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No Guns for Medical Marijuana Users

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Replies

  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 2,330 Senior Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    Agreed. I don't approve of the use of Marijuana, but I surely see no point in criminalizing it when alcohol is far more widely abused.

    Luis

    Agreed. That along with Tenmike's response. I think we need to look at why it was made illegal in the first place. Not only are the origins extremely racist, there was also the profit margin. William Randolph Hearst owned many forest companies. Hemp paper would have cut into his profit margin, so he and his buddies cooked up the Marijuana label, since farmers knew how valuable hemp was. They had to call it something else in order to demonize it and have it removed as a threat.

    Also recall that the US grew hemp during World War Two to help the war effort. Yes I know they are different, but it all seems like we have a major portion of our lawmakers involved in an inquisition. Time to come out of the dark ages. Pot is less harmful that alcohol and alcohol is legal. Common sense isn't involved after that.

    It can help the economy. It can save resources. It can help with soil erosion. With all the HUGE issues on the plates of the entire world, we really need to focus on more important items.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • Mike S.Mike S. New Member Posts: 17 New Member
    BigDanS wrote: »
    I agree with the BATFE on this one, because firearms ownership and transfer is regulated under federal law. Federal law states that illegal users of controlled substances may not possess firearms, and pot is still a federaly banned substance, in spite of State laws allowing its medicinal use.

    Their policy is consistant. If medicinal pot smokers want to own guns they need to get the Fed's / FDA to recognize it as a medicinal substance.

    Alchohol is legal and it's OK to own both guns and alchohol. I can have a prescription for a wide variety of drugs and still own a firearm.

    D

    I concur 100%. Legal gun ownership extends to law abiding citizens only. By federal law, marijuana is illegal. Ergo, no guns for you. Additionally, it alters one's reflexes, mood and judgment. Which, like many drugs (legal and otherwise) is dangerous when operating such devices as heavy equipment and firearms.

    I find it ironic that many who reside in states that fought against the South's legitimate struggle for state rights against a federal "big brother" sort of government now want their own revised state constitutions to trump the central government's rulings.
    "The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it.”- Thomas Jefferson
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 2,330 Senior Member
    The drug war has failed, especially against MJ. How many billions are wasted on this every year? One of the only reasons they still do it, is so the departments that bust certain operations, sell the cars and houses to line the pockets of the departments. Every Wednesday, Section D of USA Today newspaper lists the latest confiscations by the Drug Enforcement Administration. There, in tiny 7-point type, you will find the latest list of weekly seizures of pocket cash, bank accounts, cars, and homes, by just this one government agency. That's why the Feds don't want to make it legal.

    The BATF is following the lead of the Feral ( Federal) Government. Prohibition didn't work with alcohol, it won't work with MJ either. Might as well tax it and make some cash in the process. Let the people go get one with their lives.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    Jermanator wrote: »
    I just believe that the whole pot lobby has gone way overboard in its medicinal claims. Its use is just a few of thousands of OTC/folk/herbal remedies that are out there. Quit telling me about the doctor/big pharma conspiracy.

    The pot lobby is going overboard with medicinal claims. If an executive, engineer, or plumber gets a medical card to simply get high, society will realize that these people still function just fine. It's part of the legaliza...I mean decriminalization process.

    Do quick search and find out who spends the most money lobbying against MM when it's on some state's ballot. I'll give you some hints. One is law enforcement. One is the alcohol lobby. I'll let you find the other lobby on your own. Then you can accuse me of conspiracy theories.
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    Mike S. wrote: »
    I concur 100%. Legal gun ownership extends to law abiding citizens only. By federal law, marijuana is illegal. Ergo, no guns for you. Additionally, it alters one's reflexes, mood and judgment. Which, like many drugs (legal and otherwise) is dangerous when operating such devices as heavy equipment and firearms.

    I find it ironic that many who reside in states that fought against the South's legitimate struggle for state rights against a federal "big brother" sort of government now want their own revised state constitutions to trump the central government's rulings.


    Sorry Mike, I'm still a big fan of that federal document that says "shall not be infringed."

    How about this: A 20 year old shoots trap. He gets caught drinking a beer at a party. Does this person lose their gun rights?
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • robert38-55robert38-55 Senior Member Posts: 3,621 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Hmmmm- - - - - -this gives a whole new meaning to the word "Stoner" when talking about an M-16!
    :rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao:
    Jerry

    Teach I have always loved your sense of Humor!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:spittingcoffee:
    "It is what it is":usa:
  • robert38-55robert38-55 Senior Member Posts: 3,621 Senior Member
    Well here is some data I located on the web, all I am going to say on this subject is form ya own opinion.


