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Florida has a downward slide due to gun control

breamfisherbreamfisher Senior MemberPosts: 13,490 Senior Member
edited December 2018 in Second Amendment/Politics #1
G&A regularly ranks each state based on gun legislation.  This year they ranked FL in at #23.  While still in the top half, that's a bit lower than the state's previous ranking of #12. 

http://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/best-states-for-gun-owners-2018/327233

Per the article:
The Florida Legislature was the epicenter of the gun control movement this spring, with hundreds of protesters gathering at the capital in the wake of the Parkland Shooting. I was there and it was ugly. The Legislature responded by passing a bill that banned long gun sales to 18-20 year olds, banned “bump stocks”, created a three-day waiting period for nearly all firearm sales and created a means of seizing firearms via “Risk Protection Orders”. The bright spot in the bill was the establishment of a “Guardian” program that would arm certain school officials but the 132 hours of mandated training, including 80 hours of firearms training, seems pretty excessive. Oh, and don’t forget the additional 12 hours of required diversity training. But for this latest affront to Florida’s law-abiding gun owners, the state remains highly-ranked in our survey thanks to one of the nation’s most successful shall-issue permit systems, a thriving competitive shooting culture and an excellent Castle Doctrine statute. (Previous ranking: 12)     

The Guardian program, IMHO, is one of those "well, we did something" programs in regards to arming school officials.  132 hours is a bit of time to go through, and the 80 hours of firearm training probably has to be paid for by the teacher/administrator themselves.  A lot of schools have instead gone to resource officers with the sheriff's department, or the sheriff's departments have put a guardian in place: basically someone who meets qualifications and is able to respond to emergencies.

Of note is that the legislature (Republican) and current governor (Republican) passed the laws that allowed this skid.  I know, I know, "think how much worse it would be with the Democrats in office."  It's still pretty restrictive.  Minimum age of 21 for any firearm sales?  11 positions is a pretty big slide.


Overkill is underrated.
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Replies

  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 22,984 Senior Member
    My wife and I moved here to get away from this kind of crap.
    If it keeps up, we may be moving again someday...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,564 Senior Member
    If the socialist had gotten elected, I might have been planning to bail sooner rather than later.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,483 Senior Member
    How many state reps who voted yes lost their jobs at the last election? Feet to the fire and all...
    When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.

    Adam J. McCleod


  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 22,984 Senior Member
    If the socialist had gotten elected, I might have been planning to bail sooner rather than later.
    That was our thought as well.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • terminator012terminator012 Senior Member Posts: 3,929 Senior Member
    Looks like me wanting to move to Florida might not be a good idea.
  • Big Al1Big Al1 Senior Member Posts: 7,692 Senior Member
    The new head of the Dept. of Agriculture is a lib and she's already messing with concealed carry. 
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,490 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #8
    Well, after the debacle with Adam Putnam and background checks, it's not surprising.  From what I've read she says she wants to make changes, but hasn't really said what they are, other than moving permitting to FDLE, a bad move in my opinion, and having only full-time employees do the checks.

    I'm not saying I welcome the changes, I'm just saying that after some stuff that happened, change should be somewhat expected.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/article222522995.html

    Overkill is underrated.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,105 Senior Member
    We've got a Tennessee state senator, supposedly a Republican (more like a boot licking turncoat RINO with highly Democrat leanings) that is going to introduce a Red Flag law in the legislature in January. I've already E-mailed my representatives and told them that I don't support that and why. I don't think it will have enough support to pass, but stranger things have passed in the TN legislature.


    Any time a politician says "I support gun rights and the Second Amendment, BUT...", then you can bet the farm that that first part is negated by what follows the BUT.

      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,490 Senior Member
    I'll go one further: any time a politician has to tell you they support any kind of rights because their actions show differently... they don't support those rights.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #11
    Based on current Florida law, I don't think the new Agriculture Commissioner can mess with too much, Florida is a "shall issue" state, not a "may issue" state by Florida Statute 790.06 (link to the actual Florida Statute here):  http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0790/Sections/0790.06.html
    I don't have a problem with only full time employees running the background checks and moving the permitting process to the FDLE would take an act of the Florida Legislature and a signature from the Governor (incoming governor Ron DeSantis who has an A+ rating from the NRA if I remember correctly).  I also did note that the incoming Agriculture Commissioner has had a concealed weapons license herself for several years.....that is encouraging at least.


  • terminator012terminator012 Senior Member Posts: 3,929 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    We've got a Tennessee state senator, supposedly a Republican (more like a boot licking turncoat RINO with highly Democrat leanings) that is going to introduce a Red Flag law in the legislature in January. I've already E-mailed my representatives and told them that I don't support that and why. I don't think it will have enough support to pass, but stranger things have passed in the TN legislature.


    Any time a politician says "I support gun rights and the Second Amendment, BUT...", then you can bet the farm that that first part is negated by what follows the BUT.

