Defending your dog from K9 attack.

JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior MemberPosts: 6,102 Senior Member
The scenario :

You walk your dog like every evening and know your neighborhood dogs well. None of them that you know of are human aggressive. Your dog is on a lead and obedient to your commands. You are carrying your EDC.

Another dog of large enough size to draw concern barks and gets your attention as it scales it's short yard fence and makes a bee-line for your dog, snarling and convincing you quite strongly it intends to attack your dog.

Is this a shoot situation? Do you try and fend off the dog without your firearm? Is there another option in your mind here?
“There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers

Replies

  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    JasonMPD wrote: »

    Is this a shoot situation?

    Yes.

    I'm obviously checking fore/background.....but yes, the attacker is going to catch a round.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,564 Senior Member
    This very thing happened to me about a year ago. I was walking my Blue Heeler on a leash with my kids. On me I had my CCW and a couple knives as always.

    A dog about lab size(who always barks at us) came running around the side of his house (he is usually on a chain) and barking and growling, charged in our direction. The events are as follows:

    - I stepped in front of kids.
    - Right hand pulled my dog to the rear.
    - Left hand drew knife.
    - Left foot kicked charging dog in the head.
    - Repositioned in front of kids and pulled my dog to rear (she was trying to come around me to the other dog).
    - Strange dog approached again (at this point I knew he was going for my dog).
    - Kicked him in the head again.
    - Repeat all again.

    By this point, after the third kick to the head, the neighbor ran around the corner as he heard all the barking, growling, screaming, yelling. I nicely advised him I was going to kill his dog and he ran over and grabbed him.

    I didn't say a word after that. I turned, and walked away. Kids and dog following.

    I did not feel the need to use deadly force up to that point as I determined he was going for my dog and not my kids. Had he gotten a mouth full of me or my dog, I'd have stuck him.

    Every situation is different and needs to be assessed and responded to accordingly. I assessed and reacted as I deemed necessary. I chose not to shoot. That time. Under those circumstances.

    There are no scripts.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 23,897 Senior Member
    Some places yes, other places you will go to court for shooting the dog.
    A Veteran is someone that served in the Military, it does not matter where they served.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 10,043 Senior Member
    Especially if you're defending your dog. If you're defending yourself, a different case. I think it depends on your local laws and where you are.

    When I walk, I carry a stick just in case. I doubt you'd get in trouble for doing what Zee did, or for taking a stick to the dog.
    Not too many problems you can't fix
    With a 1911 and a 30-06
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 8,528 Senior Member
    We have a little dog and once in a while a dog in the neighborhood acts aggresive. I almost always have my EDC on me but would use that as a last resort. Lately I have been putting a ASP in my back pocket, but luckily so far have not needed to do more than aggresively shoo away a lab size dog.
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 9,458 Senior Member
    Depends on the dog. Most dogs can be dissuaded with a few kicks. Something like a Pit or a Chow? I'm pulling and getting ready right off the bat.....
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 14,834 Senior Member
    In the world of firefighters, there is a concept known as "try before you pry"...the concept being try the obvious solution (turn the door knob) before you tear down the door....

    As to the OP...try hollering "NO" forcefully and in a commanding voice before you go blowing gaping bloody holes in fido....Most dogs that have contact with humans know and understand the word.

    Some years ago, I attended a course hosted by the Michigan State Police entitled..."How Not to Get Bit"...Every dog handler advised that hollering "NO" avoiding eye contact and not moving will shut down even trained dogs. They then suited us up and showed us that it worked with their dogs....

    Now it doesn't work 100% of the time or with all dogs...(when faced with a fear biter - it's likely you're gonna get bit)...but it's certainly worth a try...

    As with people, going to guns should be a last resort...

    Depending on your locale you may end up in jail and charged with animal abuse/discharging a firearm in city limits or going home with positive comments about your marksmanship....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,564 Senior Member
    In my youth and younger adult years, I've been bitten 3 times. Once by a Doberman in the shin. Once by a German Shepard in the ear. The last was a Heeler in my peck.

    Since then, I've been bitten many a time with protective gear on and dealt with many dogs while..........exploring new locations.

