The .460 S&W Hammers Another One.

ZeeZee Senior MemberPosts: 20,737 Senior Member
Got a call from a friend to come shoot a doe. So, I packed up my boy and my .460 S&W Encore Pistol and headed to his place.

I've hunted here in the past, but it's been a couple years. My friend owns two pastures that he runs horses on. Seems he and his neighbor don't get along well. The boundary fence was falling apart a couple years ago and the neighbors cattle were getting through into my friend's pastures and grazing. He approached the neighbor about splitting the cost of replacing the fence. The neighbor basically told him to pound sand. Well, my friend was tired of losing feed for his horses to the neighbor's cattle, so he replaced the fence himself. After some choice words were exchanged.

Well, seems the deer like to cross that fence as well and feed in the pasture. My friend lets me shoot deer there periodically with the stipulation that they not leave the pasture and jump back into the neighbors property. Doesn't want the issue of having to cross the fence to look for a deer. No problem, I says.

In the past, I have usually just head shot the deer with whatever I've used. From .223 Remington to .280 Remington. This time, I chose to use the .460 S&W Encore and I felt pretty confident that...........with a quartering towards me shot............it would drop one in it's tracks. It had before.

The last deer I shot with this gun was at 123 yards using the 250gr Hornady XTP. This round is supposedly not designed for the velocity the .460 S&W generates. Well, my goal is to disprove that theory. It handled the last deer with aplomb. So, I wanted to shoot one even closer and at a higher impact velocity this time. See if the bullet would fail or not. You know.............for science!!!! I wanted to mimic the last shot I took on a deer with this cartridge.

My boy and I arrived and set up shop under the awning of his shed as there was a cold mist falling. Being in the low 30s, I didn't want to freeze my boy. So, I bundled him up and set him on the downwind side of me. Figured I'd block some of the wind from hitting him. It was a cold wind chill.

About 4:45, a button buck came into the field.

460SampWDoe1-10-1512_zpsf6b14de0.jpg

I wasn't about to shoot him with the .460 S&W. That would just be wrong!!! Ha! So, we waited and he eventually returned to the brush. Nothing else happened until around 5:45 when I began to see deer moving through the brush towards the pasture. A couple yearlings entered the field, but the mature does were a little more skeptical and just wandered back and forth on the other side of the fence. Finally, right at 6:00, a big doe jumped the fence and trotted out into the pasture. I looked at my boy and told him I was going to shoot her. Made sure his hearing protection and mine were in place, and waited for her to turn quartering to.

As I watched her, a yearling kept getting behind her on the other side of the fence. I didn't figure the bullet would go through her. But, I didn't want to chance it. So, I waited.........and waited.........and waited. Finally, the yearling moved off and the doe turned just right.

"BOOM!"

This time, I didn't hear the round hit. It was just too loud under the awning. What I DID see..........was the doe's butt hit the ground and and her head followed. She basically sat back and then crumpled forward. Not a twitch after she hit the ground. D-U-N..........done.

That'll work. Two shots..............two folded deer with the .460 S&W. I think we're onto something here! This sucker drops deer like the Hand of God!

With a fist bump and a smile, my boy and I walked across the field to the doe.

460SampWDoe1-10-155_zpsc913a2c6.jpg

I am REALLY starting to like this gun/cartridge combination. It is quite effective and accurate.

Here is where the doe was standing when I shot her.

460SampWDoe1-10-1510_zps8c64c85d.jpg

We took pictures and then loaded her in the truck to head home. There was science to be done.
"To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
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Replies

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    460SampWDoe1-10-152_zpsc57c6857.jpg

    .460 S&W
    Bullet: 250gr Hornady XTP
    Muzzle Velocity: 2,388
    Distance to Impact: 93 yards
    Angle: Right Side Quartering Towards
    Impact Velocity: 1,848 (est)
    Distance Traveled After Impact: 0 yards

    Entrance
    460SampWDoe1-10-1513_zpse25e607b.jpg

    Entrance Under Hide
    460SampWDoe1-10-1514_zps5f058b9c.jpg

    Entrance Under Shoulder
    460SampWDoe1-10-1515_zps849200e4.jpg

    Now, the last deer I shot, the bullet hit the point of the on side shoulder at the joint. I tried to repeat that, but only nicked the shoulder bone right at the joint. Took a chip out of the bone, but that's about it. Sorry.

    Entrance through Shoulder
    460SampWDoe1-10-1516_zps8ad04ee5.jpg

    460SampWDoe1-10-1517_zps86cc2504.jpg

    The haze you see in some of these pictures is the steam coming from the deer's body. It was a little chilly.

    Etrance Under Shoulder - Meat Removed
    460SampWDoe1-10-1518_zpsb73174e2.jpg

    The bullet took out 3 ribs while entering the thoracic cavity.And, made a fist size hole in the process.

