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Paper punching 6.5 options

WORLD TWORLD T MemberPosts: 262 Member
I am in the market for a paper punching 6.5 Creedmoor rifle. I have narrowed it down to the following. What is everyone's opinion of these rifles?
 https://www.steyr-arms.com/us/prothb-65creedmoor.html 
https://www.browning.com/products/firearms/rifles/x-bolt/current-production/x-bolt-hells-canyon-long-range.html

Thanks in advance.

«13

Replies

  • bellcatbellcat Senior Member Posts: 1,934 Senior Member
    They both look like winners to me.   I've never shot a Steyr, so I'd be willing to try it.
    "Kindness is the language the deaf can hear and the blind can see." Mark Twain
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,594 Senior Member
    My friend just bought a Hells Canyon, 300WM.   AWESOME rifle.  For hunting.  Light, quick handling.
    Not something I'd buy for paper punching.  Way too light.
  • MichakavMichakav Senior Member Posts: 2,824 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #4
    Just my opinion, but,neither for paper punching.


  • FFLshooterFFLshooter Member Posts: 1,057 Senior Member
    Here ya go. I’ll even ditch the cheap scope and put on a good one for ya!
  • orchidmanorchidman Senior Member Posts: 8,187 Senior Member
    You can get a 26" barrel Howa in 6,5 Creedmore for $795 from Buds.
    Use the money you save to buy a better stock for it.



    Just my thoughts......



    Still enjoying the trip of a lifetime and making the best of what I have.....
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #7
    Have to agree on the "neither" opinions.  You could get a Ruger American,  add a Timney and a better stock for less and shoot as good if not better.  More money left for glass.
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 2,332 Senior Member
    I vote neither. Ruger Precision and Bergara HMR can be had for a lot less $ and will very likely provide more precision when killing those pesky paper targets.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    OK I see the rage here, I just don't get yet. What is the majic of the Creedmore? Again, tell me what advantage it has over the .260 Remington, because I'm having a hard time buying it. I've heard zee say he has .260s and he sounds happy with them. I can get a .260 Remington in a 700, put a Timney and a good stock on it and still be way ahead money wise and probably accuracy wise.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    I used to have a Steyr for work. One of my first bolt guns. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    cpj said:
    snake284 said:
    OK I see the rage here, I just don't get yet. What is the majic of the Creedmore? Again, tell me what advantage it has over the .260 Remington, because I'm having a hard time buying it. I've heard zee say he has .260s and he sounds happy with them. I can get a .260 Remington in a 700, put a Timney and a good stock on it and still be way ahead money wise and probably accuracy wise.
    The main magic is good marketing. The only real advantage over the .260 is magazine length is greater, allowing longer bullets. 
    If that’s a concern. 
    That's what I was thinking, but isn't the .260 case longer than the Creed? That should make up for some of the room gained by seating bullets out farther. I guess the experts have checked it out but I sure smell a marketing rat here.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,132 Senior Member
    Snake, they kept the magazine length the same but the case body is a little fatter but it is shorter. The result is that they can make factory (SAAMI spec) ammo that has the advantages of hand loaded (out of SAAMI spec) .260 Remington ammo. If you don't reload, the Creedmoor is going to give you a slight edge over factory .260 ammo. If you reload, it doesn't make a damn bit of difference.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #13
    Its simple. 

    The 6.5 CM (and most of the new cartridges in the last ten years) are built as a package that is normally a custom route.  

    The 260 is SAAMI spec'd with a 1:9 barrel.  Go look at ammo, most stops at 130 gr for high BC bullets.  

    The 6.5 is spec'd at 1:8. Again,  go look at ammo,  up to 147 gr for VLD bullets.  


    Its not rocket science,  but the fudds refuse to acknowledge that 2 different cartridges CAN exist at the same time.  

    The CM's, the Noslers, the PRC's are built,  as FACTORY GUNS,  set up the way people BUILD CUSTOM guns. They're SAAMI spec'd for long seating,  long bullets,  and still function in a magazine.  Because the overwhelming vast majority of shooters/hunters, want to buy a gun,  buy OFF THE SHELF ammo, and go shoot. The overwhelming VAST majority do NOT reload. They do NOT want single shot repeaters,  they do NOT understand twist and bullet length.  

