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CMP to sell surplus 1911s...

zorbazorba Senior MemberPosts: 24,985 Senior Member
-Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

"If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
)O(
«1

Replies

  • Farm Boy DeuceFarm Boy Deuce Senior Member Posts: 6,083 Senior Member
    Awesome. Where are surplus 1911's coming from at this time?
    I am afraid we forget sometime that the basic and simple things brings us the most pleasure.
    Dad 5-31-13
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    I wonder what the price range will be? Probably graded like rifles?
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    AMU built 1911s?:worthy:
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 25,126 Senior Member
    Awesome. Where are surplus 1911's coming from at this time?
    Army----only
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,327 Senior Member
    Big Chief wrote: »
    I wonder what the price range will be? Probably graded like rifles?

    And that would be be FINE, as it lets us choose our level of drooling obsession. Daddy's got NICHES to fill!:drool2:
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,877 Senior Member
    Found on another forum:

    This letter was published on November 11, 2015. It is a letter written in response to a member's inquiry from Mark Johnson, Chief Operating Officer of the Civilian Marksmanship Program:


    Quote:
    Sir,

    The CMP has no control over the outcome concerning the proposed legislative amendment that would change CMP’s enabling legislation by removing the word “rifle” and replacing it with “firearm”. The CMP will know the outcome concerning the legislation passing or not passing through the US House and US Senate at the same time in which all US Citizens find out.

    Everyone needs to keep in mind, even if the legislative amendment to CMP’s current enabling legislation passes, the US Army is still not bound to turnover 1911’s or shotguns to the CMP if it chooses not to. The US Army has complete control of the firearms in its possession not the CMP.

    Absolute best case scenario, the CMP is several years out from receiving anything if the legislation passes and the Army agrees to the transfer the surplus “firearms” to the CMP.

    Congressman Rogers (AL) and Congressman Latta (OH) are putting forth great effort to help the CMP. Both Congressmen have CMP operations in their states and they are helping a local business survive.

    Mark Johnson
    Chief Operating Officer
    Civilian Marksmanship Program
    256-835-8455 Ext. 416
    www.thecmp.org
    I'm just here for snark.
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,327 Senior Member
    Hmmm. . .I'd forgotten the "shotguns" part. Gotta wonder if there are any actual trench guns left in inventory. . . I faked together a WWII one from an already chopped '97 takedown, but the real deal would be YUMMY!
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    I think I read somewhere the 97s are pretty rare. I think Navy Corpsman carried shotguns with Marine Corps patrols in Vietnam. Seems I more likely to see those pop up.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 2,541 Senior Member
    Besides collectibility, what is the attraction? Every 1911 I handled while in the service left a lot to be desired. Average fit, terrible sights, fair condition...
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    There's one less in line. :up:
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • NCFUBARNCFUBAR Senior Member Posts: 4,324 Senior Member
    JKP wrote: »
    Besides collectibility, what is the attraction? Every 1911 I handled while in the service left a lot to be desired. Average fit, terrible sights, fair condition...

    Can't speak of Army surplus but USMC "surplus" included very few good 1911 and those where stashed back in PWS Quantico. I don't know will get in from the Army or what the CMP can do but I'll be going to Talladega both races now to hopefully pick out one if/when they get them.
    “The further a society drifts from truth ... the more it will hate those who speak it."
    - George Orwell
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,970 Senior Member
    I've already got a pretty good Remington-Rand, but I'd pay good money for a AMU worked over 1911...


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,118 Senior Member
    early wrote: »
    I think I read somewhere the 97s are pretty rare. I think Navy Corpsman carried shotguns with Marine Corps patrols in Vietnam. Seems I more likely to see those pop up.
    There were Model 12s and 870s in the inventory as well...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,327 Senior Member
    JKP wrote: »
    Besides collectibility, what is the attraction? Every 1911 I handled while in the service left a lot to be desired. Average fit, terrible sights, fair condition...

    Collectibility IS the main attraction (but not the only one - more on this in a bit). The real exciting questions come from pondering exactly what is in this inventory. After WWII, the military got scaled WAAAAAAY back, and aside from minor, specialized purchases like marksmanship units and special ops, Uncle Sam never needed to buy another 1911 after 1945.

    Sooooo. . . of the roughly 2 to 2.5 million pistols, the questions are:

    How many survived military service? Truly a valid question, as those aboard every B-17 shot down and every ship sunk would have amounted to a hefty sum. The 500 Singers are presumed to have gone to the U.S. Army Air Corps before the bombers had P-51's covering them. I expect a lot of those were part of that grim statistic.

