Weather permitting Aaron and I are going to try for 2K+ on the pd's on Friday and Saturday with some bench-rest type specialty pistols.
I thought, I would be primarily spotting, but it looks like I may have a 2k rig ready to go before Friday (Hopefully:uhm:).
Oh yes, I will report what happened.
We may only be shooting Aaron's SP, as my barreled action is still not here yet or the loaded ammo:tissue:
I know now I will not have time to load for it, so using factory ammo, I may just go for a kill beyond 1K, say out to 1,500 yards with mine or maybe just beyond 1000 yards.
Weather is the other issue high winds and rain probability are big for Friday, and Saturday looks better but still winds at 19mph. Hoping at least on Saturday the winds will be dying down as the day progresses.
Knowing what I know now, I would never take this shot today, but years ago I was hunting the wide open spaces of the Delta farms. From camp I had Lasered a Diesel tank at 985 yards. It was about 50 paces passed that to the bar ditch levy. I had killed many deer in that corner of the field over the years and had recently read up on drop tables for my load out of my .30 '06
So I was keeping an eye on that spot when a herd of does stepped out.
I watched them a while as they stood there and finally threw my wader length down jacket down for a rest and went prone.
I picked out a big doe and when my mental computer said the hold over was right I squeezed off. The group ran off except for the one I shot at, which went the other way. I sat there a while before I went to check on things.
I found no blood but I could tell from the tracks in the frozen mud, she was running. I found her not far from where she was when I shot. Maybe 40 yards or so.
I can't swear to it but I'm sure in those days I was shooting a 150 grain Core Loct. The bullet did it's job but I remember thinking there wasn't much expansion.
Anyway, and again, I would never take that shot today.
Just for fun, a 150 gr 30 06 with 3100 fps muzzle velocity and a BC of .32 at 1000 yds drops 418 inches and is traveling about 1000 fps, delivering 340 FPE, less than a 9mm at PBR.
D
"A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
Just for fun, a 150 gr 30 06 with 3100 fps muzzle velocity and a BC of .32 at 1000 yds drops 418 inches and is traveling about 1000 fps, delivering 340 FPE, less than a 9mm at PBR.
D
I know what you're saying here and I agree. That's why Razor said if he'd known better he would not have attempted it. I tried dumb stuff like this when I was young. I don't think I connected, or at least I hope I missed animals completely, because any bullet's going to lose a lot of velocity and energy at that range.
Daddy, what's an enabler?
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
I know what you're saying here and I agree. That's why Razor said if he'd known better he would not have attempted it. I tried dumb stuff like this when I was young. I don't think I connected, or at least I hope I missed animals completely, because any bullet's going to lose a lot of velocity and energy at that range.
Right, and this was way before Al Gore invented the internet and companies capitalized on it with things like, oh I don't know, let's say external ballistics software.
I'd been reading magazines and I did what I did.
And just for fun, I'm sure most cops that have to put vehicle hit deer out of their misery use 9mm at something over PBR.
Many years later at the tag end of my access to that farm I was down there bow hunting and at lunch I was at camp and was watching 3 monster bucks feeding on that same levy.Some locals, who routinely ignored no trespassing signs showed up and started talking about them and one guy mentioned he had a .22-250. I put the kibosh on that little scenario.
Teach your children to love guns, they'll never be able to afford drugs
Before action report.
It has been raining for more than 36 hours straight and the wind is running at 28 mph and gusting to 38.
Today is a no go.
Maybe late tomorrow afternoon if the wind does come down by then.
My SP is now assembled and ready to go with 80 rounds of ammo.
Right, and this was way before Al Gore invented the internet and companies capitalized on it with things like, oh I don't know, let's say external ballistics software.
I'd been reading magazines and I did what I did.
And just for fun, I'm sure most cops that have to put vehicle hit deer out of their misery use 9mm at something over PBR.
Many years later at the tag end of my access to that farm I was down there bow hunting and at lunch I was at camp and was watching 3 monster bucks feeding on that same levy.Some locals, who routinely ignored no trespassing signs showed up and started talking about them and one guy mentioned he had a .22-250. I put the kibosh on that little scenario.
I wasn't making any comment on the morality or judgment of your shot, I was merely trying to indicate how lucky a shot it was. 418 inches of drop, or if you sighted the gun in at 200 yards your hold over would be about 35 feet.... dang!
D
"A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
Even landing a shot in the correct county at 2K is a win in my book.
