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Paper punching 6.5 options

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Replies

  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    I remember back in college I almost bought a Stoger Styer Manlicher in .243 Winchester. I came within a gnats ass of buying it that day. Not only just at the time, but today it is still one of the finest fit and finished firearms I ever saw before or since. It may look Yugli, but I bet upon closer examination you would think the same thing.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,594 Senior Member
    Water capacity.
    260 Rem  53.5gr
    6.5 Creed  52.5gr.

    I gotta agree with MHS.  We, are not the vast majority.  
    The gun companies are building the "cool" rifles chambered in the new cartridges.  Built with the right barrel/twist.  

    I have a couple friends that bought fancy 6.5 Creedmore rifles, and are pretty sure they're ready to shoot at 1k and beyond.  Guys that shoot patterns at 100.  Factory ammo. 
    But, they believe the hype.  I'm not about to poo poo a man's new rifle, or dreams.  So, I usually just encourage them to work on shooting tiny groups at 100, before they move out.

    If new cartridges get more people, buying guns, shooting, and being outside, then I'm all for it.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #34
    OK First of all, the only reason I buy factory fodder is for initial sight in-break in if you will. (No screw that, if you will or you won't! My gun, iffin I wanna break it in I'll break it in.) AND BRASS. I buy factory to get some brass for initial reloading. I may buy 5 boxes.

    Secondly, and if I'm repeating another post I wrote on here someplace, so be it. But, I got laughed off the page once for suggesting chambering a Yugo in .260 Remington. But I stand by that idea as good. Some here laugh at a Mauser as being slow and inaccurate. I'll almost bet money that if you do all the tricks my gun smith does and square the receiver and bolt with the chamber and barrel and install a stronger firing pin spring and head space it properly you can shoot as accurate as any other rifle on this forum. And the Yugo's chamber is long enough to chamber the longest of 6.5 bullets in a .260 Rem. case out where you have full powder capacity potential with any bullet. Of course it would be nice if Remington would make an intermediate length action.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,939 Senior Member
    I love seeing new cartridges. Regardless of how stupid they are or how long they last. At least folks are trying. 

    I’m EXCEPTIONALLY happy to see so many new 6.5 caliber cartridges as of late. 

    Finally!!
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,598 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #36
    6.5's?  I love 6.5's:  6.5x47 Lapua, 6.5 Creed, 260 Rem, 6.5 Swede, 6.5-284, 6.5-06, 6.5 SAUM, 6.5 Leopard (WSM), and soon, and 26 Nosler (Full **** mode)!
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    6.5's?  I love 6.5's:  6.5x47 Lapua, 6.5 Creed, 260 Rem, 6.5-284, 6.5-06, 6.5 SAUM, 6.5 Leopard (WSM), and soon, and 26 Nosler (Full **** mode)!
    I like the idea of that Leopard.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    I love seeing new cartridges. Regardless of how stupid they are or how long they last. At least folks are trying. 

    I’m EXCEPTIONALLY happy to see so many new 6.5 caliber cartridges as of late. 

    Finally!!
    Oh me too! I just don't like hearing one poo pood over the other.

    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,540 Senior Member
    6.5x55 and 6.5 Grendel here.  I dont know why but I really want a 6.5-06.  Never really saw the allure for the 6.5 Creedmoor over its competitors, but more options cant be that bad right?  
  • ojrojr Senior Member Posts: 1,142 Senior Member
    6.5x55 times 2 here, be cool, go old school and get one, most are 1-8 twist, well the euro ones Sako and Tikka and that will allow you to use the High BC bullets twixt 140 and 147gr out to as far as you can shoot.
    It will also help with your new hobby, Reloading. >:)>:)

    The flight was uneventful, which is what one wants when one is transporting an Elephant.
     Reuters, Dec 2020.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,540 Senior Member
    Both of my 6.5x55 rifles have military barrels on them.   My M96 surplus rifle that appears to be original finish on the metal is a 29" barrel with what I believe is a 1:7.5 twist.  My hunting rifle is also on a M96 action using a recontoured surplus M38 barrel that I believe to also be a 1:7.5 twist.  I could be mistaken though.  They seem to do alright with 160gr RN and 129gr SST, but i have not found a load they really like with a 140gr bullet.
  • ojrojr Senior Member Posts: 1,142 Senior Member
    I use Vihtavuori N560 or ADI2209 [Hodgden 4350] for pretty good results. H4831 is also worth a try.
    The flight was uneventful, which is what one wants when one is transporting an Elephant.
     Reuters, Dec 2020.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    ojr said:
    I use Vihtavuori N560 or ADI2209 [Hodgden 4350] for pretty good results. H4831 is also worth a try.

