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Thinking about a Christie/Cruz or Christie/Rubio ticket for 2016

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  • Ranch13Ranch13 Senior Member Posts: 820 Senior Member
    Rand Paul or Ted Cruz either one would be alright, but the problem there is that unless the folks at the grassroots of the republican party get active and get into local party activity enough to get a strangle hold on the old guard establishment types, those old guard will sink the entire country to keep either of those two men from getting the nomination.
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,973 Senior Member
    Ranch13 wrote: »
    Rand Paul or Ted Cruz either one would be alright, but the problem there is that unless the folks at the grassroots of the republican party get active and get into local party activity enough to get a strangle hold on the old guard establishment types, those old guard will sink the entire country to keep either of those two men from getting the nomination.

    :that:

    We need a 90% GOP turnout on election day and let our voices be heard.

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    You are right, except he just did not run for re-election as governor in 2010 to run in the Senate race to replace Mel Martinez and lost to Rubio.
    Yep. First sitting gov. in a whiiiiiiiiile not to run for re-election.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    Ranch13 wrote: »
    Rand Paul or Ted Cruz either one would be alright, but the problem there is that unless the folks at the grassroots of the republican party get active and get into local party activity enough to get a strangle hold on the old guard establishment types, those old guard will sink the entire country to keep either of those two men from getting the nomination.
    Not sure about Paul or Cruz (I really don't trust ANY politicians or those who have held long-term political goals anymore), but I agree with everything else.

    And if anyone asks who I do like... Like I said, I don't really trust any of them.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    I will not vote for the fat boy from Jersey. Ever.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • Pelagic KayakerPelagic Kayaker Banned Posts: 1,503 Senior Member
    BigDanS wrote: »
    Cruz / Rubio

    That would lock up the Latino vote, and show the Republicans aren't the old white guy race hatin' party. Plus I like them as a team.

    D

    I agree.
  • tv_racin_fantv_racin_fan Senior Member Posts: 660 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Your statement falls in line with many here, and I really understand. But I simply don't agree.

    Do you really really want Eric Holder on the Supreme Court? And sitting next to John Kerry?

    That's the sort of SCOTUS we'd see if we elect Hillary.

    Conservatives stayed home in 2012 and we got another 4 years of Obama. Those who chose to not support Romney wanted to "punish" the country, and boy did they get their wish.

    I wouldn't be excited about Christie, not at all. But I live in the real world, not a post-apocalyptic fantasy nor in some "my way or the highway" purified society. I live in a flawed, human, and often frustrating world where I don't get my way. I haven't gotten my way since I was about, oh, 6 months old. Society can be a ratty thing and can often go wrong. Sometimes we win, sometimes we lose, sometimes it's a halfway deal. I can live with halfway. That's how I live with my girlfriend -- compromise. If I want it all my way, I can split with her but that's not what I really want. And every day when I step outside, I enter a world of compromise... I can't shoot the neighbor's dog nor shoot his noisy lawnmen whose blowers disturb me. I can't drive 75 down the street. I can't shove my way in front of line at the store.

    And I can't always choose exactly who will represent me in the mayor's office or congress or the presidency. I make do with this imperfect and flawed world and learn to live with adult things, such as maybe not hand-picking my president.

    I genuinely believe that there are people who are once more going to shoot themselves in the foot in 2016. It's a given.

    Sorry, but I do really think that we need to effect a compromise next time around, because the alternative will be having 2 new SCOTUS members like Kerry and Holder. And that frightens me.

    Excuse me sir. I did not stay home or not vote for Romney because I wanted to punish the country or you or anyone for that matter. I stayed home/didn't vote for Romney because I was not interested in voting for the liberal or the other liberal. Wasn't interested in voting for the man who championed and signed an assault weapons ban nor was I interested in voting for the man who championed and wanted to sign an assault weapons ban. And I want nothing to so with any excuses as to why Mr Romney was better for the country than Mr Obama. Don't give me some crap about that liberal Romney would not nominate a liberal justice because YOU have no proof of such.

    You of course are free to vote for whichever liberal you prefer but do not sit there and claim that I am the issue with your chosen liberal not being elected.
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    Excuse me sir. I did not stay home or not vote for Romney because I wanted to punish the country or you or anyone for that matter. I stayed home/didn't vote for Romney because I was not interested in voting for the liberal or the other liberal. Wasn't interested in voting for the man who championed and signed an assault weapons ban nor was I interested in voting for the man who championed and wanted to sign an assault weapons ban. And I want nothing to so with any excuses as to why Mr Romney was better for the country than Mr Obama. Don't give me some crap about that liberal Romney would not nominate a liberal justice because YOU have no proof of such.

    You of course are free to vote for whichever liberal you prefer but do not sit there and claim that I am the issue with your chosen liberal not being elected.

