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What do YOU feel is the most important aspect of CCW

JayhawkerJayhawker ModeratorPosts: 16,928 Senior Member
I'll weigh in with my thoughts later...

What do YOU feel is the most important aspect of CCW 57 votes

The Firearm
1% 1 vote
Weapons Skills
15% 9 votes
The will to use it
82% 47 votes
Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
«1

Replies

  • bobbyrlf3bobbyrlf3 Senior Member Posts: 2,543 Senior Member
    As has been said here before, having a gun does not make you armed. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who, when asked, would tell a person new to carrying concealed that if you can't bring yourself to point the gun at another human being and take the shot, and possibly their life, having the gun is useless if not more dangerous.
    Knowledge is essential to living freely and fully; understanding gives knowledge purpose and strength; wisdom is combining the two and applying them appropriately in words and actions.
  • wddodgewddodge Senior Member Posts: 1,094 Senior Member
    My first choice wasn't an option. " The intelligence to not put yourself in a position to have to use your weapon."

    I really feel the absolute best defense in the grey matter between your ears. I understand there are some unavoidable situations but 99.9% can be avoided. Yes, I made that percentage up myself using my opinionated grey matter.

    Denny
    Participating in a gun buy back program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids.... Clint Eastwood
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,503 Senior Member
    The preparedness/awareness of ones mind to respond to the situation and not react, and then the training to be to the level where what you do is natural.
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,497 Senior Member
    I replied with "will" because its closest to (and a component of) what I think is most important: mindset. Without mindset, training is moot, as is the firearm. Improper mindset, and you could be standing beside a howitzer and you won't act.

    Mindset can also keep you OUT of needing to use your CCW.

    To me, CCW is like a lifejacket. I always have one when I'm on the boat, and I wear it. However, I do my darndest to make sure the lifejacket is worn but never used.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    All of the above, first, have a gun.
    You really need to know how to use it of course, hence the reason to be a training hog, and the fact when a LE org is footing the bill, even better.

    The gun, I prefer a LE standard, Glock or 1911, something of quality.

    The will to use it, sound judgement, safety etc....
    I try very hard to stay out of situations and places where I might run into trouble makers, drunks etc, the wrong side of the tracks......
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • BPsniperBPsniper Banned Posts: 1,961 Senior Member
    DoctorWho wrote: »
    All of the above, first, have a gun.

    I can defend myself without a gun. But even with a gun, I can't do squat without the will and determination to do something with it.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,928 Senior Member
    When all the evading, avoiding and sidestepping trouble is over and your best efforts to avoid the situation have failed...you must have the mindset to fight back.

    "Having a gun" without the will to use it? May as well be standing there with a daffodil in your hand. It comes to a point where hesitation will kill you as surely as a bullet.

    This thread came from yet another encounter with an individual who believes "I'll just use it to scare them off."
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • NCFUBARNCFUBAR Senior Member Posts: 4,324 Senior Member
    The wise men have said it above ... "WILL" ... without it no matter how good you are or what you are carrying ain't going to do jack.
    “The further a society drifts from truth ... the more it will hate those who speak it."
    - George Orwell
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,403 Senior Member
    Training is important. Familiarization with the weapon, and skill in using it is important. Being able to recognize and avoid bad situations is also a handy skill; avoid conflict if possible, but be ready to defend your life and those of your family. But most important is the will to use it without hesitation if the situation requires it.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member Posts: 5,797 Senior Member
    Relating to self defense, I consider "the will to use it" as part of weapons skills.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    "The .22 in your pocket is worth more than the .45 at home!" Being ABLE to defend yourself is important, whether it's with your hands, a baseball bat, or a gun. Being WILLING to do so is a far more important factor. Most of the training academies such as Gunsite, etc. spend a lot of time on situational awareness and "combat mindset", the focus on being willing and ready to do whatever is necessary to survive a confrontation. Being alive to participate in the "due process of law" part of the situation is of primary importance. Nobody gets a chance to climb out of the graveyard for a do-over!
    Jerry
  • BPsniperBPsniper Banned Posts: 1,961 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Nobody gets a chance to climb out of the graveyard for a do-over!Jerry
    I like that. Well put.
  • beartrackerbeartracker Senior Member Posts: 3,116 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    When all the evading, avoiding and sidestepping trouble is over and your best efforts to avoid the situation have failed...you must have the mindset to fight back.