    Uh oh. Here we go. There is just to many ways that law can go wrong.
  • kansashunterkansashunter Senior Member Posts: 1,745 Senior Member
    Sorry to derail this but I have a question that I wanted you guys in Florida. I heard you passed a law to give felons voting rights. How do toy think that will affect your elections? We elected a governor with a f NRA rating but a more conservative house. I don't know what changes we are facing but I hope holding on to what we have.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    It certainly won't have a positive effect.  I just hope it will not be too negative.  The reason it passed was that someone was running TV ads supporting it but nobody bothered to run any apposing ads pointing out the problems with it......such as it did not exempt all violent felons.  For the record, I voted against it.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    Well I'm happy to report that in NC because of the mid-term election votes we now have:

    -A Constitutional Amendment preserving the right to hunt and fish using traditional methods and establishing this as the preferred method of wildlife management.
    -A Constitutional Amendment requiring a valid ID for voting.
    -A Constitutional Amendment outlining crime victims rights.
    -A Constitutional Amendment putting a cap on personal income tax.

    I think I made the right choice for a place to live.
    Then again Florida does not have a state income tax....
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    cpj said:
    I fully, 100%, support a felons right to vote. Once you’ve done your time and let out, you get your rights back. If the crime you committed is
    so bad that it’s gonna cause a stir that you voted, why in the hell are you out of jail? 
    The way I look at it, convicted felons do not have a track record of making good choices.  If they are allowed to vote again, now they have the potential to make bad choices that affect me, not just them.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    cpj said:
    cpj said:
    I fully, 100%, support a felons right to vote. Once you’ve done your time and let out, you get your rights back. If the crime you committed is
    so bad that it’s gonna cause a stir that you voted, why in the hell are you out of jail? 
    The way I look at it, convicted felons do not have a track record of making good choices.  If they are allowed to vote again, now they have the potential to make bad choices that affect me, not just them.
    So if a dumbass teenager/young adult, hell anyone, makes a dumb mistake, he’s dumb for life, right? And there’s no chance a convicted felons political choices would ever align with yours? And besides, any time   that we can use legal means to hold back someone who we don’t believe to be as good/smart  as us is a WIN!   I Agree 100%. 🙄 

    There was already a process in place to restore voting rights to convicted felons who were not habitual offenders.  It was not an easy process, but it shouldn't be, they had to earn the right back.  This new constitutional amendment just gives anybody and everybody (gangbangers included) their voting rights back automatically.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 22,984 Senior Member
    About the only thing I can really complain about  here in Florida are the property taxes - they're sky high and out of control. Other than that, I'm a happy camper!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,490 Senior Member
    ...that's in part due to the lack of a state income tax.  You gotta pay for those services somehow.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    My property tax with Homestead Exemption is under $600 a year......
  • sgtrock21sgtrock21 Senior Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    Based on current Florida law, I don't think the new Agriculture Commissioner can mess with too much, Florida is a "shall issue" state, not a "may issue" state by Florida Statute 790.06 (link to the actual Florida Statute here):  http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0790/Sections/0790.06.html
    I don't have a problem with only full time employees running the background checks and moving the permitting process to the FDLE would take an act of the Florida Legislature and a signature from the Governor (incoming governor Ron DeSantis who has an A+ rating from the NRA if I remember correctly).  I also did note that the incoming Agriculture Commissioner has had a concealed weapons license herself for several years.....that is encouraging at least.



    I keep trying but fail to understand the State Department of Agriculture being in charge of CCWs. Oregon has always been County Sheriffs and I'm not aware of any problems.
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    ;a href="/profile/sgtrock21">sgtrock21 said:
    Based on current Florida law, I don't think the new Agriculture Commissioner can mess with too much, Florida is a "shall issue" state, not a "may issue" state by Florida Statute 790.06 (link to the actual Florida Statute here):  http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0790/Sections/0790.06.html
    I don't have a problem with only full time employees running the background checks and moving the permitting process to the FDLE would take an act of the Florida Legislature and a signature from the Governor (incoming governor Ron DeSantis who has an A+ rating from the NRA if I remember correctly).  I also did note that the incoming Agriculture Commissioner has had a concealed weapons license herself for several years.....that is encouraging at least.