    460SampWDoe1-10-1519_zpsea80e040.jpg

    460SampWDoe1-10-1520_zpsd6e45087.jpg

    Entrance Under Ribs
    460SampWDoe1-10-1521_zps07445113.jpg

    Entrance Under Ribs - Blood Removed
    460SampWDoe1-10-1522_zps29b0f15c.jpg

    At this point, the bullet is traveling rearward from the point of the shoulder. It has passed through the shoulder muscle, broken 3 ribs, opened a fist size hole in the chest cavity, completely wiped out the front lobe of the left lung, and exploded the heart. Severing the aorta and ripping open the heart like a pomegranate.

    460SampWDoe1-10-1523_zps548d5d8a.jpg

    460SampWDoe1-10-1524_zpsc189eaf6.jpg

    460SampWDoe1-10-1526_zpsd0d18212.jpg

    460SampWDoe1-10-1525_zps18031055.jpg

    It then punctured the diaphragm.

    460SampWDoe1-10-1527_zps262683af.jpg

    Passed through the edge of the liver and came to rest in the back portion of the stomach.

    Now, in the name of science..............I actually opened up the stomach.................and sifted..........and sifted..........and sifted.........through all the fermenting vegetation and bile. Oh, what a WONDERFUL aroma!!!! Handful after handful, I squeezed through my fingers. Feeling for every piece of lead I could find. But, you know what? I found it. and several tiny pieces of lead. I hope you feel sorry for me. My hands still smell like fermented grass.

    I'll spare you the visual of the stomach content. But, here was the general location of the bullet in relation to the body.

    460SampWDoe1-10-1528_zpsa0f2b5c5.jpg

    It passed through just over 2 feet of deer.

    Retained Weight
    DSCN1494_zps39e7fc62.jpg

    Combined Weight
    DSCN1495_zps543bc956.jpg

    DSCN1499_zps1bcfbb93.jpg

    DSCN1498_zps122b02f7.jpg

    DSCN1497_zps7ca330e5.jpg

    I am exceptionally pleased with the bullets performance. It held together for the most part and penetrated well enough for deer sized game. In the process, it caused massive initial damage with the hydrostatic shock and temporary cavity. Visual cues as to this can be seen in both the entrance hole to the chest cavity and the "explosion" of the heart as the bullet passed through.I am impressed. This is a catastrophic combination on deer. The combination of a wide frontal diameter, high velocity, and softer expanding bullet work together to provide dramatic results.

    I like it.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    Notice the discoloration of the copper from the short amount of time in the stomach bile. That's some serious stuff!!
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • sakodudesakodude Senior Member Posts: 3,284 Senior Member
    Yep,that worked:up: nice job.

    Sako
  • Farm Boy DeuceFarm Boy Deuce Senior Member Posts: 6,083 Senior Member
    You have little hands.



    I love your reports, thank you for taking the time to do them.





    Oh, that bullet failed. You should never use it on game animals again. You are a cruel and unethical hunter. :jester::troll:
    I am afraid we forget sometime that the basic and simple things brings us the most pleasure.
    Dad 5-31-13
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,695 Senior Member
    Very impressive shot, and outstanding bullet performance. I have passed on similar shots, because I was unsure about the anatomy, at that angle. But with that kind of impact, it really doesn't matter too much if you are off by an inch or so.

    Good information - your scientific work is valid. :up:
  • timctimc Senior Member Posts: 6,684 Senior Member
    Awesome hunting report as usual, waaay more patience than I have in the CSI department!
    timc - formerly known as timc on the last G&A forum and timc on the G&A forum before that and the G&A forum before that.....
    AKA: Former Founding Member
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,695 Senior Member
    I am particularly impressed that it destroyed the heart with that high of an entry point - instant zero blood pressure. I wonder if it would have still done that, had it missed the shoulder bone.
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,807 Senior Member
    You have a future as a G&A writer.

    Nice job!

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,509 Senior Member
    Nice work. Gotta love XTPs. I'm more and more impressed by them.
  • bellcatbellcat Senior Member Posts: 1,490 Senior Member
    Good hustle!
    "Kindness is the language the deaf can hear and the blind can see." Mark Twain
  • Great OutdoorsGreat Outdoors Member Posts: 230 Member
    do you have a weight on the doe?

    good shot and a great post.
    always enjoy the autopsy- what type of saw are you using to open the chest without disturbing the insides?
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 7,074 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    Got a call from a friend to come shoot a doe.

    "Pick up the phone. I'm always home. Call me anytime. Just ring 362-4360 - I lead a life of crime"

    Yeah. . .it just SUCKS to be you, doesn't it?:jester:
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    "Pick up the phone. I'm always home. Call me anytime. Just ring 362-4360 - I lead a life of crime"

    Yeah. . .it just SUCKS to be you, doesn't it?:jester:

    ClickHandlerashx_zpsdda42356.jpg
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 8,726 Senior Member
    Once again a more informative report than can be found on tv or in a magazine.

    Thanks for sharing your experience.
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    bisley wrote: »
    Very impressive shot, and outstanding bullet performance. I have passed on similar shots, because I was unsure about the anatomy, at that angle.
    Good information - your scientific work is valid. :up:

    I'm learning the difference in death from a slow cast bullet and a fast expanding bullet. They both work, but the external damage and speed of death are dramatically different.