I'll second that.
I haven't done much shooting past 200 yards, but as an old land surveyor, I have some experience with heat shimmer. Trying to chase down an 8' range pole with a 24x transit, at long distances, is like trying to stuff a bobcat into a pillowcase. I cannot quite figure out how you guys deal with that. We dealt with it by watching the 'ebb and flow,' making our best guess, and then 'stacking' the shots to get an average. But, a pdog doesn't give a lot of opportunities for averaging, so you guys definitely have some tricks up your sleeves. :uhm:
Oh yes, I will report what happened.
We may only be shooting Aaron's SP, as my barreled action is still not here yet or the loaded ammo:tissue:
I know now I will not have time to load for it, so using factory ammo, I may just go for a kill beyond 1K, say out to 1,500 yards with mine or maybe just beyond 1000 yards.
Weather is the other issue high winds and rain probability are big for Friday, and Saturday looks better but still winds at 19mph. Hoping at least on Saturday the winds will be dying down as the day progresses.
Yeah man, I don't know where all this wind is coming from! I think the whole North American Continent is blowing a gale. When we first left out of Fort Myers it was calm. But on down the road out of Galveston the wind picked up. By the time we hit Matagorda Bay the wind was out of the south at about 30+. It blew all day yesterday too. I just walked outside and it seems relatively calm, slight SE breeze, but I think as the day warms the wind will get stronger.
Daddy, what's an enabler?
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
Conditions, conditions, conditions.
Especially early morning and late afternoon.
Here is something I wrote several years ago about LR doggin: http://www.longrangehunting.com/articles/1500-yard-prairie-dogs-1.php
To give you how long ago the article was written, my son Erik recently had his 19th birthday.
I actually wrote the article in 2008.
I haven't done much shooting past 200 yards, but as an old land surveyor, I have some experience with heat shimmer. Trying to chase down an 8' range pole with a 24x transit, at long distances, is like trying to stuff a bobcat into a pillowcase. I cannot quite figure out how you guys deal with that. We dealt with it by watching the 'ebb and flow,' making our best guess, and then 'stacking' the shots to get an average. But, a pdog doesn't give a lot of opportunities for averaging, so you guys definitely have some tricks up your sleeves. :uhm:
Aaron and I have been looking at the hourly forecast and we are planning to go out now for sure tomorrow afternoon.
It may not be good enough when we get out there, but you never know till you try.
Since I will be shooting Gunwerks manufactured ammo, I may keep my shots between 1000 yards and 1500 yards.
The bullet is a Berger 180 grain Hybrid.
I wasn't making any comment on the morality or judgment of your shot, I was merely trying to indicate how lucky a shot it was. 418 inches of drop, or if you sighted the gun in at 200 yards your hold over would be about 35 feet.... dang!
D
No offense taken at all Dan. It was very lucky. Ignorant but lucky. Btw, we're still unpacking around here but I found my copy of Empire of the Summer moon. If you want to borrow it Pm your address. I highly recommend it.
Teach your children to love guns, they'll never be able to afford drugs
Groundhog at 300 yards with a Handi-rifle in .22 Hornet. I know it was 300 yards because it's hole was under the 300 yard target stand at the gun range.
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
My longest kill was on a yote pup at an estimated 250ish yds. with a Stevens 200 .223 62 gr HP. I amazed myself with the shot because I don't shoot at game that far usually. Longest kill with a hand gun was 65, 70 yds. with a Ruger SBH in .44 mag. I think it a Winchester .250 gr PTHP.
Aaron and I had set aside two mornings and two afternoons for some LR doggin. Rain and high winds took away three of those shooting opportunities. We did go out yesterday afternoon late. Winds were in the 7mph zone but were not constant.
Aaron is running a rear-grip XP-100 chambered in 7mm Dakota (180 Berger Hybrids). He made a benchrest stock for his XP that is 3" wide in the forend and is also 3" wide at the base of the grip. He added lead to it to make the weight overall around 32 pounds (no muzzle brake). 20" 1.250 diameter Krieger or Bartlein 8.5 Twist, Jewel trigger, 12-42 NF benchrest scope. Has a LR scope base that can be adjusted to over 100 MOA.
Mine is a BAT non-designated action, 7mm LRM (Long Range Magnum), 1-8 twist Krieger W/Gunwerks brake, Jewel trigger, Eric Wallace Benchrest stock, 20 MOA base, Burris Signature Zee Rings (added 20 MOA with inserts), Sightron S-III 6-24 with MOA reticle. Gunwerks factory ammo (180 Berger Hybrid). Mine weighs around 16 pounds.
Gunwerks chambered the barrel. I was going to run a 20" tube for this project, but once I realized that Gunwerks was looking for ballistic information for shorter than their normal barrel length in their rifles (25.5"), I decided to go with a 21.75" tube. This is closer to what they are considering.
I guessed MV based on what the typical MV was in a 25.5" 7 LRM would be when cut down to 21.75" to be around 2850 fps. I ran several different drop charts in 50 fps increments.
First time I shot this rig was sighting it in at 100 yards yesterday afternoon using only their ammo. I didn't have time to load for it, as I got it Friday afternoon.
I shot out to just over 1600 yards. No dead dogs, but 5 real close ones. If they had been rock chucks, they would have been dead for sure. Beyond 1500 to 1600 yards the S-III with its 1/4 minute dot was just to large. Chose this scope since it has 100 MOA internally and a 20 MOA reticle. Should have put my 8-32 S-III (less internal MOA) on.
I would normally had a heavy barrel but this was the only 8T I could find at the time.
These are purely bench specialty pistols, built for the sole purpose of accuracy off of the bench.
Both of us were using MAX Rests.
My longest shot was just over 1600 yards. Dogs were going down after 1 or two close shots which made things difficult.
Aaron went out to the 1900 yard distance. Higher magnification and adjustable scope base is key here. He got so close on this one dog that gave him more shot opportunities, I was convinced he was going to get it, but one shot that almost grazed his left shoulder motivated him to go down and never come back up.
I shot 20 rounds at while Aaron shot 91 rounds at pd's.
We started off at in 1,300 yard range as the winds were not great yet.
If we had stayed in the 1300 to 1400 yard range for the whole time we would have had dead dogs, especially when conditions got good at the very end.
Great report, Ernie. I'm not (weatherwise) too far south of you. The winds here have been terrible the past couple days. While they did lighten up somewhat yesterday afternoon, I'd have still considered it fairly tough conditions at a meager 500 yards. 1K plus I'd have considered impossible. At that range, getting close enough that a pdog would be even aware that something was amiss is quite a feat in itself. Kudos!
Mike
"Walking away seems to be a lost art form." N454casull
I wasn't making any comment on the morality or judgment of your shot, I was merely trying to indicate how lucky a shot it was. 418 inches of drop, or if you sighted the gun in at 200 yards your hold over would be about 35 feet.... dang!
D
I would! That is I would make a morality or ethics judgment on this... IF I wasn't guilty of it myself and IF I didn't realize why I did it and probably why Razor tried it. When we're young and inexperienced we try stuff we shouldn't because out of our ignorance of youth, we don't realize the odds we're up against. What I'm saying here I guess, is that if I saw a seasoned hunter that I knew had not practiced at that range or he didn't have the equipment for such a shot, I would condemn him. But I would give the inexperienced novice a break here and just lecture him about it and try to explain to him what he's really up against. If you don't practice at even just 400 or 500 yards, and you try a shot at that range, you're pressing your luck on a clean kill.
Daddy, what's an enabler?
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
Thanks!
It was an afternoon of fun, with some potential expectations given the conditions.
I would have been tickled pink to get a dog between 1400-1600 yards with the way mine is setup currently. Benchrest loading techniques, tweaking bullet depth possibly, meplat trimming and pointing, higher magnification scope, Variable Gantry Mount (scope base) will get my rig ready for the races.
If Berger will ever get around to producing the 195 Hybrid it will also be a game changer in terms of drift. That is why I picked up this 8T to begin with.
Ideally, a heavier barrel would be preferred, but this one is better than nothing. If my barrel was heavier, I could always spot my own shots.
Plus, the Gunwerks brake is not intended to be the most effective in terms of felt recoil reduction, but rather do an effective job for a hunting rig and still keep nice lines.
Curious to chronograph the factory ammo.
With a MV of 2850 fps, elev 4300 (180 Hybrid .674 BC) my drops and drift at 1600 is 50.75MOA 8.00MOA (10mph FV). Impact velocity is 1384 fps
Great report, Ernie. I'm not (weatherwise) too far south of you. The winds here have been terrible the past couple days. While they did lighten up somewhat yesterday afternoon, I'd have still considered it fairly tough conditions at a meager 500 yards. 1K plus I'd have considered impossible. At that range, getting close enough that a pdog would be even aware that something was amiss is quite a feat in itself. Kudos!