    How many saw active duty and got recycled through the arsenal rebuild programs? A WWII scale military needs A LOT more pistols than a peacetime one, or even one conducting police actions in Asian puppet states.

    How many went into wax paper and cardboard boxes and stayed there? Odds are, a peacetime military could be kept going with arsenal rebuilds that actually saw service in WWII. It's entirely possible that a lot of 1944-45 production ended up as stores. . .a service unit would irreparably break or lose one and order a replacement from these. As generally unbreakable as the main components of a 1911 are, they've probably lose more to theft than wear.

    Any of those options are cool - the used, mismatched, and rebuilt because they went to very bad places to do very bad things, and the unused ones for "time capsule" appeal.

    As to the attraction of one of these versus a new production 1911. . .you pretty much CAN'T find a new 1911 built to true military specs. Consumer demand has done funny things to JMB's blueprints; we've got sniper-rifle tolerances (and correspondingly high prices) on CQB pistols because glossy magazine ads convince us we need accuracy capability that virtually no human can deliver. A negative of this is that you have a lot of individually-fit parts that can't be dropped into another pistol off the same assembly line. Still another is that all of that ergonomic tweaking and match tuning can make the gun harder to dismantle (i.e. ambi safeties) and a bit less durable/reliable (i.e. too-fine sear engagement and no room for mud) in the real world. On the flip side, you have the "make it cheap" end of modern production with things like castings and plastic trigger shoes and plastic mainspring housings, nor are you likely to see the checkered small parts of the pre-'44 guns on any of the new stuff.

    A lot of the modern guns are trying to cash in on the reputation THESE guns made, while not necessarily adhering to the criteria they were manufactured under. This is the real deal, built to John Browning's specs to be an actual weapon of war - not a confused target pistol with night sights that tries to be everything to everyone.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,118 Senior Member
    :agree: Inarguably, one of the best things written on this board....Well done Bigslug...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    They ones we had in our arms rooms rattled like loose tools in a metal box. I have no doubts they all would have gone bang bang though.

    The infinite wisdom of the Army back in the 70s.........issue me a .45 and only 5 rounds in a magazine. As I'm walking my guard post back and forth between 56 M-60 Tanks in a Motor Pool in Germany with a .45 they issued me for guard duty. Freezing my butt off too.

    Lets see the Baader-Meinhof Gang was active ........be on the lookout they said..........I wondered how many were in the gang..............better make all 5 count.............hope the COR/SOG/OG and rest of the guard force would get there in a hurry....................

    Better than a Pic Mattcok handle that some places issued roving guards or as an assistant CQ in the barracks to whack unruly drunks with who got bat scat crazy from too many German Beers or issued me my very own .45 and 5 rounds when I made Sgt and had CQ duty.

    Anyway, they (CMP) will surely go over each one with a good TI for serviceability and replace any parts that need it.

    Yep, I want one.

    I hope they are affordable.
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Just to be the negative Nelly...
    You guys actually think our government is going to allow handguns they (we, technically) own to be placed back into circulation so that we Normal schlubs can own them?
    Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiightttttttt.....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncbEucjsNFU
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • AntonioAntonio Senior Member Posts: 2,986 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Collectibility IS the main attraction (but not the only one - more on this in a bit). The real exciting questions come from pondering exactly what is in this inventory. After WWII, the military got scaled WAAAAAAY back, and aside from minor, specialized purchases like marksmanship units and special ops, Uncle Sam never needed to buy another 1911 after 1945.

    Sooooo. . . of the roughly 2 to 2.5 million pistols, the questions are:

    How many survived military service? Truly a valid question, as those aboard every B-17 shot down and every ship sunk would have amounted to a hefty sum. The 500 Singers are presumed to have gone to the U.S. Army Air Corps before the bombers had P-51's covering them. I expect a lot of those were part of that grim statistic.

    How many saw active duty and got recycled through the arsenal rebuild programs? A WWII scale military needs A LOT more pistols than a peacetime one, or even one conducting police actions in Asian puppet states.

    How many went into wax paper and cardboard boxes and stayed there? Odds are, a peacetime military could be kept going with arsenal rebuilds that actually saw service in WWII. It's entirely possible that a lot of 1944-45 production ended up as stores. . .a service unit would irreparably break or lose one and order a replacement from these. As generally unbreakable as the main components of a 1911 are, they've probably lose more to theft than wear.

