The Trump Tariffs

alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior MemberPosts: 8,073 Senior Member
They don't seem particularly smart. We manufacture way more stuff with steel and aluminum than we manufacture those things. Raising the prices on steel and aluminum will make our broader manufacturing less competitive. So while it may help save a few tens of thousands of jobs in the steel industry it may cost hundreds of thousands of jobs in manufacturing. I sure hope there is a bigger game/smarter game plan in place. Maybe their is, but so far I haven't been given enough evidence to believe this has been fully thought out and isn't just more "governing by chaos". Everything I've read from economists and economic pundits I trust seems to indicate this was not smart. I guess we'll see how this plays out.
"Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
-DoctorWho

Replies

  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 16,917 Senior Member
    If it stops crap Chinese steel from entering this country, I'll pay the little bit extra for products.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    My Karma ran over your Dogma!
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 14,252 Senior Member
    edited March 5 #3
    Give a tax cut with one hand and take away through higher prices in building materials with the other. I am in construction. I use:

    Aluminum? Check.
    Steel? Check.
    Lumber? Check.

     I also want to get into distilling. What is the EU talking about doing n retaliation? Putting tariffs on bourbon. I can't seem to win!
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 1,720 Senior Member
    I'm not sure if I understand tariffs so I'll be reading this.

    I've always kind of assumed they have handled with alot more caution post WWII.

    New outlets are reporting Trump's comments and plans with heavy alarm.
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 7,987 Senior Member
    I'm not sure if I understand tariffs so I'll be reading this.

    I've always kind of assumed they have handled with alot more caution post WWII.

    New outlets are reporting Trump's comments and plans with heavy alarm.
    Trump can find a cure for the common cold and the media would call him horrible for making the drug companies lose millions from cough medicine sales 

    His goal is to keep chinese steel out.  Remember the chinese steel in mexico and the building frame still sitting today because of nuclear contamination?
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 16,917 Senior Member
    Who gives a damn about the EU - its a hot mess on the verge of collapse.

    His goal is to keep Chinese steel out.  Remember the Chinese steel in Mexico and the building frame still sitting today because of nuclear contamination?
    I don't know anything about that, but I do know the fiasco about the new section of the Oakland-San Francisco bay bridge. Some kind of bolt thingies - "Hecho en China" that were sub standard. A national disgrace if you ask me!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    My Karma ran over your Dogma!
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 14,252 Senior Member
    edited March 6 #7
    Diver43 said:

    His goal is to keep chinese steel out.  Remember the chinese steel in mexico and the building frame still sitting today because of nuclear contamination?
    China doesn't even make it as one of the top 10 steel importers into our country....

    https://www.trade.gov/steel/countries/pdfs/imports-us.pdf


  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 14,252 Senior Member
    Give a tax cut with one hand and take away through higher prices in building materials with the other. I am in construction. I use:

    Aluminum? Check.
    Steel? Check.
    Lumber? Check.

     I also want to get into distilling. What is the EU talking about doing n retaliation? Putting tariffs on bourbon. I can't seem to win!
    Oh... I wanted to put solar panels on the distillery roof too. That may be financially out of reach now. Doh! You would think after Obama urinated away all that taxpayer money-- picking winners and losers in industry, and specifically that disaster Solyndra, lessons would have been learned, but nooooooooo.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 23,288 Senior Member
    China has announced that they will be building a solar panel factory in the U.S. and some others that shut down may be starting back up soon. Threatening to slap on tariffs might just be a sneaky way to get the other nations we trade with to come to the table without all the aces up their sleeve like Snuffy Smith.

    Tariffs are a dangerous thing. They were the real main cause of the 2nd American Revolutionary War, misnamed the Civil War. Protecting Northern industrial interests with the unconscionable Morrill Tariff was the straw that broke the camel's back.
    I may be a Deplorable, but at least I'm not a Liberal!!!



  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 14,252 Senior Member
    I see Trump is using it as leverage in NAFTA negotiations. Maybe this is all a bluff. I guess we will have to wait and see.
  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,073 Senior Member
    Diver43 said:
    I'm not sure if I understand tariffs so I'll be reading this.

    I've always kind of assumed they have handled with alot more caution post WWII.