8 feet. Bigacus spidacus...... 3 gr Bronzed point .50 dia. ACME Paperclip w/ ACME 3/4" Roughbore pine broom handle. Actually do all the rubberband reloads myself.
Replies
3006 180 gr Barnes TSX, termite mound rest
It seemed like 2 miles, when we walked/climbed it! What did it take us, 45 minutes or so to get up there?
I thought, I would be primarily spotting, but it looks like I may have a 2k rig ready to go before Friday (Hopefully:uhm:).
"The Un-Tactical"
Mike
N454casull
We may only be shooting Aaron's SP, as my barreled action is still not here yet or the loaded ammo:tissue:
I know now I will not have time to load for it, so using factory ammo, I may just go for a kill beyond 1K, say out to 1,500 yards with mine or maybe just beyond 1000 yards.
Weather is the other issue high winds and rain probability are big for Friday, and Saturday looks better but still winds at 19mph. Hoping at least on Saturday the winds will be dying down as the day progresses.
"The Un-Tactical"
Just for fun, a 150 gr 30 06 with 3100 fps muzzle velocity and a BC of .32 at 1000 yds drops 418 inches and is traveling about 1000 fps, delivering 340 FPE, less than a 9mm at PBR.
D
Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
I know what you're saying here and I agree. That's why Razor said if he'd known better he would not have attempted it. I tried dumb stuff like this when I was young. I don't think I connected, or at least I hope I missed animals completely, because any bullet's going to lose a lot of velocity and energy at that range.
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
Right, and this was way before Al Gore invented the internet and companies capitalized on it with things like, oh I don't know, let's say external ballistics software.
I'd been reading magazines and I did what I did.
And just for fun, I'm sure most cops that have to put vehicle hit deer out of their misery use 9mm at something over PBR.
Many years later at the tag end of my access to that farm I was down there bow hunting and at lunch I was at camp and was watching 3 monster bucks feeding on that same levy.Some locals, who routinely ignored no trespassing signs showed up and started talking about them and one guy mentioned he had a .22-250. I put the kibosh on that little scenario.
It has been raining for more than 36 hours straight and the wind is running at 28 mph and gusting to 38.
Today is a no go.
Maybe late tomorrow afternoon if the wind does come down by then.
My SP is now assembled and ready to go with 80 rounds of ammo.
"The Un-Tactical"
I wasn't making any comment on the morality or judgment of your shot, I was merely trying to indicate how lucky a shot it was. 418 inches of drop, or if you sighted the gun in at 200 yards your hold over would be about 35 feet.... dang!
D
Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
I'll second that.
I haven't done much shooting past 200 yards, but as an old land surveyor, I have some experience with heat shimmer. Trying to chase down an 8' range pole with a 24x transit, at long distances, is like trying to stuff a bobcat into a pillowcase. I cannot quite figure out how you guys deal with that. We dealt with it by watching the 'ebb and flow,' making our best guess, and then 'stacking' the shots to get an average. But, a pdog doesn't give a lot of opportunities for averaging, so you guys definitely have some tricks up your sleeves. :uhm:
Yeah man, I don't know where all this wind is coming from! I think the whole North American Continent is blowing a gale. When we first left out of Fort Myers it was calm. But on down the road out of Galveston the wind picked up. By the time we hit Matagorda Bay the wind was out of the south at about 30+. It blew all day yesterday too. I just walked outside and it seems relatively calm, slight SE breeze, but I think as the day warms the wind will get stronger.
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
Especially early morning and late afternoon.
Here is something I wrote several years ago about LR doggin:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/articles/1500-yard-prairie-dogs-1.php
To give you how long ago the article was written, my son Erik recently had his 19th birthday.
I actually wrote the article in 2008.
"The Un-Tactical"
It may not be good enough when we get out there, but you never know till you try.
Since I will be shooting Gunwerks manufactured ammo, I may keep my shots between 1000 yards and 1500 yards.
The bullet is a Berger 180 grain Hybrid.
"The Un-Tactical"
Well yeah, we had to stop the bleeding first and make sure we weren't going to the ER:tooth:. We took the long way checking on the second elk, also.
No offense taken at all Dan. It was very lucky. Ignorant but lucky. Btw, we're still unpacking around here but I found my copy of Empire of the Summer moon. If you want to borrow it Pm your address. I highly recommend it.