    I keep trying but fail to understand the State Department of Agriculture being in charge of CCWs. Oregon has always been County Sheriffs and I'm not aware of any problems.
    That is simply the agency that the Florida Legislature decided to place it under.  My understanding is that it was so that it would be under an elected official (Commissioner of Agriculture) not an appointed bureaucrat.  The problem with placing it under the various Sheriffs is that Florida has a preemption law in regards to firearms regulation.  That means that the Florida Legislature reserves the right exclusively for itself in regards to any and all firearms regulation.  Placing the program under a state agency rather than various counties ensures uniform application and oversight of the process.  This is a good thing because it means you don't have to worry about different rules depending on which county or city you are in.  The laws are uniform statewide.
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,564 Senior Member
    Sorry to derail this but I have a question that I wanted you guys in Florida. I heard you passed a law to give felons voting rights. How do toy think that will affect your elections? We elected a governor with a f NRA rating but a more conservative house. I don't know what changes we are facing but I hope holding on to what we have.
    It wasn't a "law," it was a constitutional amendment, that was approved by voters. I voted No, because I think most of these felons that might will get their voting rights back are Democrats. There was a study done on that subject recently that said the premise is not true, but we will see what happens.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,105 Senior Member
    cpj said:
    cpj said:
    I fully, 100%, support a felons right to vote. Once you’ve done your time and let out, you get your rights back. If the crime you committed is
    so bad that it’s gonna cause a stir that you voted, why in the hell are you out of jail? 
    The way I look at it, convicted felons do not have a track record of making good choices.  If they are allowed to vote again, now they have the potential to make bad choices that affect me, not just them.
    So if a dumbass teenager/young adult, hell anyone, makes a dumb mistake, he’s dumb for life, right? And there’s no chance a convicted felons political choices would ever align with yours? And besides, any time   that we can use legal means to hold back someone who we don’t believe to be as good/smart  as us is a WIN!   I Agree 100%. 🙄 

    There was already a process in place to restore voting rights to convicted felons who were not habitual offenders.  It was not an easy process, but it shouldn't be, they had to earn the right back.  This new constitutional amendment just gives anybody and everybody (gangbangers included) their voting rights back automatically.
    Someone that has committed a felony has broken a trust with society and has lost their respect. Having them work to regain that trust and respect isn't a stretch. On a personal level, if someone breaks a trust and loses our individual respect and trust, we don't just say 'no harm, no foul' and continue on with the relationship as usual. That person has to regain that trust and respect. And that shouldn't be an easy process, either.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member Posts: 5,797 Senior Member
    Well I'm happy to report that in NC because of the mid-term election votes we now have:

    -A Constitutional Amendment preserving the right to hunt and fish using traditional methods and establishing this as the preferred method of wildlife management.
    -A Constitutional Amendment requiring a valid ID for voting.
    -A Constitutional Amendment outlining crime victims rights.
    -A Constitutional Amendment putting a cap on personal income tax.

    I think I made the right choice for a place to live.
    Then again Florida does not have a state income tax....
    True but since there is no free lunch you pay somewhere.  My cost of living in FL was about 30% higher than NC.



    Down where you lived is probably the highest cost of living in the state. It's pretty high in Zorba's neck of the woods also but once you get north of Ocala and away from the coast and big cities, about the only thing that is unreasonably high is auto insurance.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 22,984 Senior Member
    I'd be further inland if I could be - wife likes the coast. If I never saw the ocean again, it would be 37 seconds too soon. I *literally* worked right on the beach in California, I'm coasted out.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member Posts: 5,797 Senior Member
    This part of Florida defies logic at times as Fort Walton is only about five miles down the road from Destin but real estate is at least twice as much in Destin and gas, groceries, and hotels are all higher in Destin.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • 10canyon5310canyon53 Member Posts: 1,919 Senior Member
    Fisheadgib said:
    Down where you lived is probably the highest cost of living in the state. It's pretty high in Zorba's neck of the woods also but once you get north of Ocala and away from the coast and big cities, about the only thing that is unreasonably high is auto insurance.
    Agreed, I guess it's unfair to judge all of FL by my COL in South Florida.  But even when I was living in St Augustine it was still a little steep.  Not as bad as living in the Northeast but I was surprised when I first moved to FL I was expecting my money to go a lot further.  My mistake was staying close to shore but for myself it would have made no sense to move to FL and go inland.  If I'm not in the mountains I want sand between my toes.  

    In St. Augustine I was right on the coast and in South FL I used to walk to be able to the beach so that would account for the high cost of living.  But, I am comparing apples to apples because here in NC I'm coastal too and not inland where the cost of living is significantly lower from what I've seen.
    In both places you were living in a tourist/high rent district.  For example, this morning when I left my house to head for South Florida I filled up my gas tank and paid $2.06 a gallon.  The gas stations I passed in Boca Raton were advertising $2.37 a gallon.  Since I was driving a Suburban with a nearly 500 mile range on a full tank, I was able to drive down and back without buying the expensive gas.  :)   When you get out of the areas that attract tourists and snowbirds things get a lot cheaper.
  • terminator012terminator012 Senior Member Posts: 3,929 Senior Member
    I remember like 35 years ago when the cost of a case of beer in Florida was half what it was in TN and that was on the beach.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,351 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    My wife and I moved here to get away from this kind of crap.
    If it keeps up, we may be moving again someday...
      I told you that you should have come to Texas. Yeah, we don't have the pretty white beaches but we don't have ten million libtards come here for sun and fun either. We have Snow Birds but they're mostly from the more gun friendly Mid West.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 22,984 Senior Member
    Kentucky would have been my first choice.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
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