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Gen (ret) Petraeus in favor gun control

Six-GunSix-Gun Senior MemberPosts: 8,155 Senior Member
http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/22/opinions/bergen-interview-with-petraeus/index.html

The article covers several interview topics, but gun control is one of them.
Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
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Replies

  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,563 Senior Member
    Six-Gun wrote: »
    http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/22/opinions/bergen-interview-with-petraeus/index.html

    The article covers several interview topics, but gun control is one of them.

    So he's apart of a socio-political group that likely lobbies for its agenda and they believe themselves to be benevolent saviors of the people.

    Useless, in other words.

    Revered military tacticians don't have to be 2A advocates I guess....
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • centermass556centermass556 Senior Member Posts: 3,534 Senior Member
    I could be wrong, but, lets see how this plays out. Dave (P4) is a great speaker and he knows his limits. For instance, if he doesn't know something he will find the SME and keep him around to advise him. I seen him do it with Rotary Wing, Signal, and other assets.

    That being said, Dave knows how to get an audience to listen. He knows that if you get them to listen and nod their heads from the start, they will listen to everything else you have to say. Just like Abraham Lincoln did, look up some of his speeches to the Southern Crowd prior to the Election.

    And I could be wrong, he could be in favor of Gun Control measures...But, There is not a hill in the world I would not follow him up.
    "To have really lived, you must have almost died. To those who have fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    I think we're all in favor of gun control- - - -

    Sight Alignment
    Sight Picture
    Squeeze
    Repeat until the threat is neutralized.

    Jerry
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,563 Senior Member
    I could be wrong, but, lets see how this plays out. Dave (P4) is a great speaker and he knows his limits. For instance, if he doesn't know something he will find the SME and keep him around to advise him. I seen him do it with Rotary Wing, Signal, and other assets.

    That being said, Dave knows how to get an audience to listen. He knows that if you get them to listen and nod their heads from the start, they will listen to everything else you have to say. Just like Abraham Lincoln did, look up some of his speeches to the Southern Crowd prior to the Election.

    And I could be wrong, he could be in favor of Gun Control measures...But, There is not a hill in the world I would not follow him up.

    My statement stands.

    Hard driving tactician, yes. Possible closet gun control advocate? Jury is out still.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Lots of active and retired military are pro gun control. Some of the higher ranks are so used to issuing orders/following orders/policies/Regs and getting compliance from those in uniform they carry it over to their "Civilian" world of thinking and see nothing wrong with it.

    It doesn't take away from the fact they serve/served their country well.

    He had his own issues with his gun he used for fun....................
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • coolgunguycoolgunguy Senior Member Posts: 6,626 Senior Member
    I could be wrong, but, lets see how this plays out. Dave (P4) is a great speaker and he knows his limits. For instance, if he doesn't know something he will find the SME and keep him around to advise him. I seen him do it with Rotary Wing, Signal, and other assets.

    That being said, Dave knows how to get an audience to listen. He knows that if you get them to listen and nod their heads from the start, they will listen to everything else you have to say. Just like Abraham Lincoln did, look up some of his speeches to the Southern Crowd prior to the Election.

    And I could be wrong, he could be in favor of Gun Control measures...But, There is not a hill in the world I would not follow him up.



    He's likely also used to doing things his way. Taking hold of a problem and fixing it. Getting results. Seeing what needs doing and doing it.

    In other words, 'gun control' could be part of fixing what he sees as needing to be fixed.


    Gun control may be the catch phrase he's using to get folks to listen, but he has to know that using such a phrase turns others away...and, if he's serious about it, then he has lost me as a set of ears to listen.
    "Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
    George Carlin
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 11,836 Senior Member
    Lets think a minute. Mark Kelly, the same guy that ranted and raved about gun control, then went to a LGS to purchase an AR -15?

    I thought a lot of the General, however his latest remarks make me wonder if Obama's folks didn't make a deal or something??
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Retired Gen Wesley Clark is another example of Liberalism.......................
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    Petraeus: Absolutely. There are obviously a number of different loopholes including the gun show loophole. I also believe that there's one purpose for an AK-47 and an AR-15, even if it is just on semi-automatic mode, and that is to kill another human being. And if you have a large capacity magazine you can kill even more.

