FYI update PA semi auto

VarmintmistVarmintmist Senior MemberPosts: 6,461 Senior Member
Glad I didnt buy the 5 round mags.

bad news, no semi auto for bear, deer, elk or turkey. No big game.

Good news, semi auto for varmints and preds is good to go.

No big deal. Hunters here are slow to adopt stuff and like every other state, they only think hunting is like their state. The legislature gave the game commission the ability to put semi autos in play, and they went gangbusters for a few months. The did a 4000 person survey, of which 2000 were returned the majority said no to big game. At least they did a survey this time.
It's boring, and your lack of creativity knows no bounds.

Replies

  • jaywaptijaywapti Senior Member Posts: 4,491 Senior Member
    Does this mean that rifles like the Rem. 740 and Win. M-100 can no longer be used ??

    JAY
    THE DEFINITION OF GUN CONTROL IS HITTING THE TARGET WITH YOUR FIRST SHOT
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    No Remington model 8's or 88's. No Winchester 401 wsl's. No kidding?
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • VarmintmistVarmintmist Senior Member Posts: 6,461 Senior Member
    jaywapti wrote: »
    Does this mean that rifles like the Rem. 740 and can no longer be used ??

    JAY

    No, it means that they never could be used and still cant be used for big game at this time. Manually operated only as it has been in the past for big game. It means that 10-22's can be used for squirrels now and AR platforms for varmints and preds. Semi shotguns have been allowed forever though. It really isnt a big deal. There is nothing you cant hunt with a bolt gun, so it is just icing on the cake so to speak.

    The system in PA is a bit different. The Game Commission is a entity unto itself. There are no public tax dollars that fund it, it is paid for by hunter dollars, Pitt-Rob funds, and timber and gas sales from the million ac that it owns, bought with hunter dollars for hunters. The bad thing about it is that there is no pile of cash to tap, the good thing is that they are not beholden in day to day operations or does the state have say on how the game lands are used. The DCNR cannot list a area off limits because of a political change. The game lands are NOT state land. The governor cannot line item out Wildlife conservation officers if he is anti hunting, because they dont work for him.

    The PGC does answer to the legislature and the Gov appoints the board of commissioners, so to get a change through takes a long time and political games. Bad if its a good change, good if its a bad change. In this case the legicritters passed a bill that allowed the game commission to add semi auto weapons to the approved weapons list. The Board of Commissioners added semi autos as legal weapons for varmints and preds. At least this time they took a survey. When they added crossbows to archery season, there was a overwhelming feeling against and they just went ahead and did it. Some of the bad didnt happen, and some of the bad did. They implemented it in the worst way possible. There was a push (quite a few actually) to let inlines into flintlock season. That has been beaten off repeatedly as it should be. Inlines are legal, but the game comm sets the season so no politician who doesnt know a thing about firearms can get greased by a manufacturer or lied to by a group (both have happened here) and change the rules. The last try at getting inlines into flintlock season was so that disabled people could hunt. I ask you, what is the physical difference in loading and firing a flintlock vs a inline? I actually corresponded with a legislator who was for this and I asked the same question. If you have no idea the answer, it is nothing. There is no difference that a physical limitation would be over come with a inline over a flintlock except talent and that only comes into play after the trigger is pulled..

    What will happen here IMO is that for 8 months there will be doom and gloom and teeth gnashing over letting EBR's in for hunting. Then it will settle down for another year, then semi autos will become legal for big game.

    Like I said and both of you just proved, hunters have very little idea of what is going on in other states. They all think everyone is just like them.
    It's boring, and your lack of creativity knows no bounds.
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 6,481 Senior Member
    early wrote: »
    No Remington model 8's or 88's. No Winchester 401 wsl's. No kidding?

    Winchester Model 88 is a lever action. The model 100 is a semi.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    Winchester Model 88 is a lever action. The model 100 is a semi.

    I was thinking the model 8 was updated and given the number 88. Maybe it was a different number.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,051 Senior Member
    Model 81.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 7,226 Senior Member
    I was really disappointed to see them cave to an fear campaign and emotional temper tantrum from the traditionalists, but in the same breath, I believe that people in the state should have a say in their hunting regs as long as it doesn't negatively impact the game.