    "Having a gun" without the will to use it? May as well be standing there with a daffodil in your hand. It comes to a point where hesitation will kill you as surely as a bullet.

    This thread came from yet another encounter with an individual who believes "I'll just use it to scare them off."

    + ONE!!!!!
  • beartrackerbeartracker Senior Member Posts: 3,116 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Being alive to participate in the "due process of law" part of the situation is of primary importance. Nobody gets a chance to climb out of the graveyard for a do-over!
    Jerry

    + ONE!!!!
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    BPsniper wrote: »
    I can defend myself without a gun. But even with a gun, I can't do squat without the will and determination to do something with it.




    Per-freakin-zactly!!!!
  • gunrunner428gunrunner428 Senior Member Posts: 1,018 Senior Member
    Like any other skill, the equipment is the last piece of the puzzle. You have to WANT to be able to use it effectively, otherwise the purchase of the gun is not thought about properly and you become complacent in keeping your skills sharp.

    Might not be completely on-topic, but I remember my grandmother and driving. Grandpa had the license, bought the car, maintained it, and she never thought twice about it - she didn't want to drive, so she never learned how to drive, and her household never owned a car for her to drive. First piece of that puzzle would have been for her to want to be able to drive, otherwise any trips to the licensing office, any study or testing materials, making an extra key for her for the car, would all have been pointless.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Perhaps that is not such a good example.
    There have been way too many folks that have saved their lives with a firearm with little to no training, which I do not advise in any way shape or form, but it has been done, successfully.

    Edited to add, You need a drivers license, written and skill test, car, insurance,
    Some folks just buy a handgun and keep it in the sock drawer.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • gunrunner428gunrunner428 Senior Member Posts: 1,018 Senior Member
    DoctorWho wrote: »
    Perhaps that is not such a good example.
    There have been way too many folks that have saved their lives with a firearm with little to no training, which I do not advise in any way shape or form, but it has been done, successfully.

    Edited to add, You need a drivers license, written and skill test, car, insurance,
    Some folks just buy a handgun and keep it in the sock drawer.

    I'll give you that "the first rule of gunfighting is have a gun." The mere presence of a gun in a life-threatening situation can make worlds of difference. However, if I were a bad guy, I'd be much more afraid of a well-worn firearm in steady hands than a shiny-new, or heavily-greased "last-ditch" piece held in shaky, unsure hands.

    There is no concrete answer here. The three elements of the poll - the gun, the training, and the will to use it - are all elements of the same puzzle. The question is asking which of the three is considered most important. And there opinions will definitely vary.

    Is my Savage 24-S .20 gauge/.22 LR combo (heirloomed through me by my father expressly to go one day to my oldest daughter) an ideal home-defense weapon? Oh, heck no. Would it do the job in determined hands, in the absence of a more "serious" firearm? You betcha.

    The process needs to start with a determination to do what you must to protect yourself and those you love. Intelligent, well-informed selection of the equipmemt to do so branches off of this, followed by getting educated and practiced with the gun to reliably use it when the pucker factor sets in. Three sides of the same coin, if a coin had three sides!
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    I have seen a few accounts in the news, various States where a twelve y/o female was able to fend off three home invaders, with a .22 LR youth model rifle (pink in one case ?) who knows what would have happened otherwise.

    Also I would not think that under a bed or mattress is a great place to store a gun however how many elderly woman have saved themselves from harm / rape / endangerment by shooting at their attackers sometimes injuring even killing them ?

    Look at Dan Johnson's thread on the Baby Browning .25 acp how much training did She have ?

    "The question is asking which of the three is considered most important. And there opinions will definitely vary."