    I must have got ripped off, or my AK47 and AR15 must be defective. In all the years I've owned them, killing another human being is the "one purpose" they have never been used for. And they've both been used a lot. Should I return them for a refund?
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,451 Senior Member
    Well, he's got the right to his opinion. I respect his service but wouldn't feel compelled to agree with him.

    I doubt Gen P has ever bought a firearm in his life. Maybe so, but he's generally (pun) had men with firearms protecting him for the last bunch of years.

    The problem with a lot of anits is they cannot fathom a reason for owning a gun that doesn't include violence. There are two (or more) divisions in America, the Urban and the Rest of America. The Urban Myth is passing a law will prevent violence. This is their right to legislate in NYC and Chicago and Detroit, although the pursuit of this Myth has proved a fallacy. The Rest have guns and mostly have no intention of committing crimes with these guns. The Urbans cannot understand this any more than we can understand life on the streets of Chicago or Detroit. Two different worlds. Big difference is the Urbans insist on applying their values and laws to the Rest of us. Hopefully, the Constitution will prevent this travesty of the Tyranny of the Cities.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,211 Senior Member
    Gene L wrote: »
    The Urban Myth is passing a law will prevent violence. This is their right to legislate in NYC and Chicago and Detroit, although the pursuit of this Myth has proved a fallacy. The Rest have guns and mostly have no intention of committing crimes with these guns. The Urbans cannot understand this any more than we can understand life on the streets of Chicago or Detroit. Two different worlds. Big difference is the Urbans insist on applying their values and laws to the Rest of us. Hopefully, the Constitution will prevent this travesty of the Tyranny of the Cities.
    Detroit has problems, but that isn't one of them...

    http://dailycaller.com/2015/12/01/detroit-police-chief-citizens-carrying-guns-makes-detroit-safer-from-terrorist-attacks/
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,429 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    Petraeus: Absolutely. There are obviously a number of different loopholes including the gun show loophole. I also believe that there's one purpose for an AK-47 and an AR-15, even if it is just on semi-automatic mode, and that is to kill another human being. And if you have a large capacity magazine you can kill even more.

    I must have got ripped off, or my AK47 and AR15 must be defective. In all the years I've owned them, killing another human being is the "one purpose" they have never been used for. And they've both been used a lot. Should I return them for a refund?

    And also, I would bet your AR and AK won't go into Full Auto Mode, another defect.......
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,429 Senior Member
    Yep, what made a great general doesn't always make a great statesman and can well be a Libtard.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,451 Senior Member
    I wouldn't see he's a "Libtard." We limit ourselves if we categorize people based on one opinion. It's arbitrary. There's a whole lot more to Patraeus than his stand on assault (quote) weapons.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • Murphy's LawMurphy's Law Member Posts: 313 Member
    And this is surprising? Further proof that not everyone in the military is your friend nor has your best interest at heart. Did we not learn these lessons during the gun confiscations during Katrina?
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,813 Senior Member
    It's really not that surprising when you consider that he has probably not been involved in a civilian neighborhood for thirty years. A military base is practically a socialist dictatorship, compared to the way civilians live.
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 8,155 Senior Member
    I actually work with a 2-star general who is a gun control advocate. He's a great leader and person, but definitely has the urbanite flare in that political arena.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,563 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »




    With all due respect gentlemen but "could be" and the "Jury is still out."?

    From the article:
    Gen. David Petraeus: I fear it is a bit of a new normal. The truth is that a number of us have been saying for quite some time that it was only a matter of time until someone went to a gun show, bought a military-like semi-automatic assault weapon with a large capacity magazine and did enormous damage.
    Petraeus: We are part of an advisory council for Mark Kelly's Veterans for Common Sense, a group that pursues common sense initiatives to reduce gun violence. Current areas of focus include trying to close loopholes that allow individuals who are domestic abusers or can't fly on an airplane but still are able to get a gun.
    Petraeus: Absolutely. There are obviously a number of different loopholes including the gun show loophole. I also believe that there's one purpose for an AK-47 and an AR-15, even if it is just on semi-automatic mode, and that is to kill another human being. And if you have a large capacity magazine you can kill even more.