    Regardless, it's a step in the right direction in a state that moves like a turtle when it comes to changing anything.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • VarmintmistVarmintmist Senior Member Posts: 6,461 Senior Member
    If PA didnt move slow, the flintlock industry as it is today would be gone, and when politicians try to get the gamelands under their control for their bunny hugger buddies, slow can be good. No choice but to let it into the full light of day.
    It's boring, and your lack of creativity knows no bounds.
  • MichakavMichakav Senior Member Posts: 2,411 Senior Member
    Six-Gun wrote: »
    I was really disappointed to see them cave to an fear campaign and emotional temper tantrum from the traditionalists, but in the same breath, I believe that people in the state should have a say in their hunting regs as long as it doesn't negatively impact the game.

    Regardless, it's a step in the right direction in a state that moves like a turtle when it comes to changing anything.

    Exactly my thoughts. The PA game commission did a study of other states that allowed semi's for hunting and found no evidence of increased safety issues. That's why they included semi for big game in the original draft. But, as you have realized, PA hunters are a little traditionalist. Which is fine. It's a start.

    What I found most interesting/**** is that most of those against it were worried about "spray and pray". I found that funny because from what I read there is no magazine restriction for small game and furbearers.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 21,803 Senior Member
    Model 81.

    Wasn't there a model 82 also, or am I losing my mind? My dad and I borrowed a Model 8 from a family friend when I was a kid and we went deer hunting. I think it was chambered in 32 Winchester?
    All I can really truthfully remember was I thought it was the coolest rifle I'd ever seen. We didn't fire a shot on that hunt. But those were my formative years of hunting and I wouldn't trade one day of that for all the hunts I've had since.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 7,226 Senior Member
    Michakav wrote: »
    Exactly my thoughts. The PA game commission did a study of other states that allowed semi's for hunting and found no evidence of increased safety issues. That's why they included semi for big game in the original draft. But, as you have realized, PA hunters are a little traditionalist. Which is fine. It's a start.

    What I found most interesting/**** is that most of those against it were worried about "spray and pray". I found that funny because from what I read there is no magazine restriction for small game and furbearers.

    Tell me about it! Every one of the people I saw against semi-autos had some argument iteration of either 1) you don't need a semi-auto (aka just use a bolt/lever gun like me and grandpappy used to use) or 2) the woods will be filled with spray-and-pray Rambos like they see at the shooting range. Let's ignore the fact that not every trigger ripper at the range even hunts or that have to see a deer before you can kill one. Instead, let's just ignore that guys with Marlin 336s or Remington 7600s (aka the Amish Machine Gun) have been blowing through ammo as bad as anyone for years.

    The most bizarre argument I saw floating around came from a guy claiming that his Vietnam Vet buddies had PTSD triggered by the sight of an AR-15, and that scores of them would quit hunting if they saw them in the woods.

    After 23 years of living in PA, it's still utterly amazing to me how change-averse people are.
    If PA didnt move slow, the flintlock industry as it is today would be gone, and when politicians try to get the gamelands under their control for their bunny hugger buddies, slow can be good. No choice but to let it into the full light of day.

    That's all true. In fact, I made a post about the positives of PA traditionalism in that other forum. I love certain aspects of it, but when it comes to simply refusing to lift a restriction on a weapon system that's never been an issue anywhere else during hunting season because of pure, unfounded fear, I get irritated.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • VarmintmistVarmintmist Senior Member Posts: 6,461 Senior Member
    Well, I dont know if you were around for the crossbow debate, but there were similar complaints. However in that case the BOC did NOT take into consideration the people who pay their salary, hunters, and there was money flying around from xbow manufacturers. It was a bit contentious.

    Like I stated over there, the best thing they could have done is what they did, but eliminated all of the pre decision hype.

    The good thing about this is the odds are better they wont be drawn into a knee jerk reaction and do something even stupider like a cal restriction after it proves out that they are not misused.
    It's boring, and your lack of creativity knows no bounds.
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 7,226 Senior Member
    Yeah, I missed the crossbow debate on there, but I can only imagine.

    The painful part of this from a social forecasting standpoint is that even if there are no differences in accident rates when guys start using ARs and other semi-autos in the field, there will STILL be a contingent that will insist that it will be different/worse if they allow them during deer season. It seriously makes my head hurt because I can already hear it.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
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