    Dogs don't worry me much anymore. Very few have the balls to see an attack through when you are more violent than they.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 18,662 Senior Member
    Never been actually "attacked" by a dog, though have taken more hits while either in a bite suit, or the dog muzzled, than I can remember.

    Have had packs of feral dogs roam through on occasion, 2 had my BiL and FiL trapped in their shop. BiL called around lunch time and ask me to come to the shop and bring a rifle. I pulled up, both "Chow" type mutts hackled up at me. I took care of those two. A couple of days later, the rest of that pack got after a young girl between her house and the school bus stop. Luckily the driver saw what was happening and got the girl back on the bus. Her dad and his friends took care of the rest of that pack.
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 14,834 Senior Member
    Dealing with aggressive feral dogs is one thing...dealing with a loose pet, high on freedom and wanting to display his dominance to the world is another...the former need a bullet, plain and simple...with the latter you have some options....not necessarily fatal ones...simply being "more dominant" will often get the job done...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • olesniperolesniper Senior Member Posts: 3,738 Senior Member
    Had a dog come around the side of my house, as I was taking my dog out, to put him on his chain. Strange dog charged and I yelled and drew my foot back, to try for a field goal, but the stray swapped ends, before he came within range. I got home from shopping, one day, a couple of years ago, and as I was stepping out of my truck, I saw something out of the corner of my eye. I turned and saw a pit bull charging me. I yelled several unprintable words, as I drew my Ruger P345. The dog veered off, about 3 feet short of catching a couple of 230 gr. .45acp HST rounds. I called the law. Before they arrived, my neighbor got home and said the dog belonged to a guy, on the next block. Dog went home, before the cops got there. I told them what the neighbor said and told them to tell the owner that he damn near lost a dog.
    Ain't no way, I'm gonna get bit in my own yard.
    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
    I will fear no evil: For I carry a .308 and not a .270
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 15,053 Senior Member
    I have been charged quite a few times but never attacked. I go to a whole lot of abandoned homes in less than nice neighborhoods. I have drawn on a few dogs, but have always seemed to put something between me and the dog before I needed to pull the trigger.
  • gatorgator Senior Member Posts: 1,689 Senior Member
    I've been charged a couple times but a loud yell got them off, a pack of four dogs attacked my blue heeler one night and tore him up pretty bad........followed them out into the desert with my old 16ga and some #4 shot..........only one survived.
    USMC 80-84
    -96 lbs
  • DanChamberlainDanChamberlain Senior Member Posts: 3,353 Senior Member
    I'm gonna have to take a bite before I shoot, unless my kids are in danger.

    Neighbor has a couple of boxers who are probably the world's best dogs, except when other dogs come around. They've tried twice to get my animals and they actually came into our yard while I was escorting our dogs around the yard for their evening business. (No fence). In the first case, they made a beeline for the larger and our smaller tore into them! I kicked one really hard in the stomach and he headed home yelping. The other, I had to kick in the head before it got the idea it wasn't welcome. I called the neighbor and told him that in my yard, his dogs are meat, next time they come to visit. For a while I took to carrying a Zulu short spear while taking the dogs for their evening business in our yard, and making sure he saw it (this was before concealed carry came to Illinois).

    Our twin mutts have since passed on and we now have a little dog who we walk every night. Twice they have come onto the sidewalk growling and snapping and in once case I picked one up by his collar and dangled him in front of the owner who was getting a bit upset. My wife picked up our dog and the other boxer was focused on the dog and not my wife so I didn't see the need to shoot him.

    The owner got his dogs under control and I told him my patients had worn out. Next time, it's a police report.