    Can you load 108gr bullets ina 243? Yes, if you've built a gun for it. Can you make factory ammo for it? NO! because billy bobs grandpas 1974 Ruger with a 1:10 twist will not stabilize it. But Billy Bob the 4ths 6mm Creedmore CAN shoot FACTORY 108 gr ammo, because his FACTORY rifle has a 1:7.7 twist SPEC barrel and $30 per box factory ammo. 
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    Every cartridge that was ever "needed" was designed and built before 1912. Need ain't got **** to do with it, and everyone that makes the "what does XXX do that XXX has been doing for XX years" needs a swift kick in the groin,  because almost every. single. cartridge. Was never "needed" in the last 100+ years
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,545 Senior Member
    My vote would be something cheap like a Ruger American and then changing what needs changed to make it just right for you.  Probably be a lot less expensive in the end.
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    snake284 said:
    cpj said:
    snake284 said:
    OK I see the rage here, I just don't get yet. What is the majic of the Creedmore? Again, tell me what advantage it has over the .260 Remington, because I'm having a hard time buying it. I've heard zee say he has .260s and he sounds happy with them. I can get a .260 Remington in a 700, put a Timney and a good stock on it and still be way ahead money wise and probably accuracy wise.
    The main magic is good marketing. The only real advantage over the .260 is magazine length is greater, allowing longer bullets. 
    If that’s a concern. 
    That's what I was thinking, but isn't the .260 case longer than the Creed? That should make up for some of the room gained by seating bullets out farther. I guess the experts have checked it out but I sure smell a marketing rat here.
    Load a 140gr high BC to the same dept in a 260 as a 6.5CM. Now try to put that in a magazine. 
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • MichakavMichakav Senior Member Posts: 2,824 Senior Member
    Every cartridge that was ever "needed" was designed and built before 1912. Need ain't got **** to do with it, and everyone that makes the "what does XXX do that XXX has been doing for XX years" needs a swift kick in the groin,  because almost every. single. cartridge. Was never "needed" in the last 100+ years

    Amen! I get tired of hearing the same crap. ANY new cartridge that comes out is good for the industry. Some will last and some won't. Just like in the past.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 24,196 Senior Member
    cpj said:
    Dear God that Styer is hideous looking. 
    How does it stack up with that lovely poop-brown stock of mine in your estimation? :D
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    Somebody has been drinking. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    cpj said:
    Factory rifles are boring as ****. 
    Factory ammo is gross. 

    This. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    Michakav said:
    I get tired of hearing the same crap. ANY new cartridge that comes out is good for the industry. Some will last and some won't. Just like in the past.
    This too. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #22
    snake284 said:
    cpj said:
    snake284 said:
    OK I see the rage here, I just don't get yet. What is the majic of the Creedmore? Again, tell me what advantage it has over the .260 Remington, because I'm having a hard time buying it. I've heard zee say he has .260s and he sounds happy with them. I can get a .260 Remington in a 700, put a Timney and a good stock on it and still be way ahead money wise and probably accuracy wise.
    The main magic is good marketing. The only real advantage over the .260 is magazine length is greater, allowing longer bullets. 
    If that’s a concern. 
    That's what I was thinking, but isn't the .260 case longer than the Creed? That should make up for some of the room gained by seating bullets out farther. I guess the experts have checked it out but I sure smell a marketing rat here.
    Load a 140gr high BC to the same dept in a 260 as a 6.5CM. Now try to put that in a magazine. 
    I don’t have to. 

    I can single load my .260 Remington handloads almost as fast as your mag fed Creed and have better ballistics in the end. 

    Wanna play?

    😁
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • sakodudesakodude Senior Member Posts: 4,117 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #23
    cpj said:
    Its simple. 

    The 6.5 CM (and most of the new cartridges in the last ten years) are built as a package that is normally a custom route.  

    The 260 is SAAMI spec'd with a 1:9 barrel.  Go look at ammo, most stops at 130 gr for high BC bullets.  

    The 6.5 is spec'd at 1:8. Again,  go look at ammo,  up to 147 gr for VLD bullets.  


    Its not rocket science,  but the fudds refuse to acknowledge that 2 different cartridges CAN exist at the same time.  

    The CM's, the Noslers, the PRC's are built,  as FACTORY GUNS,  set up the way people BUILD CUSTOM guns. They're SAAMI spec'd for long seating,  long bullets,  and still function in a magazine.  Because the overwhelming vast majority of shooters/hunters, want to buy a gun,  buy OFF THE SHELF ammo, and go shoot. The overwhelming VAST majority do NOT reload. They do NOT want single shot repeaters,  they do NOT understand twist and bullet length.  

    Can you load 108gr bullets ina 243? Yes, if you've built a gun for it. Can you make factory ammo for it? NO! because billy bobs grandpas 1974 Ruger with a 1:10 twist will not stabilize it. But Billy Bob the 4ths 6mm Creedmore CAN shoot FACTORY 108 gr ammo, because his FACTORY rifle has a 1:7.7 twist SPEC barrel and $30 per box factory ammo. 
    Factory rifles are boring as ****. 
    Factory ammo is gross. 

    I can only agree with the ammo part of this statement. Other than .22 and shot shells, I have not fired a factory round in over 30 years. Every round I have fired however, was fired from a factory firearm and I make no apology for that. 
    I really have no desire to build anything, If I can find something that sparks my interest in a factory gun, why would I go through the headache of building one.
    More power to you guys that can build it yourself or keep the smiths in business, I hope you are forever as happy with your choices as I am with mine.

