Personal Defense knowledge, what is your source ?

DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior MemberPosts: 9,496 Senior Member
What or how do you learn the important aspects of Personal Defense ?
Some folks learn it as a catechism of sorts, have read aspects of it in books, some have first hand experience in combat or law enforcement / security etc...

I believe LE training is an excellent platform / manner to learn valuable lessons as far as personal defense, there seems to be a gulf between what is taught in LE and what is taught to non LE.

I think however personal experience surviving an encounter builds or hones ones skills necessary for survival.

Non LE seems to break down Personal Defense into zones, home defense, car defense, etc.
I always thought of a general defense strategy consisting of a nice compact handgun, preferably a 9mm or .45 acp, something I am likely to have on My person most of the time.

While long guns are ideal, if you live around people even in a rural town, it is doubtful anyone goes about their daily routine with a rifle slung on their shoulder.

It would be great if everyone chimed in and gave a brief overview on how they learned valuable personal defense information, and how they incorporate what they learn into everyday life.
"There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996

Replies

  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 14,837 Senior Member
    As kids we were always taught to be self-reliant...this included standing up for yourself...The Army and Air National Guard contributed to the knowledge base, as did the Police Academy, my time working in Law Enforcement added practical experience to mix. . My job allowed me to attend LOTs of courses (some provided valuable information and training, others were a complete waste of time), I supplemented this by attending selected classes on my own dime. Tactical competitions also worked to add skills to the knowledge base.
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    I think this can be a good thread with everyone's input, to help isolate the essential parts of what "good training" consists of, not seeking advice from gun shop commandos for one.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Good question, Doc, even though I don't know what a Valeyard is...

    Some I've learned from classic books, especially by Ayoob, such as "In the Gravest Extreme".
    Some I was taught by my Dad and other people who've had shooting experience.
    Some from just thinking about scenarios and using common sense to solve problems hypothetically before they occur, just as we do with any problem.
    Some from handgun classes, both the basic concealed carry class and more advanced stuff.
    Some from here, reading and thinking about advice from other forum members.
    And a bit from my own personal experiences, having been in two actual shootings and several near-shootings, thinking carefully about what happened and what mistakes should be corrected.
    For me, none from the military or LEO training, as I've been in neither.

    So there are multiple sources for me, and I try to use all of them to plan and envision situations.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • BPsniperBPsniper Banned Posts: 1,961 Senior Member
    Work.

    I'm fading and doped up. I'll continue tomorrow.
    "....the true general purpose big-game cartridges used in this country come in but two calibers, .30 and 7mm. (the .270 Win. is merely a slightly aberrant 7mm whose bullets are .007" undersize.) -Finn Aagaard - American Rifleman, December 1986
  • HondoHondo Member Posts: 320 Member
    Through work at the Sheriff's Office. But I still read all I can from Massad Ayoob etc.
  • BPsniperBPsniper Banned Posts: 1,961 Senior Member
    Work has afforded me the opportunity to attend several schools. Combine that along with a fairly tedious training cycle and I get quite a bit of trigger time combined with scenario based training. I've been through lots of great courses. And.....a couple not so great. But one thing I've learned that is very productive is to always ask "why"................I've found that if the instructor can't answer that question, he probably doesn't know what the Hell he's talking about and is simply regurgitating information told to him. If I should do something a certain way, there needs to be a reason. This also needs to be validated by myself to see if it works for me as well. Some things do, and some don't. But if the instructor can prove and explain and then I can validate and retain with improved performance.....it's probably a nugget I want to keep....................The other thing I look for, is that the instructor has actually tested his taught methods in a trial by fire. I want experience. If you haven't proven your methods in real life situations, how do you know they work. I want a battle scarred instructor. Not a paper tiger. Certifications mean nothing to me. Experience does. Those with experience are the ones I want to glean information from. Not a desk ****..............Combine all this training with the ability to put the tactics and information to good use. Combine that with a brain that constantly reevaluates the ever changing situation and the ability to adapt and retain......has proven to be very effective for me. At least, to this point.
    "....the true general purpose big-game cartridges used in this country come in but two calibers, .30 and 7mm. (the .270 Win. is merely a slightly aberrant 7mm whose bullets are .007" undersize.) -Finn Aagaard - American Rifleman, December 1986
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 6,978 Senior Member
    Interesting question.
    When it comes to who I listen to, it is from those who have "been there and done that" on more than one occasion, and have been successful.
    I look to understand their mind set, their approach.
    I want to understand how it happened the way it did, and why they did what they did.
    Probably the one who has taught me the most to date is a friend who served for over a decade in the SF's and has trained others to do the same.
    Other than that I glean a little here and there.
    I have friends in various types of LE that have spanned my adult life, and although I learn valuable things from them, I am more interested in people who have had to fight others to defend their life or others on many occasions.
    I have never served in either LEO or the Military.
    A lot of the shooting skills I have, did not come from LE or military, but from a little here and a little there, and from, just figuring things out slowly over time.
    I have learned to use either hand while still or moving.
    I practice shooting from about every weird stance I can think of knowing it is unlikely I will get to choose one of my preference.
    I have learned to be deliberate in my shooting, and have set deep in my mind, when everything falls apart, not to get tunnel vision.
    For the last two years it has made me think differently about tactical matches, and the way I have shot a handgun versus the way I have been taught how I should approach it.
    I have been told be several folks who have been there and done that, that, tactical matches are not as realistic as one might suppose.
    And what might help you win a tac match may in the end hurt you and your ability to protect yourself and others.
    I have learned to never assume things will happen a certain way-Murphy always shows up.
    I have learned it is more important to put the bullet(s) in the right spot than it is to be gnat accurate.
    I have learned that the scenario will likely change, and I will have to adapt.
    I have learned when things look like they are going south, people you would think would be there to support/help you, freeze.
    I literally pray that I will never have to do it, while at the same time I prepare myself as if I will, praying for the wisdom to make good decisions and respond viciously when needed to protect myself and others.
    There is more I could type, but that is it for now.
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Everyone here has posted good points of view.

