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Just thinking about a new build and need advice...

snake284snake284 Senior MemberPosts: 22,394 Senior Member
I remember when I was thinking about building something on a 284 Winchester case. I was advised by my gun smith and on here about problems with Feed Rails on the Mauser actions if going to a different case than a 57mm case. I'm wondering, is there a template available to aid in grinding on the feed rails when changing the diameter and taper of the case? I've got a brain storm (Maybe case of Cranial Flatulence) and was thinking of utilizing the Winchester Short Mag case. I haven't decided on caliber yet but it could be something 6.5 or possibly using the mil spec barrel and making a 7.9 whatever you would call it. That would make it somewhere between an 8mm-06 and an 8mm Poor Man's Magnum (.338 case necked down). Comments please.
Daddy, what's an enabler?
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
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Replies

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 23,967 Senior Member
    A 6.5 WSM would be cool. But me, I want a .35 Sambar something fierce. Just because it's cool.

    .300 WSM case necked up to .35cal.

    .358 WSM

    I'll never build one. But, I could live vicariously through you.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Big Al1Big Al1 Senior Member Posts: 7,823 Senior Member
    I built my .284 on a Turkish Mauser. Just had the rails altered when I got it barreled, works just fine. Because of the size of the case the magazine will only hold four.
  • kansashunterkansashunter Senior Member Posts: 1,812 Senior Member
    Snake there has been some 6.5 wsm work done and someone called it a 6.5 leopard. There are dies available but are pricey. 6.5x284 would be cheaper. I would like to build one but I haven't picked one yet. I can't help you with the feed ramps but you can find wsm actions sometimes for a decent price and that would solve those problems.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Snake there has been some 6.5 wsm work done and someone called it a 6.5 leopard. There are dies available but are pricey. 6.5x284 would be cheaper. I would like to build one but I haven't picked one yet. I can't help you with the feed ramps but you can find wsm actions sometimes for a decent price and that would solve those problems.

    Yeah I thought about that later. That would really be the answer, just rebarrel something that's in 7mm or 30 WSM. Did Remington chamber any 700s in the short mags? Whatever, I really would prefer the WSM case. There's no belt and it holds more powder than the 06 or .284 Case. I wouldn't mind a Remington or Model 70 action or even a Ruger or Savage, I'm not picky with those actions. But I have this one Yugo action Left to rebarrel and(Edited) it looks like it would be perfect for the Short Mags. I could put a longish barrel on it and in 6.5 it would reach out there, of course beyond my eye's ability.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    In the .35 barrel It would be an improved Whelen. That would be a bad ass for sure. I can see it flinging a 250 grain bullet at 2800 FPS or better.

    The possibilities are endless too. What about a 9.3 WSM?
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,456 Senior Member
    I have two 6.5 Leopard's (one rear grip and the other center-grip specialty pistols).
    I like them:applause:
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    I have two 6.5 Leopard's (one rear grip and the other center-grip specialty pistols).
    I like them:applause:

    What is the OAL of the Leopard? Or the Max OAL?
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,456 Senior Member
    snake284 wrote: »
    What is the OAL of the Leopard? Or the Max OAL?

    Mine are both single shots, so it doesn't even come in to play
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    A 6.5 WSM would be cool. But me, I want a .35 Sambar something fierce. Just because it's cool.

    .300 WSM case necked up to .35cal.

    .358 WSM


    I'll never build one. But, I could live vicariously through you.


    I'm fairly interested in it. I think it might out perform a Whelen, maybe. But then maybe the 9.3 would be a real bear!
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,456 Senior Member
    Do the 6.5 with a 1-8T then you can truly have a distance set-up :love:
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Neck a .284 case to .270. Show the world the error of their ways. Unless you're chicken.

    Hey don't think I haven't thought about it. What about a .270 Leopard? :tooth:

    How dare you insinuate I'm Chicken, ME who has danced naked around the fire with the fierce Chipmunk in the Smokey Moon lit Night! Watch what you say, I might cast a spell your way!!!

    Can you see it now? cpj wakes up some morning and the first words out his mouth,

    Dayam! Me thunk's me needs a .270!!!

    :rotflmao::roll2::rotflmao::roll2::rotflmao::roll2::rotflmao:
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 7,927 Senior Member
    I'm confused as to what you want to do. Do you want to do something with a .284 case, or one of the Winchester WMS cases?

    When I built my 338x284, I asked the gunsmith about converting my existing .284 to handle the 300 wsm case. He said the wsm caes was too big in diameter to make that possible. That was for a Winchester M88, though, so it might be different for a stronger action that you have in the mauser.

    I knew I wanted a larger caliber, and deliberated between .338 and .358. In the end, I went with .338 because I determined I could get a 225 grain bullet in either but with a better bc in the .338. I think of it as a short action version of the 338-06.

    If you build on a .284 case, and go with .358, I don't think you'll get better performance than you'd get with a 338-06. You might get something close or equal, though.

    With a Mauser action, you probably won't run into the problem I did with the magazine being too short to accommodate a longer coal.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    I'm confused as to what you want to do. Do you want to do something with a .284 case, or one of the Winchester WMS cases?

    I knew I wanted a larger caliber, and deliberated between .338 and .358. In the end, I went with .338 because I determined I could get a 225 grain bullet in either but with a better bc in the .338. I think of it as a short action version of the 338-06.


    I really want the WSM case. It being a larger diameter holds more powder than the .284 and/or the 06 size case, and still in a short package.
    ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    If you build on a .284 case, and go with .358, I don't think you'll get better performance than you'd get with a 338-06. You might get something close or equal, though.