    Sako
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    snake284 said:
    cpj said:
    snake284 said:
    OK I see the rage here, I just don't get yet. What is the majic of the Creedmore? Again, tell me what advantage it has over the .260 Remington, because I'm having a hard time buying it. I've heard zee say he has .260s and he sounds happy with them. I can get a .260 Remington in a 700, put a Timney and a good stock on it and still be way ahead money wise and probably accuracy wise.
    The main magic is good marketing. The only real advantage over the .260 is magazine length is greater, allowing longer bullets. 
    If that’s a concern. 
    That's what I was thinking, but isn't the .260 case longer than the Creed? That should make up for some of the room gained by seating bullets out farther. I guess the experts have checked it out but I sure smell a marketing rat here.
    Load a 140gr high BC to the same dept in a 260 as a 6.5CM. Now try to put that in a magazine. 
    I don’t have to. 

    I can single load my .260 Remington handloads almost as fast as your mag fed Creed and have better ballistics in the end. 

    Wanna play?

    😁
    Obviously your reading comprehension is no where near your shooting ability
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,871 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #25
    cpj said:
    “what does XXX do that XXX has been doing for XX years" needs a swift kick in the groin,”




    Horse crap. 
    It’s a valid question. 
    You answered what advantage the CM has over the .260. They are valid points. 

    To accept some manufactures marketing wank as gospel truth is idiocy. Prime example was the 22 Nosler. It’s velocity comparison to the 223 was an enormous pile of horse crap. They showed  a .223 at the absolute bottom of the velocity scale in comparison to their magical cartridge. (That wasn’t but a touch faster than FACTORY .223) That was nothing more than the wool being pulled over the ignorant buying public’s eye. 

    So yeah. Anyone with half a brain SHOULD ask “why? What DOES this do that ______cant?”
    The last part yes, if someone will listen and accept the answers like you did in the first paragraph,  that IS a valid question.  But we both know the majority of those asking the question just leave it as "the 260 came out first,  so why something new? " and will refuse to listen to the points of fact like you did in the SAAMI specs. 

    But you illustrated my point by saying factory is boring.  We are the minority.  Factory guns/ammo are the majority. If you want Hornady to keep its doors open so you can still buy XXX brass or bullets,   they have to sell new stuff to new people who don't care about custom anything
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Once again, please refrain from cutting short any baseless totally emotional arguments with facts. It leads to boring, completely objective conversations well beyond the comprehension ability of many.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,603 Senior Member
    Of the two-Steyr.
    I would also consider Howa, Bergara, and Tikka
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    MileHighShooter said:

    Obviously your reading comprehension is no where near your shooting ability
    I read what you wrote. Don’t care. 

    I said I don’t have to seat to mag length. I don’t have to castrate the .260 Remington to Creed levels. I can take a cartridge to it’s full potential and not feel hindered with a single round. 

    Thats the beauty of thinking outside outside the box and handloading. 

    You wanna follow the crowd, by all means. Carry on. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    I am perfectly fine with new cartridges. It’s good for business and good for shooters. 

    Just don’t piss down my back and tell me it’s raining. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,961 Senior Member
    I used to have a sig line by Elmer Keith:

    ”To Hell with efficiency!  It’s performance we want!”
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #30
    Its simple. 

    The 6.5 CM (and most of the new cartridges in the last ten years) are built as a package that is normally a custom route.  

    The 260 is SAAMI spec'd with a 1:9 barrel.  Go look at ammo, most stops at 130 gr for high BC bullets.  

    The 6.5 is spec'd at 1:8. Again,  go look at ammo,  up to 147 gr for VLD bullets.  


    Its not rocket science,  but the fudds refuse to acknowledge that 2 different cartridges CAN exist at the same time.  

    The CM's, the Noslers, the PRC's are built,  as FACTORY GUNS,  set up the way people BUILD CUSTOM guns. They're SAAMI spec'd for long seating,  long bullets,  and still function in a magazine.  Because the overwhelming vast majority of shooters/hunters, want to buy a gun,  buy OFF THE SHELF ammo, and go shoot. The overwhelming VAST majority do NOT reload. They do NOT want single shot repeaters,  they do NOT understand twist and bullet length.  

    Can you load 108gr bullets in a 243? Yes, if you've built a gun for it. Can you make factory ammo for it? NO! because billy bobs grandpas 1974 Ruger with a 1:10 twist won't stabilize them. But Billy Bob the 4ths 6mm Creedmore can shoot 108 grain factory ammo because he has a 1:7.7 twist spec barrel and $30 a box factory ammo.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #31
    OK Disregarding seating bullets out, just case capacity which is larger or which has more powder capacity the Creed or the 260? That is the case capacity not counting neck.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
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