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pjames777
Posts: 1,421 Senior Member
Hammer of thor
pjames777
Posts: 1,421 Senior Member
https://youtu.be/DYLbmSp5itA?t=299
Interesting but severe over penetration in 9mm. Be afraid to use this for SD.
Interesting but severe over penetration in 9mm. Be afraid to use this for SD.
Replies
I'm sure anybody shot with it would probably die but not after they killed you and/or ran away. Don't need a penetrator like that for SD-HD. Not sure what role this bullet would play in a 9mm carry or home defense gun. Maybe penetrating body armor.
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
:that:
About the only thing I could see it being maybe (MAYBE) useful for, would be working in and around vehicles, running it out of a carbine/subgun.
I just checked and it's still there. You do realize that youtube probably doesn't work with Windows 98? :jester:
. . .though I do feel the need to "congratulate" them on reinventing the flat nose, water-quenched, cast-of-wheel-weight bullet.
"Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
I'd probably shoot some
- George Orwell
Seems like just more of a bad thing, to me.
In all reality, I think people are losing interest in this forum for whatever reason. There is far less activity on this forum than there used to be and it has nothing to do with rules or moderators.
Welcome to the summer lull.
That's funny right there.
I realize that exists but even this winter was far slower than ever before.
Had the "hollow point" conversation with my brother in law over Mothers Day dinner. He held that common thought that hollow ponts were nore "devastating", and I educated him about over penetration.
I don't know what the application for an overpenetrating bullet might be, but I am sure there is one somewhere.
D
Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
A. How many instances have been recorded where a handgun bullet was well placed on a hostile, and it penetrated to do significant damage to someone on the other side? Darn few. It seems we expect all our gunfights to take place in Times Square on New Year's Eve, at least judging by the hysteria surrounding this topic.
B. How many instances have been recorded where a threat was not stopped because a bullet didn't penetrate far enough to hit something vital? Quite a lot - the lightweight expanding bullet fad of the 1980's largely contributing to the persistent notion that the 9mm is "useless". Not enough seems to cause us more problems than too much. It's the "parachute" bullets that concern me, not the hammer-faced ones.
C. Why do we spend so much time on preaching and thinking about Safety Rule #4: Be aware of your target, it's surroundings, and what lies beyond, yet cease to even CONSIDER it when contemplating our defense ammo, or shooting scenarios. . . wetting ourselves at the slightest possibility of "OMG!!! IT MIGHT PASS THROUGH!!! I'd better switch to Glasers!"?
D. What percentage of rounds in gunfights actually hit their intended target? It's something like 30% or less. No matter how sexy the hollowpoint, that other 70% will have their cavities fill up with drywall or get collapsed by car body metal, at which point they're truckin' on downrange just like the cheapest of FMJ round noses. I'm far more concerned about where these strays end up than I am the good hit that gets a significantly greater braking effect from the juicy, water-filled center of the average felon.
I think expanding bullets are a fine and dandy idea, but I think we need to change our thinking about designing them. My ideal would work more like the hunting bullet that we WANT to exit, pushing a wave of tissue ahead of itself and forcefully driving it out the back side, making a larger hole on the way out than it did on the way in. Yes, it's really cool when a felon drops instantly from a bullet that is stopped by the skin or clothing on the far side of the body, but what are we risking with a bullet designed to come to a stop after making a hole so shallow? From certain angles we possibly DON'T get the penetration to vital organs we need, and we DON'T get the two-sided tension pneumothorax effect (sucking chest wound) that is a major cause of battlefield incapacitation and fatality.
I did at one time drink the hollowpoint Kool Aid, but have spend the last few years barfing most of it up. Think about what the bullet needs to do, then consider what the Madison Avenue side of the industry is trying to P.T. Barnum you into buying.
Loaded chamber indicators, ignition key locks, DA triggers on automatic pistols, and bullets that don't penetrate enough: all items developed in an ill-considered attempt to somehow make safe an item whose whole reason for existing is to be dangerous.
"Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
neighborhood, you may have to worry about over-penetration, and adjust ammo accordingly.
But BGs generally won't jump you in a crowd of people. If you are in the country, where there is
soft ground all around, and more open spaces, the background is going to be much less of an issue
than the "PT Barnums" are going to sell it to be.
THAT would be an EXCELLENT call!
The .32 and .380 Autos can penetrate plenty UNTIL you start asking them to expand. With those rounds, there's only enough energy for adequate penetration, or expansion, but not both. For that reason, my preferred .380 load has been the Winchester white box Q4206, which is a 95 grain flat nosed FMJ. It'll make the Tootsie Roll center of the Tootsiepop, and the flat point will tend to add slightly more girth to the wound channel.
Whether these flutes actually add any effect to the squared off meplat or not, it at least indicates that Hornady's points are sparking.
"Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee