Home Main Category Personal Defense

I'll just leave this here.................

ZeeZee Senior MemberPosts: 27,574 Senior Member
7B81FC00-8B84-442A-AACF-C707D8E50490_zps8lshn2ko.jpg

Never gave much thought to the man. But, I think I like him.
"To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
«1

Replies

  • KENFU1911KENFU1911 Senior Member Posts: 1,052 Senior Member
    He told it the way he saw it......no apologies ......I miss him....Ken
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    Times change, it's not 1974 any more. Modern powder and bullet technologies have made virtually every caliber into a "real weapon." Hornady's Critical Defense, Winchester's PDX1, and other SD loads from Federal, Remington, Cor-Bon, and others are real game changers. Now, as far as calibers go, they're all good. I wouldn't want to get hit with any of them nowadays.
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    There's really nothing wrong with the .380, it's just that people use them incorrectly.

    A .380 should go somewhere on your body that is designated for back-up use. In the event that your primary has gone down, you can't get to your assailant with your knife, and you can't get into cover to get your primary up and running again.......the .380 is perfect.



    The problem comes in when people stick a .380 in their pocket and think their carrying a gun. :tooth:
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    Twenty or so years ago, 4 cylinder engines were "rice burners" and suitable only for small economy cars. Times have changed, and with new technology, turbocharged fours are putting out more horsepower than V8s with twice the displacement. No longer consigned to entry-level econoboxes, high-revving, high- output four-bangers are found under the hoods of many luxury models from all the prestige marques.

    Welcome to the 21st century. Today's ammo ain't Jeff Cooper's ammo. But I can understand anyone's reticence to change their minds. Old habits, old beliefs, old pre-conceived notions die hard. Heck, look at me, I just bought a new daily driver - a rather minty 1997 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC. Under the hood? A 4.6 liter, 32 valve, 290 HP Cobra block V8. Not the most, or the least, just perfect for my needs and wants. I wouldn't be caught dead driving a 4 cylinder "rice burner," turbocharged or not.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 25,045 Senior Member
    "High Revving" equals "Undriveable in the real world".
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • topguntopgun Member Posts: 128 Member
    Eli wrote: »
    There's really nothing wrong with the .380, it's just that people use them incorrectly.

    A .380 should go somewhere on your body that is designated for back-up use. In the event that your primary has gone down, you can't get to your assailant with your knife, and you can't get into cover to get your primary up and running again.......the .380 is perfect.



    The problem comes in when people stick a .380 in their pocket and think their carrying a gun. :tooth:

    This pretty much says it all.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Make mine a 440 Dodge with a 727 Torqueflite and a Dana 60 positraction rear end- - - - - -and a 1911 in .45 ACP, please!
    Jerry
  • topguntopgun Member Posts: 128 Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Make mine a 440 Dodge with a 727 Torqueflite and a Dana 60 positraction rear end- - - - - -and a 1911 in .45 ACP, please!
    Jerry

    HEMI for me, but the 1911 is good.
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    "High Revving" equals "Undriveable in the real world".

    Tell that to the millions of cars with red lines above 7000.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    There's really nothing wrong with the .380, it's just that people mistake it for an effective defensive round.

    fify
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • BAMAAKBAMAAK Senior Member Posts: 4,484 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    There's really nothing wrong with the .380, it's just that people use them incorrectly.

    A .380 should go somewhere on your body that is designated for back-up use. In the event that your primary has gone down, you can't get to your assailant with your knife, and you can't get into cover to get your primary up and running again.......the .380 is perfect.



    The problem comes in when people stick a .380 in their pocket and think their carrying a gun. :tooth:

    Yea because 9mm is SOOO much more powerful
    "He only earns his freedom and his life Who takes them every day by storm."

    -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, German writer and politician
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    BAMAAK wrote: »
    Yea because 9mm is SOOO much more powerful

    Any standard defensive pistol cartridge pretty much sucks in regards to terminal performance for the most part. But, one has to draw the line somewhere and say, "No less than this."
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 25,045 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    Tell that to the millions of cars with red lines above 7000.
    I will and gladly. They might do well on the track, but I drive in the real world.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,405 Senior Member
    Well, it's still a pocket auto pistol and not a real weapon, but there is still a place for the pocket auto pistol.

    The most common error I see is folks thinking they're making the little rounds more effective with hollowpoints; THEY ARE NOT! When you have that little energy being dispensed, you have to choose between the penetration you need or the expansion you want. It takes at least a 9mm to get both. An FMJ .380 might do you some good. Expanding .380? Hope your opponent is really, REALLY skinny.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • BAMAAKBAMAAK Senior Member Posts: 4,484 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    Any standard defensive pistol cartridge pretty much sucks in regards to terminal performance for the most part. But, one has to draw the line somewhere and say, "No less than this."