Aaron is running a rear-grip XP-100 chambered in 7mm Dakota (180 Berger Hybrids). He made a benchrest stock for his XP that is 3" wide in the forend and is also 3" wide at the base of the grip. He added lead to it to make the weight overall around 32 pounds (no muzzle brake). 20" 1.250 diameter Krieger or Bartlein 8.5 Twist, Jewel trigger, 12-42 NF benchrest scope. Has a LR scope base that can be adjusted to over 100 MOA.
Mine is a BAT non-designated action, 7mm LRM (Long Range Magnum), 1-8 twist Krieger W/Gunwerks brake, Jewel trigger, Eric Wallace Benchrest stock, 20 MOA base, Burris Signature Zee Rings (added 20 MOA with inserts), Sightron S-III 6-24 with MOA reticle. Gunwerks factory ammo (180 Berger Hybrid). Mine weighs around 16 pounds.
Gunwerks chambered the barrel. I was going to run a 20" tube for this project, but once I realized that Gunwerks was looking for ballistic information for shorter than their normal barrel length in their rifles (25.5"), I decided to go with a 21.75" tube. This is closer to what they are considering.
I guessed MV based on what the typical MV was in a 25.5" 7 LRM would be when cut down to 21.75" to be around 2850 fps. I ran several different drop charts in 50 fps increments.
First time I shot this rig was sighting it in at 100 yards yesterday afternoon using only their ammo. I didn't have time to load for it, as I got it Friday afternoon.
I shot out to just over 1600 yards. No dead dogs, but 5 real close ones. If they had been rock chucks, they would have been dead for sure. Beyond 1500 to 1600 yards the S-III with its 1/4 minute dot was just to large. Chose this scope since it has 100 MOA internally and a 20 MOA reticle. Should have put my 8-32 S-III (less internal MOA) on.
I would normally had a heavy barrel but this was the only 8T I could find at the time.
These are purely bench specialty pistols, built for the sole purpose of accuracy off of the bench.
Both of us were using MAX Rests.
My longest shot was just over 1600 yards. Dogs were going down after 1 or two close shots which made things difficult.
Aaron went out to the 1900 yard distance. Higher magnification and adjustable scope base is key here. He got so close on this one dog that gave him more shot opportunities, I was convinced he was going to get it, but one shot that almost grazed his left shoulder motivated him to go down and never come back up.
I shot 20 rounds at while Aaron shot 91 rounds at pd's.
We started off at in 1,300 yard range as the winds were not great yet.
If we had stayed in the 1300 to 1400 yard range for the whole time we would have had dead dogs, especially when conditions got good at the very end.
"The Un-Tactical"
"The Un-Tactical"
Mike
N454casull
I would! That is I would make a morality or ethics judgment on this... IF I wasn't guilty of it myself and IF I didn't realize why I did it and probably why Razor tried it. When we're young and inexperienced we try stuff we shouldn't because out of our ignorance of youth, we don't realize the odds we're up against. What I'm saying here I guess, is that if I saw a seasoned hunter that I knew had not practiced at that range or he didn't have the equipment for such a shot, I would condemn him. But I would give the inexperienced novice a break here and just lecture him about it and try to explain to him what he's really up against. If you don't practice at even just 400 or 500 yards, and you try a shot at that range, you're pressing your luck on a clean kill.
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
It was an afternoon of fun, with some potential expectations given the conditions.
I would have been tickled pink to get a dog between 1400-1600 yards with the way mine is setup currently.
Benchrest loading techniques, tweaking bullet depth possibly, meplat trimming and pointing, higher magnification scope, Variable Gantry Mount (scope base) will get my rig ready for the races.
If Berger will ever get around to producing the 195 Hybrid it will also be a game changer in terms of drift. That is why I picked up this 8T to begin with.
Ideally, a heavier barrel would be preferred, but this one is better than nothing. If my barrel was heavier, I could always spot my own shots.
Plus, the Gunwerks brake is not intended to be the most effective in terms of felt recoil reduction, but rather do an effective job for a hunting rig and still keep nice lines.
Curious to chronograph the factory ammo.
With a MV of 2850 fps, elev 4300 (180 Hybrid .674 BC) my drops and drift at 1600 is 50.75MOA 8.00MOA (10mph FV). Impact velocity is 1384 fps
"The Un-Tactical"
Phone# please:tooth:
"The Un-Tactical"
Not one to brag though..
Nice!!