    By not voting for Romney, you voted for Obama. You can deny it, rationalize it, excuse it all you want. Bottom line, you voted for Obama. Thanks for nuthin'.
  • tv_racin_fantv_racin_fan Senior Member Posts: 660 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    By not voting for Romney, you voted for Obama. You can deny it, rationalize it, excuse it all you want. Bottom line, you voted for Obama. Thanks for nuthin'.

    You keep on believeing that drivel sir. It is after all your right to do so.

    Just remember that it was John Roberts who penned the opinion that the ACA (ObamaCare) is Constitutional based on the opinion that it is a tax. Remember that he was nominated by a republican.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,921 Senior Member
    Horsey....you probably ought to get used to the fact that most of us are fed up with this "lesser of two evils" crap. The Republican party better, by God, pull their heads out of their 4th point of contact and nominate someone the conservatives in this country can get behind. I will NOT be part an party to electing a RINO. If that means Clinton becomes POTUS...so be it...maybe THEN the Republican party will see the error of their ways...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,670 Senior Member
    I think that this idea that "a conservative can't win" is pure BS. Ronald Reagan won 2 terms and was the last real conservative this country had as president. Besides that, he won on the heels of the last biggest liberal and failed president we have seen since the current occupant of the WH. "Conservatives can't win" is the logic stirred up by RINO's and Neocons.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    By not voting for Romney, you voted for Obama. You can deny it, rationalize it, excuse it all you want. Bottom line, you voted for Obama. Thanks for nuthin'. This paid message was brought to you by the RNC

    By that rationale, I also "voted" for Obama. At the time of the election, Romney was the only candidate that SIGNED a gun ban and socialized medicine. How can you defend that as a better option?
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    I "Conservatives can't win" is the logic stirred up by RINO's and Neocons.

    :win:

    Unless the GOP backs a conservative candidate, millions of conservative voters will stay home AGAIN. It is really that simple.
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • RazorbackerRazorbacker Senior Member Posts: 4,646 Senior Member
    CaliFFL wrote: »
    By that rationale, I also "voted" for Obama. At the time of the election, Romney was the only candidate that SIGNED a gun ban and socialized medicine. How can you defend that as a better option?

    I hear what you're saying and I'm not defending Romney but I'll tell you what I was thinking in 2012. If Obama wins, in his own words, it's his last election so there was no doubt in my mind that he would gleefully sign the most draconian gun bans he could get rammed through congress.
    Whereas Romney would be seeking reelection. So therefore he'd be more susceptible to the outcry and carpet bombing of emails we all did after they tried to get more bans through Congress this last time.
    Just what I was thinking.
    That and the economy needs a business man not a community organizing boy king.
    Teach your children to love guns, they'll never be able to afford drugs
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,258 Senior Member
    I think that this idea that "a conservative can't win" is pure BS. Ronald Reagan won 2 terms and was the last real conservative this country had as president. Besides that, he won on the heels of the last biggest liberal and failed president we have seen since the current occupant of the WH. "Conservatives can't win" is the logic stirred up by RINO's and Neocons.

    True to a point, but this is no longer the 1980's. Back then, we were still able to manage some sense of national unity on a grand scale - we might have been Democrats or Republicans, but at the end of the day were Americans. We saw the last gasp of that in the early post-9/11 days. Yes, we see it still, but the majority mentality seems to have degraded in the last ten years to separating the cause of the individual from that of the nation. Alexis de Toqueville - "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." That has transpired, and now a major voting block of this country has shifted from "Who will take less of what is mine?" to "Who will give me more of what was someone else's?". The scary thing is that Billary is the poster child of that mindset - as conservatives wax orgasmic about Ronald Reagan, so is it for the Clintons with the other side.

    I think our biggest hope there is that America is still probably not to the point of electing a female president.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    I hear what you're saying and I'm not defending Romney but I'll tell you what I was thinking in 2012. If Obama wins, in his own words, it's his last election so there was no doubt in my mind that he would gleefully sign the most draconian gun bans he could get rammed through congress.
    Whereas Romney would be seeking reelection. So therefore he'd be more susceptible to the outcry and carpet bombing of emails we all did after they tried to get more bans through Congress this last time.
    Just what I was thinking.
    That and the economy needs a business man not a community organizing boy king.


    Here's what worried me: If Romney was elected and a mass shooting happened, he would ask for a gun control bill and republicans would write it with bi-partisan support. Christie is the same. They both love "common sense gun legislation, that will reduce___________________".

    With Obama in office, the republicans, conservatives, libertarians rise up as one unit to defeat gun bills. If the boy king couldn't get a bill after Newtown, he never will. I'm not convinced that would apply if a republican was in office. I saw too much damage caused by Bush/Senate/House republicans with the support of frightened Americans.