    Says who? Aren't more people killed with .22 than any other caliber? They are all deadly when applied to the proper body part. I think emphasis should be placed on ability more than bigger is better. The 10 or 15% more energy a 9mm has over a .380 means squat if not placed properly. Doesn't mean all that much if it is placed properly either. In 1974 maybe, but today a Buffalo Bore 90 gr 380 JHP going 1150 fps is pretty deadly IMO. In 1974, most .45 hollow points would not even mushroom. Maybe we should all be carrying S&W .500 revolvers.
    "He only earns his freedom and his life Who takes them every day by storm."

    -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, German writer and politician
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    Or carbines!
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,894 Senior Member
    There is a difference between killing someone and stopping an armed, aggressive attacker. .22s may kill, but they rarely stop.
    I'm just here for snark.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    It would appear you draw your line at .22 lr, BAMAAK. Good for you.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,992 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Make mine a 440 Dodge with a 727 Torqueflite and a Dana 60 positraction rear end- - - - - -and a 1911 in .45 ACP, please!
    Jerry

    Except you carry a P64!

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • SlanteyedshootistSlanteyedshootist Senior Member Posts: 3,947 Senior Member
    "Rice burners" are **** built cars and motorcycles. 4 cylinder American cars were just called "slow".

    As far as the 380 goes, I can conceal carry both a 1911 Government and a LCR 357 at the same time. I don't need a 380.

    I won't stand in front of one to be shot but I wouldn't want to stand in front of a guy shooting at me with a 22 or even a pellet gun. Okaasan didn't raise no fool. Well, at least not complete fool.
    The answer to 1984 is 1776
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    BAMAAK wrote: »
    Says who?


    A little bird told me.

    :-)
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • BAMAAKBAMAAK Senior Member Posts: 4,484 Senior Member
    There is a difference between killing someone and stopping an armed, aggressive attacker. .22s may kill, but they rarely stop.

    I know a cop that hit a bad guy square in the chest with a .45 beratta and he kept coming.
    "He only earns his freedom and his life Who takes them every day by storm."

    -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, German writer and politician
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    BAMAAK wrote: »
    I know a cop that hit a bad guy square in the chest with a .45 beratta and he kept coming.

    Not sure what a beratta is, but thank you for making my point regarding pistol cartridges.

    :-)
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • SlanteyedshootistSlanteyedshootist Senior Member Posts: 3,947 Senior Member
    Maybe he should have shot him instead of hitting him with his pistol.
    The answer to 1984 is 1776
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    Folks, we all make our own choices in regards to what we carry. We all live with that choice. I can't make yours for you as you cannot make mine. When it's over and done, I hope we made the right one.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • BAMAAKBAMAAK Senior Member Posts: 4,484 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    Not sure what a beratta is, but thank you for making my point regarding pistol cartridges.

    :-)

    Pardon my typo, I guess if I was perfect, I'd carry a 9mm.

    I don't think I made your point at all. Maybe her slow .45 didn't mushroom? It was the late 90s. Perhaps if she had a smaller caliber she would have been on target better since she was in a gunfight with 3 bad guys and was shot 7 times. No way of knowing. My point is bigger does not always mean better.
    "He only earns his freedom and his life Who takes them every day by storm."

    -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, German writer and politician
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    I was joking about the spelling. That's where the :-) came in. But, you did make my point regarding defensive pistol cartridges. So again, thanks.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    Did I read it correctly that she was shot 7 times? By chance, was she shot with a defensive pistol cartridge?
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    BAMAAK wrote: »
    .......she was in a gunfight with 3 bad guys and was shot 7 times.

    This is the portion I'm referring to. What was she shot with? Was it by chance........something smaller than a .45 ACP? Possibly bigger?
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,574 Senior Member
    You have piqued my interest, my friend. Yes, yes.........my interest in piqued! Seven times is a fair amount of rounds. Do share.

    :popcorn:
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
Sign In or Register to comment.
Magazine Cover

GET THE MAGAZINE Subscribe & Save

Temporary Price Reduction

SUBSCRIBE NOW

Give a Gift   |   Subscriber Services

PREVIEW THIS MONTH'S ISSUE

GET THE NEWSLETTER Join the List and Never Miss a Thing.

Get the top Guns & Ammo stories delivered right to your inbox every week.

Advertisement