    61.(marijuana and social policy) Commissioned by President Nixon in 1972, the National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse concluded that "Marihuana's relative potential for harm to the vast majority of individual users and its actual impact on society does not justify a social policy designed to seek out and firmly punish those who use it. This judgment is based on prevalent use patterns, on behavior exhibited by the vast majority of users and on our interpretations of existing medical and scientific data. This position also is consistent with the estimate by law enforcement personnel that the elimination of use is unattainable."

    Source: Shafer, Raymond P., et al, Marihuana: A Signal of Misunderstanding, Ch. V, (Washington DC: National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse, 1972).
    http://druglibrary.net/schaffer/Library/studies/nc/ncrec.htm


    (marijuana and violence) When examining the relationship between marijuana use and violent crime, the National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse concluded, "Rather than inducing violent or aggressive behavior through its purported effects of lowering inhibitions, weakening impulse control and heightening aggressive tendencies, marihuana was usually found to inhibit the expression of aggressive impulses by pacifying the user, interfering with muscular coordination, reducing psychomotor activities and generally producing states of drowsiness lethargy, timidity and passivity."

    Source: Shafer, Raymond P., et al, Marihuana: A Signal of Misunderstanding, Ch. III, (Washington DC: National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse, 1972).
    http://druglibrary.net/schaffer/Library/studies/nc/ncc3.htm


    Read more from this link:


    http://drugwarfacts.org/cms/?q=node/53
    "It is what it is":usa:
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,457 Senior Member
    Pavlovian conditioning response training since 1937 has worked marvelously. Federal government passes law regulating(taxing) marijuana. News media and Federal government go full court press on propaganda and outright lies about marijuana effects, even going to the trouble of making a hilarious film about the 'devil weed'. After 40+ years the propaganda campaign steps up as marijuana use sees sharp rise with hippies and others; these people are demonized for marijuana use. Propaganda mill in hyperdrive. War on Drugs campaign is instituted. People have been conditioned 50+ years to accept this new concept. (No one has adequately explained how a war can be waged on an inanimate object). More Pavlovian conditioning makes the Patriot Act seem like a good idea, the masses want to be 'safe', and are now willing to give up freedom for a perceived safety. There is a continuing dearth of fact, but a massive overabundance of opinion and 'feelings' instilled in the majority of people from the continual bombardment of the gov't and media propaganda that has run unabated since 1937.

    "If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State."
    Joseph Goebbels (Propoganda Minister)
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    :popcorn:

    I remember this topic coming up before on the past boards. Always an interesting thread....but my, how opinions have changed.
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,824 Senior Member
    tennmike wrote: »
    News media and Federal government go full court press on propaganda and outright lies about marijuana effects, even going to the trouble of making a hilarious film about the 'devil weed'.
    Wasn't that movie called "Killer Weed?"
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    I think he was referring to "Reefer Madness"
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,457 Senior Member
    Yes, the movie was "Reefer Madness". However, back in olden times, when I was in HS, the old folks called it "that devil weed"; sometimes using some more colorful language to describe it. But "Reefer Madness" is one of those must watch movies if you've never seen it before. No eating or drinking while watching it, however. Too much risk of choking on food and drink while laughing.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • SirGeorgeKillianSirGeorgeKillian Senior Member Posts: 5,463 Senior Member
    It makes me think how the HIPPA laws would play into this. It is nobody's business what prescription medicine I am on. If the ATF pulled that on me, I would sue the gov't for violation of HIPPA...... Not sure where it would go, but it would at least be another wrench in the machine....

    Sent from my Motorola Atrix 4G via Tapatalk
    Unless life also hands you water and sugar, your lemonade is gonna suck!
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    I'm in love with a Glock
  • ghostsniper1ghostsniper1 Banned Posts: 2,645 Senior Member
    I wonder how many people that have posted their opinions on this subject have even smoked pot??? If anybody here is just going by what the masses have told them all of their life...... well, then their opinion is full of prejudice and ignorance. I for one do not smoke MJ, but used to in my younger days. Its no biggie, just the munchies and cottonmouth. Doesnt cause violence, stumbbling, mummbling, or anything even close to being drunk. Hell, I even fired guns with much success when I used to smoke and it seemed to heighten my concentration.
  • Wheelsman56Wheelsman56 Member Posts: 225 Member
    :popcorn:

    I remember this topic coming up before on the past boards. Always an interesting thread....but my, how opinions have changed.

    Yup I brought this up a few months back when another state enacted a similar law. I have never smoked pot, however I do not see how it is any different than alcohol. I like to drink at times, but as we all know guns and booze dont mix. As long as a person isnt high when they are carrying/shooting, I could care less.
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,721 Senior Member
    I wonder how many people that have posted their opinions on this subject have even smoked pot??? If anybody here is just going by what the masses have told them all of their life...... well, then their opinion is full of prejudice and ignorance. I for one do not smoke MJ, but used to in my younger days. Its no biggie, just the munchies and cottonmouth. Doesnt cause violence, stumbbling, mummbling, or anything even close to being drunk. Hell, I even fired guns with much success when I used to smoke and it seemed to heighten my concentration.