    Any of those options are cool - the used, mismatched, and rebuilt because they went to very bad places to do very bad things, and the unused ones for "time capsule" appeal.

    As to the attraction of one of these versus a new production 1911. . .you pretty much CAN'T find a new 1911 built to true military specs. Consumer demand has done funny things to JMB's blueprints; we've got sniper-rifle tolerances (and correspondingly high prices) on CQB pistols because glossy magazine ads convince us we need accuracy capability that virtually no human can deliver. A negative of this is that you have a lot of individually-fit parts that can't be dropped into another pistol off the same assembly line. Still another is that all of that ergonomic tweaking and match tuning can make the gun harder to dismantle (i.e. ambi safeties) and a bit less durable/reliable (i.e. too-fine sear engagement and no room for mud) in the real world. On the flip side, you have the "make it cheap" end of modern production with things like castings and plastic trigger shoes and plastic mainspring housings, nor are you likely to see the checkered small parts of the pre-'44 guns on any of the new stuff.

    A lot of the modern guns are trying to cash in on the reputation THESE guns made, while not necessarily adhering to the criteria they were manufactured under. This is the real deal, built to John Browning's specs to be an actual weapon of war - not a confused target pistol with night sights that tries to be everything to everyone.

    Agree; lucky you that might get a fine piece of military history that otherwise might be eventually destroyed and can still be shot every once in a while.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »

    You just forget it !
    You'll never get it !
    You live in Calaforny, so you just forget it,
    You'll never get it !

    Lol
    :jester: :tooth:
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 24,985 Senior Member
    DoctorWho wrote: »
    You just forget it !
    You'll never get it !
    You live in Calaforny, so you just forget it,
    You'll never get it !

    Lol
    :jester: :tooth:

    One word: C&R!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    One word: C&R!

    I saw some C&R pistols, but said no delivery to CA/NJ/NY and a couple mo states................how can that be if they are BATF approved as C&R?
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    AIM Surplus says that and J&G says check your states roster.

    http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx?groupid=5490&name=Polish%20Radom%20P-64%209x18%20Pistol



    Polish Radom P-64 9x18 Pistol
    Firearm Purchase Requirements

    SHIPPING RESTRICTIONS APPLY FFL REQUIRED/ 03 C&R ELIGIBLE
    NOT 03 C&R ELIGIBLE IN CA, MA, NJ & NY.
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 24,985 Senior Member
    As long as its 50 years old or older, its legal here. There are a number of vendors who are clueless. I see it all the time.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • woodsrunnerwoodsrunner Senior Member Posts: 2,725 Senior Member
    I want MINE! The one the NAVY issued me in 1959 and that I carried for over 2 years as the Cuban Missile Crisis built up! I know the serial number, but the ones to be released are all from the ARMY arsenal, none from the Navy :tissue:
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,118 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    As long as its 50 years old or older, its legal here. There are a number of vendors who are clueless. I see it all the time.

    There are a number of businesses that refuse to do any firearms business in CA based on general principle....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,118 Senior Member
    Big Chief wrote: »
    They ones we had in our arms rooms rattled like loose tools in a metal box. I have no doubts they all would have gone bang bang though.

    When I was shooting on the Michigan Air National Guard Pistol Team, we had one phase of Bullseye competition that was shot with rack weapons...Grab one and take your chances...surprisingly (or not) they weren't that awful...but high score wasn't always all that impressive...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 24,985 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    There are a number of businesses that refuse to do any firearms business in CA based on general principle....

    Yes there are. All they're doing is hurting us, they're not helping anything or anybody - but hey! Its a free country.

    Now if they won't sell to ANYBODY in Ca - including LEO, state agencies, etc - more power to 'em!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,118 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    Yes there are. All they're doing is hurting us, they're not helping anything or anybody - but hey! Its a free country.

    Now if they won't sell to ANYBODY in Ca - including LEO, state agencies, etc - more power to 'em!

    IIRC, there's quite a bit of paperwork involved to get firearms "approved" for sale in CA,MA, etc...to the point that it becomes so onerous to comply with their laws it's easier to just not do business in those states. Humbly, those states are the ones who shot their citizens in the foot, in the interest of keeping them "safe" of course...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 24,985 Senior Member
    Yea, there's some BS form you gotta fill out to "import" a C&R into the state.

    I'll be glad when I can get the Hell outta here...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 18,118 Senior Member
    zorba wrote: »
    Yea, there's some BS form you gotta fill out to "import" a C&R into the state.

    I'll be glad when I can get the Hell outta here...

    You'll be welcome in Free America....
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
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