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  • twatwa Senior Member Posts: 2,236 Senior Member
    I agree cpj. Big question will be grand fathered in or outlawed all together? (That's one of the main reasons I bought one because I didn't believe they would last either )
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 20,850 Senior Member
    Can't say I'm surprised. Actually I'm surprised it took them this long.
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • NCFUBARNCFUBAR Senior Member Posts: 4,324 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Not a chance, in my opinion will they be grandfathered. Just like the 10-22 stock from a few years back, the one that basically turned a 10-22 into a full auto. ATF first they told the maker it was cool. Then they said its not cool, and can we please have the names of those who bought them.

    I am still shocked the Slide Fires are still allowed also. As to the Sig brace, I guess the rubber tip off a crutch shaped a little is back in the mix for my AR pistol build.
    “The further a society drifts from truth ... the more it will hate those who speak it."
    - George Orwell
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Seems they would be happier with something bigger anyway, making the pistol less "Concealable".

    I'm trying to remember the mindset as to the reasoning why in our history snap-on or screw-on stocks added to handguns were deemed evil/unsporting...............was it someone could conceal a handgun and suddenly attach a stock and give them unfair advantage against an opponent or rifle-like stability in something sneaked in for an assassination of some kind?
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • DanChamberlainDanChamberlain Senior Member Posts: 3,395 Senior Member
    The braces won't be illegal, shouldering them will become illegal.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain
  • tubabucknuttubabucknut Banned Posts: 3,520 Senior Member
    twa wrote: »
    Saw that coming. Glad I didn't invest in one. Might I suggest just investing in the longer buffer tube, which when needed, increases the length of pull to a comfortable length.

    NCFUBAR Forget the crutch bumper. Lowes hardware section. Just buy the black furniture bumpers in the 1 1/8 size. They work great.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    The braces won't be illegal, shouldering them will become illegal.

    Which will make it a fallacy of law. I can shoulder an AR pistol buffer tube now. Uncomfortable, but doable. That's like selling a mallet and forbidding me from hold it it way up by the hammer's head.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,702 Senior Member
    I am SO surprised!

    Said nobody.
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • DanChamberlainDanChamberlain Senior Member Posts: 3,395 Senior Member
    JasonMPD wrote: »
    Which will make it a fallacy of law. I can shoulder an AR pistol buffer tube now. Uncomfortable, but doable. That's like selling a mallet and forbidding me from hold it it way up by the hammer's head.

    Jason, laws don't have to make sense. Hell, you enforce all sorts of laws that don't make sense and you do it every day. At the same time, a 16" carbine with a collapsable stock is a pretty short little thing. I'm not saying if it becomes an enforceable infraction that it somehow makes sense. At the same time, AR pistols don't make much sense to me either. I have a TC Contender with a 14" hunter barrel in .375 Winchester. It shoots like a rifle without a buttstock. The AR Pistol can as well with the appropriate sling.

    As for the hammer, if you use it to smash someone's head, does it matter where you hold it?
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain
  • Farm Boy DeuceFarm Boy Deuce Senior Member Posts: 6,083 Senior Member
    If you get the job done I don't suppose it matters where you hold it. On the other hand if you grip the hammer opposite the head smashing stuff is way more efficient, just like the sig brace.
    I am afraid we forget sometime that the basic and simple things brings us the most pleasure.
    Dad 5-31-13
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,288 Senior Member
    It was bound to happen sooner or later.

    What surprises me is that there are many ways to make a 'buttstock' for the AR pistols that is disguised as something else. Like a PVC monopod that is more than one piece for transport, made from 1 1/4 I.D. PVC pipe. Top of one Tee and two 30° ells with short connectors to the tee, and short lengths of pipe glued in the ells. Fill the 'buttstock shaft with something to get your particular length of pull. EZPZ, and it's a monopod, not a buttstock. This 'stuff' ain't rocket science.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • tubabucknuttubabucknut Banned Posts: 3,520 Senior Member
    This opinion appears completely unenforceable. Technically if it were followed as stated what makes it illegal is intent, so it's any "pistol" intended to be shouldered, even if just shouldering the buffer tube.
    On the contrary. I believe this is very enforceable, and sadly, may changes the whole dynamic of the AR pistol. Careful in public boys.
  • twatwa Senior Member Posts: 2,236 Senior Member
    Wasn't the ATF's stance "there is no wrong way to shoot a pistol"? I say grandfathered in and the end of making them. But time will tell.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    This opinion appears completely unenforceable. Technically if it were followed as stated what makes it illegal is intent, so it's any "pistol" intended to be shouldered, even if just shouldering the buffer tube.
    On the contrary. I believe this is very enforceable, and sadly, may changes the whole dynamic of the AR pistol. Careful in public boys.


    One, it should be un-enforceable. Key word, should . There is little, of any, due process with regards to ATF law-making. And in fact that's a whole other can of worms--a federal LEA making laws without Congress, but I digress.

    If you look at other things that are regulated largely administrative code, say, operating vehicles, you see law/code that permits the use of vehicles however you see fit as long as it isn't reckless or in wonton disregard for other's safety. I can drive with one hand, not two like I was taught. If my driving practice causes danger to others, then we have an issue.

    Shouldering a pistol is the same concept. As long as it isn't reckless or wonton behavior there shouldn't be any legally enforceable actions that can be taken.

    But liberals (aka "regulators") run everything so... I have my Sig brace and I ain't selling it or turning it in. It's a ghost stock. :tooth:
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,756 Senior Member
    I think you're looking for "wanton"...wonton is a Chinese dumpling... other than that...well said!
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,146 Senior Member
    Let them bumble, and present an non-unified, inconsistent front. When the governing body of NFA34 can't figure out the definitions of short-barreled long guns, handguns, and rifles, it only helps to highlight the nonsense of that error of the Roosevelt era. I've got no quarrel with them exposing the stupidity within the NFA. No quarrel at all. Nicely done boys! See y'all in court.:applause:
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Dagnabbit, Jayhawker- - - - -ya beat me to it!
    :jester:
    Jerry
  • SlanteyedshootistSlanteyedshootist Senior Member Posts: 3,947 Senior Member
    If I use a Sig brace to shoot from the hip like I've seen on TV am I in trouble? Are black helicopters going to buzz my abode?

    And speaking of wanton wonton, I'm hungry.
    The answer to 1984 is 1776
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,535 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    I think you're looking for "wanton"...wonton is a Chinese dumpling... other than that...well said!
    Teach wrote: »
    Dagnabbit, Jayhawker- - - - -ya beat me to it!
    :jester:
    Jerry

    Haha... Voice-to-Text: 1. Jason: 0.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    The new letter is an BATFE Opinion Letter. It's no more binding than the original letter that said shouldering a Sig Brace was allowed. It is, quite simply, the opinion of whoever was in the office at the time of "mail call". They've made no "official" ruling one way or another.


    atfu.jpg
  • toymachinetoymachine Senior Member Posts: 761 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    The new letter is an BATFE Opinion Letter. It's no more binding than the original letter that said shouldering a Sig Brace was allowed. It is, quite simply, the opinion of whoever was in the office at the time of "mail call". They've made no "official" ruling one way or another.


    atfu.jpg

    I seem to recall that situation not working out well for Newman.
    "Is 'milk bottle' literally a racist term?"
    "It is now." - Jack Fraggs
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