    I can't argue with the economy needing a businessman.
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,670 Senior Member
    CaliFFL wrote: »
    ...........I can't argue with the economy needing a businessman.
    That was really the only thing that made Romney an attractive candidate for me. That and the fact that I absolutely loathed this president.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Exactly, exactly, exactly.

    Give me a Cruz/Paul or vice versa, republican ticket. And anyone who condemns the tea party can suck my backside. I ain't voting for them.

    And so we are all (Sam) perfectly clear, I will PROUDLY standup and say that I helped Billary get elected by voting third party if my "republican" choice is that fat bastard Christie, or another steaming turd like we have had the past few elections.

    I know this will get lost on some.....but the country WILL NOT VOTE A MODERATE REPUBLICAN INTO OFFICE! I think deep down most folks want a republican candidate with a big swinging set of brass balls that clang like a church bell when he walks. Not some poosy who caters to everyone.

    This "lesser of two evils" BS has to stop. Because they "republicans" they've been sending us are not the lesser evil. They are the same evil.

    AGREED!!!! If the Republicans don't embrace the tea party portion of their voting constituency, they are done for.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    :agree::agree::agree::agree::agree::jester::agree:
    That was really the only thing that made Romney an attractive candidate for me. That and the fact that I absolutely loathed this president.

    This, 2016 is a clean slate. No Barry having the power of the incumbent. No excuses for going RINO. Either the GOP learns the real lesson from the last two elections or they die as applications logical party. They actually as if political parties have never died in this country. Call your local Whig office for advice on that one, if you can.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    By not voting for Romney, you voted for Obama. You can deny it, rationalize it, excuse it all you want. Bottom line, you voted for Obama. Thanks for nuthin'.

    No. You fail to realize that the ONLY way that the GOP will change it's Liberal ways is if enough people vote for more independent/conservative parties. If they want to win.... REALLY want to win, they will add Rand Paul, or someone like him, to pull in those votes.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • agewonagewon Senior Member Posts: 655 Senior Member
    The scary thought might be that the conservatives didn't stay home, but they were outnumbered by people who WANT socialism. Nobody else is seeing this trend? Conservatives are being outnumbered which is why the RINOS and middle republicans are trying to chase off the Tea Party. For fear of scaring people to the other side of the aisle.
    And the one thing to consider about Christie is that he represents his constituents. Jersey is full of liberals and RINO's. When he was hammered about the praise he have Obama after Sandy, he said that people are forgetting that he's representing his constituents and that what they NEEDED, federal support.
    While he's not the ideal candidate for us regarding gun control, he IS capable of negotiating across party lines, and tackling heavy issues. And I think his true conservative colors will shine through on a national level.
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    agewon wrote: »
    The scary thought might be that the conservatives didn't stay home, but they were outnumbered by people who WANT socialism. .

    Nope. Voter turnout was abysmal.

    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/11/07/2012-Turnout-Dramatically-Lower-Than-2008
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    CaliFFL wrote: »
    :that: Why go vote for Obama light? Same thing about Christie, why should I vote for someone who at times acts like Hillary, if I want that, I might as well vote for Hillary. ( NOT gonna happen)
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,395 Senior Member
    Only difference between Hillary and Christie is that one of them is (allegedly) a female.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • coolgunguycoolgunguy Senior Member Posts: 6,611 Senior Member
    tennmike wrote: »
    Only difference between Hillary and Christie is that one of them is (allegedly) a female.


    Is the other one married to Bill Clinton? :jester:
    "Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
    George Carlin
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,395 Senior Member
    coolgunguy wrote: »
    Is the other one married to Bill Clinton? :jester:

    Rumor has it that one of them is married to Bill Clinton. I have no firm evidence to confirm if this is fact or fiction.

    If Christie is the "R" nominee by the time the primary elections roll around in '16 then I will NOT be pulling the lever by his name, nor will I be pulling the "D" lever for whoever is identified by that lever. I'll be pulling the lever for the third party candidate. I'm done choosing between cow flop "A" and cow flop "B". I'll take 'Candidate C' for $300, Alex.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    No. You fail to realize that the ONLY way that the GOP will change it's Liberal ways is if enough people vote for more independent/conservative parties. If they want to win.... REALLY want to win, they will add Rand Paul, or someone like him, to pull in those votes.

    Luis

    I DO understand your guys' frustration because it's exactly what I felt the past 2 elections. Romney for example was an "okay" candidate but not really someone to set the electorate on fire, and he ran an inept campaign.

    I WANT a conservative like Rubio or Paul or whomever to win in 2016. I'll happily vote for a conservative and will work for him (as I worked for Cruz in his senate campaign).

    What point I'm trying to make is this: Right now, as the big electoral pendulum is swinging, yes it's turning toward the more conservative side, but no, the swing is not YET made. Next time around, 2016, the overall electorate will NOT yet be ready to elect a true conservative president.