    Yea that's it.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    I used to. Been about......7 years. After I made over a half dozen trips to Amsterdam with work, I figured I'd had as good as it was ever going to get. I don't any longer, and lost any desire to. I never smoked and handled guns, just as I've never handled guns while drunk. Yes, I shot a gun once after a few sips of a beer, but given my tolerance levels and body size, 1/4 of a light beer does not qualify as under the influence.

    So, I make my statements from seeing both sides.
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • ghostsniper1ghostsniper1 Banned Posts: 2,645 Senior Member
    Oh yeah, just to add..... I dont condone the use of MJ or handling of firearms while stoned or whatever. Every person is different with how they respond to MJ. I can though attest that it is nothing close to an alcohol buzz, AT ALL. I used to be able to function just fine when stoned, including driving, working (yeah douchbaggery,) shopping, talking, walking, etc..... I just lost interest when my first child was born and I realized that there were more important things in life.
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,721 Senior Member
    Oh yeah, just to add..... I dont condone the use of MJ or handling of firearms while stoned or whatever. Every person is different with how they respond to MJ. I can though attest that it is nothing close to an alcohol buzz, AT ALL. I used to be able to function just fine when stoned, including driving, working (yeah douchbaggery,) shopping, talking, walking, etc..... I just lost interest when my first child was born and I realized that there were more important things in life.

    Seems from your experiences that you never had good weed.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • ghostsniper1ghostsniper1 Banned Posts: 2,645 Senior Member
    Buford wrote: »
    Seems from your experiences that you never had good weed.
    hahahahahahahaha. lmao. If I could figure out the emoticons..... I would have the one that is rolling on the floor laughing his arse off. Nah I had some good stuff in the past though. But like I said..... some people react different than others.
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,824 Senior Member
    I think he was referring to "Reefer Madness"
    Right..damn...I got the CRS disease(can't remember s...)
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,721 Senior Member
    Doesnt cause violence, stumbbling, mummbling, or anything even close to being drunk. Hell, I even fired guns with much success when I used to smoke and it seemed to heighten my concentration.

    You know I can say the same with alcohol. It improves my driving skills and definitely smooths out the rough edges at the shooting range it also improves my social skills. Now I can smoke or drink myself into a stupor but if used properly it enhances my driving and shooting skills.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,721 Senior Member
    Right..damn...I got the CRS disease(can't remember s...)

    You find a cure for that be sure to share.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,824 Senior Member
    Buford wrote: »
    You find a cure for that be sure to share.
    I will, but first I have to stop smoking weed and drinking alcohol.
    :uhm:
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • blueslide88blueslide88 Member Posts: 273 Member
    BigDanS wrote: »
    Like I said earlier, MM / MJ is a federally controlled substance and not legal to the federal government. Fed law states you are not allowed to own a gun and illegally use controled substances, therefore, MM users by fed law are illegal drug users. Their policy is consistant with the Fed law, no matter what I personally think.

    I believe the law frowns on alchohol use and gun play as well. You can own a bottle of scotch, but don't drink and shoot.

    D

    I agree with both your posts. The BATFE is simply enforcing federal law. I am far from convinced that pot is a harmless substance. The MM guise seems to have opened a pandora's box of available pot for everyone with a stubbed toe or a headache. If it's proven that MJ has true medicinal uses, then fine, treat it like any other pharmacy drug, with no pot stores like they have in CA. I don't think that encouraging indiscriminate pot use is a desirable thing in our society. And disobeying the law is even a worse example for our youth and citizenry.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Buford wrote: »
    Now I can smoke or drink myself into a stupor but if used properly it enhances my driving and shooting skills.

    Good point, Buford- - - - -plus, it improves eating skills, also! Ask David Hasslehoff!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkGUI4bnQbQ&feature=related

    :beer::beer::beer:
    Jerry
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,824 Senior Member
    Hard to believe he actually allowed himself to be video taped while in that condition.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,611 Senior Member
    Toldya that stuff would make you stupid!
    Overkill is underrated.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Hard to believe he actually allowed himself to be video taped while in that condition.

    Ask any confirmed drunk or stoner- - - - - - -they don't have a problem- - - -everybody else does! With enough chemical enhancement, any loser's self-image can be wonderful! That's why they use the stuff in the first place!
    Jerry
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,486 Senior Member
    The BATFE is simply enforcing federal law.

    AND
    And disobeying the law is even a worse example for our youth and citizenry.


    The irony of these two statements.
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


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