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A bit of apology and an explanation of sorts...

samzheresamzhere BannedPosts: 10,923 Senior Member
Recently in the missing airliner thread, I sort of went "know it all" and threw things off the top of my head.

Now, I realize that most here would be surprised to find that I occasionally act the "expert" even if I'm not, and provide some general laughter accordingly. Naturally I am always believed, right, ha ha!

I mentioned Hamlet in that other thread, lemme 'splain ya...

Hamlet's seen his father's ghost, who accuses the king Claudius of murdering him. Hamlet's pals Horatio and 2 guards witness this, and so they are in the know. Hamlet swears them to secrecy, which they agree. Then he also cautions them to not make asides that hint that they know the truth but can't speak of it:

With arms encumber’d thus, or this headshake, Or by pronouncing of some doubtful phrase, As “Well, well, we know,” or “We could, an if we would,” Or “If we list to speak,” or “There be, an if they might,” Or such ambiguous giving out...

I was making this sort of pronouncement when I talked about some prior knowledge of secrets without being able to disclose the secrets themselves. There was some rebuttal that folks with secrets aren't likely to disclose them.

Not necessarily, I say. Back in the 60s when I was 20-something, I worked for Uncle a couple years, out of Greenbelt Md, in a secure (later top secret) job. I'd hang out in Georgetown in this terrific Irish tavern on Avenue M (I forget the bar's name -- it may still be there). If you happened to go to any general bar along M, mostly Fern Bars where yuppies frequented, you'd find 19 of 20 guys claiming they worked for "The Company" (or at that time, what was jokingly labeled as the Bureau of Public Roads -- that was the sign at the entrance). When in fact, the vast majority of them were clerks for places like the Commerce Dept.

Even so, occasionally you'd come across someone who was just tipsy enough to tell you the truth -- that he really did work for some secret agency, but wasn't tipsy enough to disclose any secrets. Sort of like the warnings that Hamlet gave. But hints were given out regardless. And in most places, you'd also occasionally come across a reporter who was skilled enough to ask the right questions artfully. And get some info.

I mentioned in the other thread that we (the US) had been able to track Russian subs from the moment they left home port. And this was done regardless of the depth or other factors.

I knew this to be true and some others here also know this. I also knew how it was done but you won't find me saying how. I'm unsure whether that knowledge is still secret. I do know that the fact that we DID track the Russian subs was widely known and mentioned in occasional newspaper articles.

After the 60s I stayed in contact with some of my gummint pals, and we'd chat and sometimes they'd talk about something not generally known. So, like Hamlet's pals, I knew what but I couldn't even say "Well... if I could say, I'd be able too tell you..." and idiotic stuff like that.

Nevertheless, I occasionally did talk about such things. And in '92 I worked for the Secret Service during the Republican national convention. And picked up some keen info regarding scanners, stuff that very few people knew at that time.

So in the discussion about this missing airliner, I spoke about "chatter" and it was disputed. So be it, differences of opinion are just fine and each opinion is generally valid. I also made hints that people like the Israelis pretty much know what's going on. And that if an airliner were landed on, for example, Iranian soil, the US (and Israel) would know it. I'm pretty certain of this but that's just my somewhat educated opinion. And I'm often wrong, possibly about this, too. So sue me, ha ha.

But I sounded arrogant and I want to apologize about that. I didn't mean to diss anyone else.

Sorry and I hope you all understand my rather disjointed post. Kay?


  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 17,421 Senior Member
    SOSUS isn't classified anymore.....if that's what you're referring to....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Yeah, Sosus among other things. You're right.
  • LMLarsenLMLarsen Senior Member Posts: 8,337 Senior Member
    Hell, even the USS Parchee's mission has been declassified.
    “A gun is a tool, no better or no worse than any other tool: an axe, a shovel or anything. A gun is as good or as bad as the man using it. Remember that.”

    NRA Endowment Member
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    I knew a guy who was on the Parche (one 'e'). He and I got to know each other from first meeting in a security seminar back in DC. We were both dart players and we enjoyed many a game of 301 or cricket. Per usual, I knew what he did on the sub but he and I couldn't discuss it. Weird how that works.

    And zillion to one odds, I met him again in '84 in Yokohama when we were at a computer conference. Boy, did we drink deep into the Suntory that week!
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