    And on a related article:
    http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/10/politics/david-petraeus-mark-kelly-gun-control/index.html

    Washington (CNN)Retired U.S. Army Gen. David Petraeus, who has long resisted calls to run for political office, is teaming up with retired NASA astronaut Mark Kelly to create a new group urging greater gun control.

    The two announced on Friday that they were launching Veterans Coalition for Common Sense to encourage elected leaders to "do more to prevent gun tragedies." The group will feature veterans from every branch of the military who are urging lawmakers to toughen gun laws, the organization said in a news release.


    All of this is right out of the Obama brochure on Gun Control. Sorry but in my book, Kelly and Petraeus now join the sad ranks of folks like Sarah Brady and Carolyn McCarthy who seek to build a very lucrative career out of tragedy by making gun control their job. He's probably untouchable by military contractors so he's gotta make a living somehow. EVERYTHING is about money and power...

    I was being facetious with my "coulds" and "mays". He's absolutely a gun grabbing self-proclaimed benevolent do-gooder.

    And Trump has eyed him as SOD before. Think he'd turn that defense inward?

    He's apart of the "common sense reformation" group-think crowd. I want no part of him.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,563 Senior Member
    I wonder of this move by Patreus will in anyway parallel Trump's current blitherings about some common sense gun legislations....
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 2,374 Senior Member
    This from the same asshats that would put us in town in a foreign country with one buddy, guarding something and were told to "fake it" with empty mags. So if a crowd shows up, I have little recourse but to take a beating, and they end up with two M16A2's.

    Or transporting 240 M16A2's, 4 M2HB's and 6 M60's with the E-5 having THREE ROUNDS in his 1911 and the guy with him and his M16...ZERO.

    While I am pro-military, there are some REALLY STUPID rules out there.

    If that is his attitude....with all due respect, he has no freaking clue.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    Typical of the "guns for me, but not for thee" attitude.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • centermass556centermass556 Senior Member Posts: 3,534 Senior Member
    This is what I will tell you about P4 - He may be an advocate for Gun Control, Got it. Not what I want to see. But, I will tell you there is not a gate in Hell I wouldn't follow that man through. I crossed the berm with him '03, I worked with him in 05-06 and again in 08-09, I served on his staff in '11. I couldn't give two dang sniffs about what the press says. The man took rounds in the gut from a training accident, because he wanted to be there and directly observe the men. He fractured his pelvis on a jump, recovered, and still runs most troops into the ground. He is a tactician and will always weigh the cost of men against the mission. He always ensured his men were equipped and trained the best that could be done. I have seen him walk the streets of Doura, Iraq without Kit to prove a point to the imams, sheiks, and media. He took that fall for those trumped up charges without saying a word, because he knew there was more valor in just taking it than dragging the institution down into another scandal to prove any portion of innocence.
    That is the type of man he is.
    The man deserves more respect than what has been shown.
    "To have really lived, you must have almost died. To those who have fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."
  • coolgunguycoolgunguy Senior Member Posts: 6,626 Senior Member
    I have to ask: How might you feel about his stance on gun control if you hadn't served with him? Bilge water is often, as they say, thicker than blood.


    I don't doubt he feels that such measures would be in the country's best interest, I just question his reasoning. He's undoubtedly a wiser man than I, but that doesn't mean he can't be wrong.
    "Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
    George Carlin
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,721 Senior Member
    The man deserves more respect than what has been shown.

    I don't care who he is kind of hard to respect someone that supports gun control.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • sgtrock21sgtrock21 Senior Member Posts: 1,933 Senior Member
    Big Chief wrote: »
    Lots of active and retired military are pro gun control. Some of the higher ranks are so used to issuing orders/following orders/policies/Regs and getting compliance from those in uniform they carry it over to their "Civilian" world of thinking and see nothing wrong with it.

    It doesn't take away from the fact they serve/served their country well.