    If you need penetration for large game, cast and weight seem to be key. But, on lighter animals, the seem to be able to soak up the heavy slow bullets a little better as they pass through with little secondary damage caused by temporary cavity and hydraulic pressure.


    It's the rapid expansion that causes the increased shock wave and resulting neuro-disruption from the hydrostatic shock. The wave travels through the animal so fast that it disrupts their system and knocks them out. Then, the damage caused to the internal organs kills them before they regain consciousness.


    Take this deer for instance. I hit no major bone or any portion of the central nervous system. Yet, the deer collapsed instantly and never even twitched a leg. This tells me that the impact of the bullet basically TKO'd her and the catastrophic damage to the heart and lungs killed her quickly before she regained consciousness.


    Amazing stuff.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    You have little hands.


    Shad'up, you!!
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    timc wrote: »
    Awesome hunting report as usual, waaay more patience than I have in the CSI department!

    I have no life.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    BigDanS wrote: »
    You have a future as a G&A writer.

    Nice job!

    D

    I became disenchanted years ago by the veritable lack of information and opinion that wasn't bought and paid for by others.

    So, I decided to generate my own. I will likely never be a writer as I have an opinion and am not afraid to use it even to the offense of others sensibilities and bottom line.

    :-)
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    do you have a weight on the doe?

    good shot and a great post.
    always enjoy the autopsy- what type of saw are you using to open the chest without disturbing the insides?

    I do not have an actual weight. But, from loading her in the truck and such, I would estimate her around 85-90 pounds. She was somewhat drawn up in the back end as her hip bones were prominent as was the back portion of her spine.

    Not sickly. Just lean.

    I used to use a pair of shears to cut through the rib joints and sternum to remove the entire side of ribs. But, that was becoming somewhat painstaking. So, the last few deer, I've just been using a hatchet. I don't go wailing on it. I use my knife to sever the back portion of rib from above the abdomen from spine to sternum. Then, I grab each rib and cleave the joint with the hatchet. Move to the next rib, bent it and cleave that joint as well. It's rather fast and takes very little effort. And, by concentrating my strikes to each individual joint, I don't damage or disrupt any of the internal organs. Works great!!!
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • CHIRO1989CHIRO1989 Senior Member Posts: 11,006 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I became disenchanted years ago by the veritable lack of information and opinion that wasn't bought and paid for by others.

    So, I decided to generate my own. I will likely never be a writer as I have an opinion and am not afraid to use it even to the offense of others sensibilities and bottom line.

    :-)


    All of the successful writers have opinions, controversy sells.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    CHIRO1989 wrote: »
    All of the successful writers have opinions, controversy sells.

    Yeah, but my actions are closed in trophy shots and I use match bullets for hunting. Drive other bullets too fast because folks say I shouldn't and get results I'm not supposed to get. Not to mention I take head shots and use game as ballistic test media as well as table fare. I'd be ostracized from the outset. I don't follow the status quo.

    :-)
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • CHIRO1989CHIRO1989 Senior Member Posts: 11,006 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    Yeah, but my actions are closed in trophy shots and I use match bullets for hunting. Drive other bullets too fast because folks say I shouldn't and get results I'm not supposed to get. Not to mention I take head shots and use game as ballistic test media as well as table fare. I'd be ostracized from the outset. I don't follow the status quo.

    :-)

    We will stick up for you:), status quo is for sheep anyway.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 23,982 Senior Member
    Nice shooting and deer
    A Veteran is someone that served in the Military, it does not matter where they served.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    bisley wrote: »
    I am particularly impressed that it destroyed the heart with that high of an entry point - instant zero blood pressure. I wonder if it would have still done that, had it missed the shoulder bone.

    The shot was on a slight downward slope. So, the entrance is slightly high with a downward trajectory through the body. Here is the direction of travel of the bullet. Striking the top portion of the heart, the temporary cavity is what ripped the entire heart open. Even though the bullet only actually struck the upper portion of the heart. Being a non pliable muscle like the liver, the heart is prone to tearing. Unlike the lungs that have the ability to expand some with the pressure wave where we see the bruising of them.

    460SampWDoe1-10-1522-Copy_zpsf0ef53b7.jpg
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • twatwa Senior Member Posts: 2,231 Senior Member
    You continue to impress me. :worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy:
  • Grizz1219Grizz1219 Member Posts: 424 Member
    That was an awesome post!!!!!! Wow... Great shot too..
  • MississippiBoyMississippiBoy Senior Member Posts: 819 Senior Member
    bg-313.jpg

    Sayin'.....
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    If we ever meet, let's make sure it's NOT during deer season. Or, we can fist bump. I ain't shaking hands.

    Dude, I'm sure you've scratched......uh.....err......worse.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,737 Senior Member
    bg-313.jpg

    Sayin'.....

    Ppppfffttttt.....
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,509 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    If we ever meet, let's make sure it's NOT during deer season. Or, we can fist bump. I ain't shaking hands.

    Fraid of gettin a little poopy on your soft, girly hands?


    Pffffftt
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