    Yes, I agree that you won't get better performance with the .284 case over the 06 case, in fact the opposite is probably true. But the WSM case has more powder capacity than either of them. It IS what you would call a true Magnum size when comparing it to the 06 OR the .284.

    And I do agree with what you say about better BC with the .338 over the .358. However, if I went with the .358, it would be on the WSM case, allowing good performance with even heavier higher BC Bullets.
    ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    With a Mauser action, you probably won't run into the problem I did with the magazine being too short to accommodate a longer coal.

    Length should be no problem in the 57mm action. As for the WSM OR the .284 cases being too fat for the Mauser magazine I don't think that's a problem either except that it will reduce the number of cartridges you can cram in it. But I don't care, if I can get 4 total, 3 in the mag + one in the chamber even, I'm a happy camper. I've never killed anything where i had to fire more than 4 rounds. If I did, it didn't fall when shot and I lost it. Nope, there's plenty of people that get by on 1 shot, so if I can't make it work with 4, I need to go home. I never put more than 4 rounds in any of my rifles anymore anyway.

    OK Reading what you and everybody else wrote, I’ve about decided to go with one of the following and maybe not necessarily in this order, as I'm still thinking.

    First Choice: A .270 Leopard. If I go with the .270, it will be a 1.8 or 1.9 twist barrel about 28 inches long.
    Second: A 6.5 Leopard Same as above.
    Third: A .358 Leopard-A 24” Barrel 1:12 Twist
    Fourth: A 9.3 Leopard-Same as the .358

    The .270 or the 6.5 will give me a very long range deer-hog rifle.
    Either of the other 2 will give me a somewhat longer range version of what I already have, the 9.3x62.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 7,927 Senior Member
    Snake, I just now remembered what my smith told me about going with the short magnum case. He said he would have to open up the bolt face too much and that there wasn't enough metal to allow that. If you've already crossed that bridge and know you're ok doing that, go for it.

    Good luck.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    Snake, I just now remembered what my smith told me about going with the short magnum case. He said he would have to open up the bolt face too much and that there wasn't enough metal to allow that. If you've already crossed that bridge and know you're ok doing that, go for it.

    Good luck.

    No I hadn't crossed that bridge yet. Thanks for the reminder. I have no clue at this point whether the Yugo bolt can be opened up enough. You may have just saved me a lot of money OR caused me to spend more on another donor,

    :tooth:
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,456 Senior Member
    You do realize that a "270 Leopard" is simply a 270 WSM, right?
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    Neck the case up to 8mm, modify your barrel and the action to accomodate the new chambering: .325 WSM.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    You do realize that a "270 Leopard" is simply a 270 WSM, right?
    Yes, but did somebody make one commercially?

    However, if I found a .270 WSM, if a commercial reality, would it have a 1:9 or 1:8 twist rifling in the barrel? If I did this, I would want it to shoot heavy high BC bullets such as Matrix makes.

    Also, somebody is making barrels in the tighter twists now.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Neck the case up to 8mm, modify your barrel and the action to accomodate the new chambering: .325 WSM.

    I did consider that. The Yugo has a 23 inch barrel and that should be enough. That should push a 200 grain bullet at close to 3000 FPS. Very respectable.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 7,927 Senior Member
    Neck the case up to 8mm, modify your barrel and the action to accomodate the new chambering: .325 WSM.

    I think you'd have to open up the bolt face to accommodate the larger rim of the wsm case. I don't think the .325 WSM has a rebated case like the .284 does.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    Verily. Might have to modify other parts of the action, too. I see I wasn't clear enough...
    Overkill is underrated.
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 7,927 Senior Member
    Verily. Might have to modify other parts of the action, too. I see I wasn't clear enough...

    Opening up the bolt face might be a problem. Something a smith would have to weigh in on.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    Opening up the bolt face might be a problem. Something a smith would have to weigh in on.

    Maybe Teach or Al or somebody will weigh in on this.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    I think you'd have to open up the bolt face to accommodate the larger rim of the wsm case. I don't think the .325 WSM has a rebated case like the .284 does.

    No it isn't rebated Rimless like the .284. We shall see.

    Edited: Oops! It is slightly rebated. The Base of the cartridge body is .5550 in, while the rim diameter is .535 in. Not a whopping difference but it's a difference.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    Controlled-round feed is over-rated.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Controlled-round feed is over-rated.

    Maybe, but CRF is not the only thing that attracts me to the Mauser. For one thing, the're built like a Brick Crap House. Another is to me they are smooth. And finally last but not least, price was right, and I still have one for a donor.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Scrap the .358 or 9.3 idea. In my reading I found it says the WSM case loses efficiency with bullets above 8mm. That's why the .325 WSM was the biggest they offered.

    It also doesn't do well in smaller diameter bores either so they came out with the WSSM case that handles smaller diameter bullets more efficiently.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.325_Winchester_Short_Magnum

    I didn't remember the .270 or .325 WSMs, only the 300 and 7mm. If I saw it, I figured it was a wildcat. Up til now none of them interested me except the .300.


    I'm getting an education today reading stuff I never would have been interested in before.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,456 Senior Member
    I use Norma 270 WSM brass for my 6.5 WSM's (Leopard)
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • kansashunterkansashunter Senior Member Posts: 1,812 Senior Member
    I know that cpj has shot a 270 wsm.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    I know that cpj has shot a 270 wsm.

    Oh hell KH, he probably has a .270 Winchester hid in the depths of his safe!

    :rotflmao::rotflmao::rotflmao:
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
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