    New outlets are reporting Trump's comments and plans with heavy alarm.
    Trump can find a cure for the common cold and the media would call him horrible for making the drug companies lose millions from cough medicine sales 

    His goal is to keep chinese steel out.  Remember the chinese steel in mexico and the building frame still sitting today because of nuclear contamination?
    If that we're his goal he could put a tariff specifically on Chinese steel. As Jerm says Chinese steel is a tiny fraction of what we import. 

    With more news it does seems to be a negotiation tactic re NAFTA. We'll see. I hope that's true.

    A global trade war is not good for anyone. The markets are already stretched, the bull is really tired, and it won't take much to tip us into recession. We've already shot our wad with low interest rates and massive tax cuts and spending increases. Not a whole lot of room for stimulus to help kickstart things if they do crash. 
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • Cheetoh734Cheetoh734 Senior Member Posts: 710 Senior Member
    I think its more about re-setting the bar on our trade market. If we want to be competitive we have to bring standards and practices up, not try and compete with China, India etc on who can do it cheapest. I think it will be interesting where this goes. Half the stuff he does makes me cringe, but he did hire some really smart economists and so far, what he's doing is getting results like I've not seen before.
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,112 Senior Member
    I think it is a ploy to get Mexico to the table to renegotiate NAFTA. If so, they are going to call his bluff, forcing him to go ahead with it. Mexico won't take him serious until he shuts down illegal immigration. Until then, they will believe that the Democrats are going to find a way to throw him out of office, and put them back on 'Easy Street.'

    I don't know what the repercussions will be. I know trade wars will hurt us, but I also believe our national security is vulnerable, with no steel and aluminum manufacturers, and 20% of our uranium going to the Soviet Union er, I mean Russia.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 16,917 Senior Member
    And remember folks, NAFTA was shoved down our throats by BOTH parties - Clinton and Bush both agreed that it was a "good thing (tm)".
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    My Karma ran over your Dogma!
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 1,720 Senior Member
    I don't know if it's true, but NPR reported that 3/4 of global steel production is American made. If that's true, seems like national security may be an exaggerated issue.
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 14,252 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    And remember folks, NAFTA was shoved down our throats by BOTH parties - Clinton and Bush both agreed that it was a "good thing (tm)".
    It has been and should continue to be. It could use some updating and tweaking, but it has boosted commerce and prosperity for all three countries.
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,695 Senior Member
    edited March 6 #17
    Sometimes I am embarrassed by Trump, and other times impressed.  He is using this as an "anchor" position in negotiating, but his public bravado masks his game plan.  We will not see these tariffs.  We will see NAFTA and perhaps a better Pacific trade deal down the pipe.  These tariffs will be the fall back position.

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 23,288 Senior Member
    I see him as threatening Armageddon and then the players that have been hosing us being satisfied with giving us just a few needed tweaks on NAFTA and other trade deals that benefit the US for a change. He's doing the businessman thing of making a dire threat to get the players more interested in talking concessions. Whole lot different from Shrub and Batears bending over and spreading. Give it time to see where Trump is going with this. We buy a lot of stuff from those folks, and you have to admit it's a good idea to keep the customer happy.
    I may be a Deplorable, but at least I'm not a Liberal!!!



  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,112 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    I see him as threatening Armageddon and then the players that have been hosing us being satisfied with giving us just a few needed tweaks on NAFTA and other trade deals that benefit the US for a change. He's doing the businessman thing of making a dire threat to get the players more interested in talking concessions. Whole lot different from Shrub and Batears bending over and spreading. Give it time to see where Trump is going with this. We buy a lot of stuff from those folks, and you have to admit it's a good idea to keep the customer happy.
    If so, and if it works, he may have some of the Cold War brinkmanship skills that I have complained about us losing. Nothing scared Kruschev more than the thought that we had elected a cowboy.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 16,917 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    And remember folks, NAFTA was shoved down our throats by BOTH parties - Clinton and Bush both agreed that it was a "good thing (tm)".
    It has been and should continue to be. It could use some updating and tweaking, but it has boosted commerce and prosperity for all three countries.
    Riiiiiiiiight...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    My Karma ran over your Dogma!
  • BAMAAKBAMAAK Senior Member Posts: 4,256 Senior Member
    edited March 6 #21
    Obama put a tariff on tire imports.  Seemed like all tires went up, not just imports.
    "He only earns his freedom and his life Who takes them every day by storm."

    -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, German writer and politician
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