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Why dont us military use glocks?

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Replies

  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    killpilla wrote: »
    So perhaps they could do a gen 5 with a grip safety. That would keep from changing the desing to much and that comfort to those who need it. Dont get me wrong, I'm not a 'Live by the Glock, Die by the Glock' guy. Just simply curious cause they say "Glock perfection" yet our soldiers dont use it, but I have had allot of great answers here and thank you all!

    That's been accomplished my friend......it's called the H2000......or Springfield XD. It's a Glock for wussies that can't be safe with their own pistols, but also caters to the 1911 crowd that can't get over the Glock grip angle, yet shoot Ruger MKII pistols....hippocracy at it's finest.
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    The military doesn't use Glocks precisely because they aren't so good. Frankly I don't know why anybody uses Glocks. Everybody who does, from all the police departments to all the civilians, are wrong. And no, I don't want to hear their side of it. The "safe action" is a dangerous joke, the market is flooded with guns that are just as reliable, durable, accurate and competitively priced as Glocks - and are also a helluva lot safer. The idea of locating the only external safety in the middle of the freaking trigger (!!!) is an accident waiting to happen. Autoloading pistols, except DAO models with long, heavy, revolver-like trigger pulls, should have a true safety that, when engaged, completely disables the weapon. Especially if the trigger is pulled. DUH!

    Holy crap, I'm glad I read this! I just thru my Kahr PM9 in the trash can. I don't know I managed to carry it every day for 7+ years without shooting myself. It has NO external safety AT ALL!!
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,244 Senior Member
    I was thinking the same thing. If my Glock ain't so good, my Kahrs are probably total junk.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,447 Senior Member
    It's funny, but I absolutely dislike external safeties (thumb/grip) on handguns. In my opinion, no handgun should have a safety on it except single actions like the 1911 and Hi Power et al in order to carry cocked and locked. Even at that, I do not like a grip safety.

    Heck, I don't even use the safety on bolt guns!

    But, what do I know? I'm an accident waiting to happen. :-)
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,871 Senior Member
    It's people like you that set stuff on fire with smoke grenades...
    I'm just here for snark.
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    But, what do I know? I'm an accident waiting to happen. :-)

    waiting for that.....should be a good one! :popcorn:
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,447 Senior Member
    Case in point. Oh, and it's NFDDs. Not smoke grenades.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,871 Senior Member
    I'm thinking of a different incident.
    I'm just here for snark.
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    "launch the LMFOPs....SOMEONE will get confused here!".....LMFAO!
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • RazorbackerRazorbacker Senior Member Posts: 4,646 Senior Member

    That was great. Had a friend shot down in a Blackhawk in Somalia.
    Teach your children to love guns, they'll never be able to afford drugs
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,244 Senior Member
    Glocks can't be that unsafe... They can't even light a shirt on fire if they tried.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    but there is skin damage from the ported ones.....
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,447 Senior Member
    You guys just don't appreciate science.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • JayJay Senior Member Posts: 4,348 Senior Member
    You're Bill Nye's cooler brother.....
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    You guys just don't appreciate science.

    Science is cool when something starts on fire....you just fragged your own six-pack.....my hats off to you for that experiment.....nut-ball! :tooth:
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • JLDickmonJLDickmon Senior Member Posts: 1,726 Senior Member
    Or you could just learn to keep the booger-picker off the bang switch.

    I think the idea is, keeping someone ELSE's booger-picker off YOUR bang switch.
    Never laugh at your wife's choices.
    You are one of them.
  • JLDickmonJLDickmon Senior Member Posts: 1,726 Senior Member
    Science is cool when something starts on fire....you just fragged your own six-pack.....my hats off to you for that experiment.....nut-ball! :tooth:

    both you guys..
    video or
    Never laugh at your wife's choices.
    You are one of them.
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Alright men, get outta them fart sacks "Drop yer Cocked Glocks and pick up yer Socks"..........Naw, I reckon not.:tooth:
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,871 Senior Member
    JLDickmon wrote: »
    I think the idea is, keeping someone ELSE's booger-picker off YOUR bang switch.
    If that's your problem, you've messed up.
    I'm just here for snark.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,111 Senior Member
    JLDickmon wrote: »
    both you guys..
    video or

    No need for a video...it was a well documented historical event....you just came along too late to witness it...and it was stupid funny.....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    No need for a video...it was a well documented historical event....you just came along too late to witness it...and it was stupid funny.....

    Very true.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • killpillakillpilla Member Posts: 50 Member

    Whoo hoo! Yeah, I always loved that part (he's a good actor) GREAT movie!
  • killpillakillpilla Member Posts: 50 Member
    Ok, ok. Here's something useful to do with your Glocks fella's!

    Tried to make it bigger, now I dont know what the heck I did but enjoy the new Dewalt!
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,320 Senior Member
    killpilla wrote: »
    Oh no, Beretta conspiracy? Now you must indulge me!!!

    Lots of speculation on this, but one theory floated around, if you are old enough to remember the mid-1980's, you'll recall that the "Big Bad" of the time was Moamar Khadaffi of Lybia. Italy is geographically well suited as a staging point for strikes against Lybia. In 1986, we adopt an Italian handgun. Hmmmmm. . .
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Lots of speculation on this, but one theory floated around, if you are old enough to remember the mid-1980's, you'll recall that the "Big Bad" of the time was Moamar Khadaffi of Lybia. Italy is geographically well suited as a staging point for strikes against Lybia. In 1986, we adopt an Italian handgun. Hmmmmm. . .

    That was the conspiracy theory. Hey, when they killed that jerk, was it a Beretta?
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,320 Senior Member
    One thing you need to realize Killpilla, is that there are different schools of thought advocating different features on handguns. Never mind the durable/reliable/accurate aspect - we're mainly talking control systems

    One camp is the hard-charging, gun-saavy, warriors who, whether they are actually Marines or not, live by the Marine creed of "This is My Rifle". These are the folks who when given their choice, tend to run with cocked and locked 1911's for much the same reason samurai used katanas - it's hard to find a better tool for the intended job, for the operator who lives his occupation. These guys will be safe and effective with whatever you give them, because they are serious enough to learn the quirks of whatever tool they are given. Think of these guys are professional race car drivers - they turn off the traction control on their daily drivers because they can get more out of a car with those features disabled/removed.

    Then there is the camp that NEEDS traction control, or in the case of pistols, things like heavy double action on the first shot, decocking safeties, magazine disconnects, painfully obvious loaded chamber indicators, etc. . . To the hard-charging operator, these things are obstacles that prevent the "race car" from being able to achieve top speed and maximum handling. To the "soccer mom" casual operator - i.e. the soldier who qualifies with a generic "pool weapon" annually, at best, they're features that - in theory, anyway - make it harder for the "driver" to inadvertently wrap his car around a tree, or, in the case of firearms, unintentionally shoot someone or himself.

    The Glock kinda splits the difference. It tries to keep the operators happy with simple controls and minimal obstacles to firing. It also tries to keep the "Nervous Nelly" crowd of Lowest Common Denominators (LCD's) happy by minimizing the amount of stuff a user has to think about. Nice thing about a Glock is that pretty much NOTHING can make it fire unless the trigger is pulled. The one major lesson to beat into the head of the operator of ANY firearm is finger off the trigger until actually shooting. The advantage of the Glock is that there's little else to beat in.

    But it's all a matter of perspective - the Army knows that MOST of their force is composed of LCD's, and that their hardcore operators can cope with a weapon designed for LCD's better than the LCD's can handle a hot rod. In this context, the "best" tool for the job can have a lot of definitions.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Jermanator wrote: »
    I was thinking the same thing. If my Glock ain't so good, my Kahrs are probably total junk.

    I've carried a Glock for years, other pistols without external safeties, never had a problem. However, the military had its requirements and one mandate was external safety. Regardless of our experience or opinion, the regs had to be met. Thankfully the Beretta is a pretty nice pistol and far as I know, it's had a good service record (such as standard issue sidearms ever manage to have in the military).

    Naturally, special forces and such, those who can pick their own sidearms, almost always select .45acp. I wonder why....
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Bigslug, that's an excellent posting on the needs of various elements of the military. And you're right -- a Glock w/o external safety or, maybe, a Beretta with, is about the maxed out thing that many average troops need to worry about. Better that they be well trained with their ARs and general tactics and such, than become experts with a pistol. After all, there are few times they'll really need that pistol in battle.

    And, as you say, there are the pros. They can use anything and will, given the chance, modify it to fit even better. These are the sort who can "blend" with a hair-trigger .45 or a customized H&K. Just point them in the general direction and it's a done deal.

    Both types of soldier are needed. The vast money needed to equip and train a specialist is best focused on those few who fit the task. Not to discredit the average soldier, either. Our regular US troops are the best in the world (okay, maybe they stand even w. the Brits or Israelis, but nobody's better)
  • 1965Jeff1965Jeff Senior Member Posts: 1,648 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    The military doesn't use Glocks precisely because they aren't so good. Frankly I don't know why anybody uses Glocks. Everybody who does, from all the police departments to all the civilians, are wrong. And no, I don't want to hear their side of it. The "safe action" is a dangerous joke, the market is flooded with guns that are just as reliable, durable, accurate and competitively priced as Glocks - and are also a helluva lot safer. The idea of locating the only external safety in the middle of the freaking trigger (!!!) is an accident waiting to happen. Autoloading pistols, except DAO models with long, heavy, revolver-like trigger pulls, should have a true safety that, when engaged, completely disables the weapon. Especially if the trigger is pulled. DUH!
    I just flushed my glock and the kahr down the toilet, now I'm safe(r). Wow.
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,244 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    No need for a video...it was a well documented historical event....you just came along too late to witness it...and it was stupid funny
    Yes it was. As a consolation, I believe we can get CPJ to show his video demonstrating that a .380 is better than a sharp stick.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
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