    He had his own issues with his gun he used for fun....................
    I'm confident you have experienced what I have. Commissioned officers making the transition from soldier to politician. As early as O-4 and as late as O-7 with exceptions. Petraeus was a victim of our current CiC's purge of generals not in lockstep with his (puppet masters) agendas.
  • sgtrock21sgtrock21 Senior Member Posts: 1,933 Senior Member
    This is what I will tell you about P4 - He may be an advocate for Gun Control, Got it. Not what I want to see. But, I will tell you there is not a gate in Hell I wouldn't follow that man through. I crossed the berm with him '03, I worked with him in 05-06 and again in 08-09, I served on his staff in '11. I couldn't give two dang sniffs about what the press says. The man took rounds in the gut from a training accident, because he wanted to be there and directly observe the men. He fractured his pelvis on a jump, recovered, and still runs most troops into the ground. He is a tactician and will always weigh the cost of men against the mission. He always ensured his men were equipped and trained the best that could be done. I have seen him walk the streets of Doura, Iraq without Kit to prove a point to the imams, sheiks, and media. He took that fall for those trumped up charges without saying a word, because he knew there was more valor in just taking it than dragging the institution down into another scandal to prove any portion of innocence.
    That is the type of man he is.
    The man deserves more respect than what has been shown.
    A genuine leader from the front!
  • tubabucknuttubabucknut Banned Posts: 3,520 Senior Member
    He took that fall for those trumped up charges without saying a word, because he knew there was more valor in just taking it than dragging the institution down into another scandal to prove any portion of innocence.
    That is the type of man he is.
    Are you saying he did not have an affair with Broadwell? That he did not disclose any classified info? Are you saying that being thought of as an adulterer, and security risk is valorous? How does it bring the institution down if one is innocent of the charges? What institution, the Army, Armed Forces as a whole, the Government? I am confused by your statements.

    If true aren't you doing a disservice to him falling on his sword for the institution, by disclosing that it is all false on a public forum? Does that not "damage the Institution" exactly what he was trying to prevent?
    The man deserves more respect than what has been shown.
    I certainly did not serve with the man, so can not speak to any of his characteristics as a soldier, and commander of men. However I am a citizen of the United States, and my nation is governed by The Constitution. The man made a pledge to defend this nation, and uphold the Constitution. He has turned his back on that pledge. I know this will piss you off, because you obviously hold him in high regard. Honestly I don't care. I hold my second Amendment, as well as the rest of the Constitution, in high regard, and have no respect for those that try and take my freedoms. To me it is much like John McCain. I am not sure one can disparage his service, but one can despise his work as a Statesmen. Petraeus appears to fall into this category. His previous accomplishments mean nothing when he is currently acting to take away my freedom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,429 Senior Member
    JasonMPD wrote: »
    I wonder of this move by Patreus will in anyway parallel Trump's current blitherings about some common sense gun legislations....

    Trump is not blabbing the same line of Common Sense gun control that Obammy and Hillary are, he's merely saying anyone on a watch list shouldn't be able to get a gun. And I don't know if I disagree with that. I think these watch lists need tuning up but if somebody is suspected by any federal agency of having terrorist tendencies I sure as hell don't want them buying guns. They actually need to be deported back to the hole they came from.

    I'm talking about Trump now, not Kelly or Petreus. They are out and out libtards.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,457 Senior Member
    There have been many officers that have made good account of themselves in battle and leading our troops and making sure the troops got what they needed. But some have failed miserably as civilians.

    Two officers turned politician that I respect were Dwight D. Eisenhower and John F. Kennedy. I guess respect for the Constitution is a learned behavior; these two got that and acted accordingly.

    Petraeus may have been a fine battlefield officer, but he doesn't seem to be able to make the transition to civilian, and his views on gun control are contrary to the oath he swore to on enlistment. I can overlook some things, but THAT is not something I will overlook, not ever.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    They say that "Stuff" will get you in trouble and it did for the General. Followed the wrong leader. Nobody is immune ..............Happens to Rich/Poor/Presidents/Generals/NCOs/Privates..................
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
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