[breamfisher]

I've heard of schools having "holiday trees" where kids decorate it with their own religious/cultural decorations. And the tree's usually provided by the teacher.

By the way, I wonder if most folks know of the Druidic symbolism of the Christmas tree, and how it in some ways represents both sacrifices and accepting blessings from the spirit of the evergreen...

[grunt69]

lol
this thread just reminded me its time to put my tree up
thanks

[JasonMPD]

It does seem rather odd that a pagan winter solstice holiday that was adopted by Christians is now under fire from atheists. Whatever. I will let them go and fight it out amongst themselves while I do my best to enjoy the season.

I'm late on this thread, but agreed.

Christian celebration of the birth of Christ had nothing to do with evergreen trees or a jolly fat man in a red costume beinging gifts to people. It was originally a pagan celebration, specifically Norse and Germanic, and was not adopted in to Christian celebration until after that fact--long after. In fact, the Bible mentions no celebrations of the birth of anyone, including Jesus.

"Christmas", or the original Celebration of Yule (Norse celebration) was the celebration of the prosperity to come in the spring and that is why they brought an evergreen in to their homes: to remind them of greener times to come in Spring.

It's very Christian to assume it all began and ended with Christianity. But, if you believe in a book of circular logic and repeat contradictions...

[tennmike]

I think what a lot of people tend to forget about 1-A is the Constitution was written in a time after we broke away from jolly ole England and fought for Independence. We still had that Church of England and Monarchy thing in our minds. That's why good ole America doesn't have an Official Religion, just like we don't have an Official Language.

If you want to say it's a communist/socialist plot......well even the NAZI's celebrated Christmas....took leave and decorated for the season, and plain Wehrmacht soldiers sang "O Tannenbaum" in their foxholes.

If the cry-babies don't want decorations on government bldgs......then let's go all the way and keep everything open on the 24-25th.....government, banks, grocery and department stores....etc.....no day off for ANYBODY!

How well would THAT go over eh?

Hmmmm..............About working on Christmas day, and Thanksgiving, too.............At the nuke plant when we were on 8 hour rotating shifts if I was on midnight shift Thanksgiving or Christmas day I knew with certainty I'd be pulling a double shift. Lots of people called in 'sick' if they couldn't get vacation time. Actually, any shift I worked on those two holidays was a guaranteed double shift. A couple of years I ended up doing 24 hours straight before NRC cracked down on hours worked ; but since the next shift after that was mine, I got 8 hours off at double time, and some other victim got to pull a double.

Lots of folks work the holidays to keep the lights on, the water flowing out the faucets, and keeping the peace, and the airlines are still flying everywhere, and buses running, taxis, and lots and lots of other people are 'making their eight' at some job that has to be done. And the military is still doing their thing on land, in the air, and at sea. People forget about those folks.

[mkk41]

Hanukkah = festival of lights.

Christmas trees get covered with lights.


Hmmmmmmmm?????????


Have a pleasant non-denominational day of celebration off from work with pay!

[ghostsniper1]

So how does the alledged seperation of church and state relate to the tax-exempt status anything that passes itself off as a church , from property taxes on a shack in the woods , to sprawling multi-acre estates/mansions , to mega-millionaire televanglists?

And why do such obviously 'for profit' churches still get such exemption.

Hmmm. Good point. Being that I'm registered in my county as Ordained, it's time I label my household as a church and congregation. Bye bye property tax lol.

[mkk41]

Hmmm. Good point. Being that I'm registered in my county as Ordained, it's time I label my household as a church and congregation. Bye bye property tax lol.

Fred Sanford did it with his Church of Junkism.

Al Bundy did it with his Church of No Maam!

[Big Chief]

I got their "Happy Holidays" swingin.........

Y'all can celebrate/worship or not any way you choose as long as it doesn't hurt or impose hardship on others. I'll defend that right.