    But, they were boxers so I didn't feel too frightened. A pitt, rott or some such might get me to change my mind.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    It happened to me, pit gets away from stupid owner and races towards my docile and uninterested pit mix, I had my CCW, but opted to confront the pit instead, I harmlessly flipped the pit onto his back and dominated the pit into puppy dog submission, and returned an unharmed cowed puppy back to his stupid owner, him I wanted to beat to a pulp but did not.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • SirGeorgeKillianSirGeorgeKillian Senior Member Posts: 5,458 Senior Member
    We have a neighbor down the road a good ways who has a few pits that they walk with no lead. I'm not against pits, I'm against stupid people. My next door neighbor already had a run in with these idiots. If he comes into my yard, I will do what I have to do. Especially if my dog or kid is out there.
    Unless life also hands you water and sugar, your lemonade is gonna suck!
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    I'm in love with a Glock
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Years ago I was walking with my late father, and a Shepard mix comes running out of a house growling and snapping like a demon, we were on the sidewalk, and the dog still in the fenced in part making for an open gate, the dogs leash got tangled in the fences iron ornaments and he was stuck fast and howling mad, I stood in front of My father and prepared to shoot, suddenly the dogs owner comes running out and recovered his dog.

    The guy was mad because he could see I was prepared to shoot, and he had lots of nasty comments about policemen etc, I could have shot, however it was quite unnecessary in any case.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,764 Senior Member
    I've been bitten a few times when it was not legal to CCW. When I was riding a bike, a found that a jumbo head driver golf club was most efficacious in getting a dog bent on biting to cease that behavior. And found out later, by accident, that a 6 ft. length of 3/4" sch. 40 PVC pipe works about as well. If the dog ignores the order to "STOP!" twice and advances, then they are gonna get the hell beaten out of them if they advance and hang around after the first whack.

    I think it would be a lot more efficient to beat the hell out of the owner of the untrained dog, but the law has different ideas about that.
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • wddodgewddodge Senior Member Posts: 992 Senior Member
    Quite a few years ago I worked for a John Deere dealer and a lot of our work was done out at the farm. I found that giving a dog a quick sniff of ether would change the pooches intensions rather quickly.

    Denny
    Participating in a gun buy back program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids.... Clint Eastwood
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 21,802 Senior Member
    Gene L wrote: »
    Especially if you're defending your dog. If you're defending yourself, a different case. I think it depends on your local laws and where you are.

    When I walk, I carry a stick just in case. I doubt you'd get in trouble for doing what Zee did, or for taking a stick to the dog.

    Yeah, but who is going to nit pick whether you were defending yourself or your dog? All you have to say is that damn dog was charging me aggressively trying to hurt US. Don't have to bring up about your fear for your dog.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 21,802 Senior Member
    When I was a kid back in the 50s there was something people used to scare dogs like that off. It was something called Highlite or Highlife? Not sure, but I think it had ammonia in it or something that burned the dog and it kept burning for awhile and made the dog turn tail and haul it to the next Zip Code. Just one squirt was all that was required or so I was told. But lots of people and Postmen used it. Anybody here know what I'm talking about?
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Yeah, the amonia based dog repellents, dogs sense of smell exceeds ours by many thousands of times their brains are over 30% devoted to smell, amonia hits them like a sledge hammer. Like super urine, it burns and they hate it, they havev to run away.

    You can make it yourself and use a metal spray pump to deliver it.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 10,043 Senior Member
    snake284 wrote: »
    When I was a kid back in the 50s there was something people used to scare dogs like that off. It was something called Highlite or Highlife? Not sure, but I think it had ammonia in it or something that burned the dog and it kept burning for awhile and made the dog turn tail and haul it to the next Zip Code. Just one squirt was all that was required or so I was told. But lots of people and Postmen used it. Anybody here know what I'm talking about?

    Thanks for filling in a missing piece of my young life. When I was about seven, I read a book called "Harbin's Ridge," could be Harben's. Anyway, it was about a family in KY and was one of those book of the month club books above my age level. But it talks about "High Lifeing" a dog. Until I saw your post, I had no idea what it meant.

    The stuff was called "High Life" I found out from the Internet. It was widely used on the farm for dissuading animals.
    Not too many problems you can't fix
    With a 1911 and a 30-06
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,258 Senior Member
    "High Life" is the colloquial name for Carbon Disulfide. It was fairly readily available 50-something years ago around farm supply stores for various farming uses, but it's probably highly restricted now because of several pretty nasty properties including being EXTREMELY flammable. It was even more effective than ammonia for repelling aggressive dogs.
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
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