    One thing that I practice is a break with tradition, in any type of defensive encounter, I rather have My sidearm holstered or by My side until there is a threat, and then, I do not concentrate on the front sight as is popularly taught, I keep My vision clear on the threat not the sights, bring the pistol up into My line of sight and if need be fire, this is how I practice, and so far it has worked for Me in actual encounters.

    The reason being I see the many hunch back forms lots of instructors take and I am not doing that ever.
    I feel the same way with the ever popular strong side draw, it takes a moment to scrunch before the draw and telegraphs your intentions to draw so well, like the dog that lifts its leg prior to urinating, it is like asking to be shot.

    I would rather draw from a pocket, if asked for your money it looks like you are going to surrender your wallet, any numb-skull robber knows your wallet is not high on your hip.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,952 Senior Member
    Hondo wrote: »
    Through work at the Sheriff's Office. But I still read all I can from Massad Ayoob etc.

    :that: Plus some training for/with competitions over the years.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Perhaps a good Instructor is also someone that has been shot a few times and learned the hard way, what are the not so good practices in regards to personal defense, not someone that has never had to draw their sidearm.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • shawn1172shawn1172 Senior Member Posts: 588 Senior Member
    I've never had any formal firearms training outside of what little I got in the military. And that was only with an M16, not any handguns. I grew up around guns and was taught to shoot both rifles and handguns by my Dad. But no real tactical type training outside of basic training.

    I did train in martial arts for many years though. That involved empty hand, knives and sticks. We trained to defend against attackers armed with both knives and guns, defending either empty handed or with a knife or stick- or whatever is handy to use. My Sensei was a Kempo Grand Master who had served in the Army and been a hand to hand combat instructor. I'm sure the curriculm he taught us in the dojo was quite different from what he taught in the military but the point is I know he certainly wasn't one of those "paper tigers" BP mentioned.

    I definately want to get some real handgun training at a legitimate school though. I do read a lot about handgun training in magazines and books but I know that is no substitute for real instruction. There's a Sig academy in New Hampshire I'd like to check out. And I'd love to go to Gunsite sometime. Any other suggestions?
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    DoctorWho wrote: »
    Perhaps a good Instructor is also someone that has been shot a few times and learned the hard way, what are the not so good practices in regards to personal defense, not someone that has never had to draw their sidearm.

    I hope you meant to say "... has been shot [at] a few times...", otherwise the instructor is probably **** out by now. ha ha

    Doc, just a small personal question -- you're an excellent writer of posts here, all of them coherent and thoughtful, but I see that you often capitalize nouns. Did you maybe come from a German-speaking background? Just curious (for those who don't know, all nouns are capitalized in German, both proper and common).

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Just a quirk.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • SpkSpk Senior Member Posts: 1,958 Senior Member
    DoctorWho wrote: »
    What or how do you learn the important aspects of Personal Defense ?
    ...

    Question, Listen, Learn, Challenge, repeat as necessary. :beer:
    Beware of false knowledge -- it is often more dangerous than ignorance.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 14,837 Senior Member
    shawn1172 wrote: »
    And I'd love to go to Gunsite sometime. Any other suggestions?

    Thunder Ranch...Clint Smith
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • bruchibruchi Senior Member Posts: 2,582 Senior Member
    Mine comes from drills with an IPSC buddy that now works in the "special arrests unit" nabbing high profile criminals, can't do undercover work anymore, been in too many newspaper covers and they don't cover their faces here, used to be a SWAT member, police sniper and trainer before that, guy has been in more than one serious encounter, the kind where folks get dead, lost his partner at one who made the mistake of using a car as cover versus an AK. Now this guy is not at all the image one has of someone with those credentials, very competitive and loud about it, carries a few extra pounds but when it comes to moving his rear the guy can out shoot and hustle the skinny guys big time.
    If this post is non welcomed, I can always give you a recipe for making "tostones".
  • CoreyWCoreyW New Member Posts: 14 New Member
    Hollywood
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Not Bollywood ?
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • CoreyWCoreyW New Member Posts: 14 New Member
    Nope, Bollywood is too flamboyant and they sing to much.
  • SpkSpk Senior Member Posts: 1,958 Senior Member
    CoreyW wrote: »
    Nope, Bollywood is too flamboyant and they sing to much.

    Yeah, but the singing really helps!
    Beware of false knowledge -- it is often more dangerous than ignorance.
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