    I'm pretty careful to separate wishes from facts. And what I really really cannot envision is Hillary being elected. Because she will be "coronated" and her election will also bring in a "super majority" in the House and Senate.

    Results? People like John Kerry and Eric Holder on the supreme court, and one more thing that really should scare us:

    Not long ago, Obama signed the UN (I originally put "US") arms control treaty. This is the same sort of measure that got all firearms banned in Australia and elsewhere. A super-majority US senate can then ratify that treaty! Goodbye to all our firearms and 2A rights.

    This is a genuine fear and one that may easily come to effect if Hillary wins a big election.

    For this reason, I can accept someone like Christie, a moderate Republican and populist.

    Understand, IF I thought that a conservative could beat Hillary in 2016, yes I'll be on that campaign. But I simply do not believe it's yet possible and we may have to accept a compromise candidate along the way.

    agewon says that conservatives are being outnumbered. This is true, but the mood is swinging and eventually, conservatives will be stronger again. Except, not right now and not by 2016.

    I would LOVE to see a realistic alternative conservative beating Hillary but I really also fear the worst: A big Hillary win in 2016 plus a big house and senate majority. If we see that, we could easily see a big supreme court reversal AND the UN arms control treaty ratification. That's scary and it should scare conservatives enough that they will do ANYTHING to prevent a Hillary win.
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    Some of us don't recognize any difference between Hillary and Christie. I do not see how he would be any different on his choices for the courts, gun control legislation, big government, etc.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • RazorbackerRazorbacker Senior Member Posts: 4,646 Senior Member
    Some of us don't recognize any difference between Hillary and Christie. I do not see how he would be any different on his choices for the courts, gun control legislation, big government, etc.

    I was in the car most of the day and had talk radio on. They played a clip of Christie going on about how he didn't think it was fair to kick Obama while he is down.
    What is up with these Northeast rinos who refuse to win? What won him Jersey will not fly in flyover country.
    Teach your children to love guns, they'll never be able to afford drugs
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Sam, why do you think the US isn't ready to elect a conservative?
    Because the lack of voter turn out last to round tells me otherwise.

    Because, face it even if you don't like it, Hillary has huge popularity among women. Right now, ANY Democrat for prez will win 98% black vote and Hillary will win, oh, 65% female vote.

    Also realize that the Clinton machine is powerful and smart and well funded. I don't say it's correct. But if you look down upon the election with an unbiased eye, you will see large blocs of voters who will vote for her. She'll run a smart campaign, too.

    To defeat her will require a huge groundswell of popular votes all across the nation and it will be hard.

    There simply aren't enough conservatives nationwide to switch the results in enough border-conservative states. Any Republican will win, say, Texas plus most of the south and a lot of the southwest. Demos will win NY and CAL. But middle states like Penn or Michigan or Wisconsin or Ohio, those are where the election will center. Plus of course Florida which is a "special case" southern state.

    The math is not arguable for 2016. Maybe by 2020 or 2024, sure, we'll have a wider conservative base. I can easily see this on the horizon and I'd be GLAD to agree w. Cali and other "hard core" conservatives here on the matter in a few more years. Just not 2016, sadly.

    Look what happened in Virginia. Total Democrat nutjob Terry McAuliffe narrowly beat a solid, first rank, excellent conservative Cuccinelli. The Demos outspent the Republicans about 5:1 and still nearly lost. Despite being a fine candidate, Cuccinelli just didn't make it.

    This is EXACTLY what we'll see in 2016 if we don't field a dynamic, energetic, and forceful candidate like Christie. He is the ONLY Republican who can best Hillary, believe me.

    And those who can't see any difference between Christie and Hillary? Well, ****, you just aren't reading the news or looking at the record of these people. Hillary would have signed ALL the anti-gun bills, Christie only signed some of them. Christie is very pro-business and not that much a hardcore union smudge. Christie is a genuine, old-fashioned, populist moderate Republican, like LaGuardia.

    Christie HAS the moxie to carry a number of mid-road states, something that MUST be done to win the Prez.

    If you guys really want to see 8 years of Hillary, if you want the UN small arms treaty ratified and enforced here in the USA, and if you want people like Eric Holder or John Kerry on Scotus for, oh, 30 years? By all means, hide in the root cellar if you're faced with not voting for your fave conservative.

    And let me ask AGAIN, folks like Cali and others, TELL me whom you think can actually win the election against Hillary in 2016. Name for me the conservative who WILL carry the moderate states needed to win. I'll be HAPPY to vote for that winning conservative. And, btw, I'll also be happy to vote for a winning Christie campaign -- believe me, it won't be the placid, self-defeating campaign that Romney ran.
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