    That is where I fall back on what I learned as a LEO, My opinions are nothing compared to what I learned as a LEO the hard and painful way.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • gunrunner428gunrunner428 Senior Member Posts: 1,018 Senior Member
    And in your examples, Doc, the WILL TO USE THE GUN, to all appearances, seems to have been the deciding factor, much more than the hardware or overall intensive training. Which accounts for the way I voted...
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,973 Senior Member
    The will to use it. This includes everything from a roll of quarters in your pocket, a knife or a gun. Fight or flee, and flee should be at the top of the list if it means being unharmed. Knowing that you must act at the appropriate time can be a tough decision.

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    I do not like to consider fleeing so much as a top option, because at least in My experience fleeing has sometimes been impossible.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • bowserbbowserb Member Posts: 277 Member
    Here's one nobody has mentioned as an imported aspect of CCW: a big pile of money or some kind of legal insurance plan. A LEO who uses his gun has the resources of his agency/government behind him. We citizens are a different story. From my reading, I would say the negative implications of having shot or killed someone, no matter how big a threat he might have been to yourself, your family, or your property, make using a gun an absolute last resort. Even here in Texas!

    I would be happy to hear from anyone here who has one of those legal expense plans for concealed carry holders, and it would be really nice to hear from someone who has had the plan deliver what it promises.
    "We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history." - Ayn Rand
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,928 Senior Member
    Most of us are well aware of the negative implications of a self-defense shooting.

    Depending on where you live you have a lot less to worry about than you ever did.

    In some states;

    A person who uses a firearm in self defense cannot be civilly sued as a result of the shooting.
    If the person IS prosecuted for whatever reason and it is determined to be a legal shooting, the State is liable for reimbursing the defendants legal costs.

    Anyone who carries a firearm for self defense should thoroughly understand their particular states (and states in which they travel) Self-Defense Act.

    When my life or the lives of my loved ones is threatened, the status of my bank account is the very last thing on my mind. I've been broke before and strange as it may seem, survived it.
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • bowserbbowserb Member Posts: 277 Member
    I meant no offense with my comment; rather I wondered if anyone had bought insurance or prepaid legal for concealed carry. In my research, I have found more that look like scams than look legit. One possible exception might be the "NRA-endorsed" insurance plan. It looks legitimate, but at the same time, the details are so legaleze that I think I need to hire a lawyer to interpret. Indeed, one of the exclusions seems to be of the very situation for which you would buy the insurance!

    BTW, for the small minority who haven't seriously considered the legal implications of discharging their guns, here is an excellent article by a former police officer, consultant, and concealed carry instructor. http://www.stoppingpower.net/commentary/comm_dangers_in_intervention.asp

    I noted the serious side of concealed carry, because I think there may be some who don't fully appreciate what can happen. I saw one thread on a forum not to be named, where there were already over 100 pages, over 1200 replies, to a message asking, "Show us pictures of your [so and so gun]." Really? Show me pictures of your concealed carry insurance policy!
    "We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history." - Ayn Rand
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    I am not really going to worry about any legal battles, if I survive another personal defense encounter, I will consider Myself lucky (again) and consider that better than half the battle is won.

    I know if I shoot someone, it will not be a grey area, it will be clear cut case of personal defense.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • bowserbbowserb Member Posts: 277 Member
    Anyone know this one? Heard about it in a podcast by Tom Gresham at last year's NRA convention.
    http://armedcitizensnetwork.org/
    "We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history." - Ayn Rand
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,928 Senior Member
    What I would REALLY like, is a listing of lawyers nation-wide, that specialize in defending self-defense cases.
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • bowserbbowserb Member Posts: 277 Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    What I would REALLY like, is a listing of lawyers nation-wide, that specialize in defending self-defense cases.
    Agree. Add a legal expense insurance plan, and my stress level will drop significantly.
    "We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history." - Ayn Rand
  • temmitemmi Member Posts: 230 Member
    I view the will and the skills together.


    If you have the skills you have the will....
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