    ojr said:
    I use Vihtavuori N560 or ADI2209 [Hodgden 4350] for pretty good results. H4831 is also worth a try.
    Have you given RL-17 a try? I have worked up some amazing loads with it in my .250 Savage. Message me.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • JKPJKP Senior Member Posts: 2,331 Senior Member
    Thought the guy asked for a rifle recommendation - not the tired old .260 vs 6.5 CM argument with folks repeating what they saw last time this debate happened. 

    At least Zee has actually shot the .260 enough to have an informed opinion. 
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    JKP said:
    Thought the guy asked for a rifle recommendation - not the tired old .260 vs 6.5 CM argument with folks repeating what they saw last time this debate happened. 

    At least Zee has actually shot the .260 enough to have an informed opinion. 
    There's several informed opinions on here. As far as rehashing old arguments it's what we do here. We've been doing it for 11 years I know of. If someone doesn't want to join in they go to another thread.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,851 Senior Member
    The 6.5 Creedmoor was built from the ground up as a factory cartridge for NRA High Power. Its stated requirements included fitting in a standard .308W while still allowing seating long bullets out far enough to make use of the case capacity, as well as for factory ammo to be something that handloaders could duplicate. In fact, the first factory loads had the load data on the box. 

    For apples-to-apples comparison, ballistically there isn't enough difference to say grace over. However, for its original purpose, being able to fit in already available box magazines was key. 

    For the average Fudd, it doesn't matter. However, I like my 6.5, and am very happy that I can find the ammo at many Wal Marts. 
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,851 Senior Member
    For a paper punching 6.5 CM, however, I wouldn't consider the two guns you're looking at. In the $800-$1200 range I would consider the Tikka T3x CTR, the Bergara B-14 HMR, the Ruger Precision Rifle, or the Howa Bravo. 

    Personally, if I were buying today, it would be the Howa Bravo. I say that despite being very pleased with my T3x CTR. 
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #48
    Now y'all got me wanting something 6.5. But as usual I'm  thinking something different. What do y'all think about necking down an 8x57, 7x57, .257 Roberts(OOPS! Neck up here) to 6.5. In my Yugo actions if I tell my GS to neck it long I'd have plenty of room for seating long because the magazine is long. If I use .257 +P brass I can make plenty of pressure to sling that dude out to max velocity. So, even though it's not cool and tacticool, I believe it would perform and as Zees Elmer Keith Sig line said, "IT'S PERFORMANCE WE'RE AFTER!"
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,939 Senior Member
    I think you’re trying to hard. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    I think you’re trying to hard. 
    Yeah, probably, but the effort is half the fun. Besides, I'm bound and determined to make something work that's not supposed to.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,540 Senior Member
    6.5x57 you say....


  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    mitdr774 said:
    6.5x57 you say....


    Thanks for bringing that up. I knew it wasn't a wild cat and it was a regular Mauser cartridge at some point in history. But I haven't seen nor heard of one in a long time. In a Mauser action I would have plenty of room to seat the longest bullets and in the 57 MM case there's room for lots of propellant. I don't think it gives up much to the 6.5-06.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • Ernie BishopErnie Bishop Senior Member Posts: 7,598 Senior Member
    RWS makes both rimmed or semi-rimmed 6.5x57 brass.  Well, they used to.
    Ernie

    "The Un-Tactical"
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    I want Rimless. But I can make it out of .257 Roberts +P.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,540 Senior Member
    snake284 said:
    mitdr774 said:
    6.5x57 you say....


    Thanks for bringing that up. I knew it wasn't a wild cat and it was a regular Mauser cartridge at some point in history. But I haven't seen nor heard of one in a long time. In a Mauser action I would have plenty of room to seat the longest bullets and in the 57 MM case there's room for lots of propellant. I don't think it gives up much to the 6.5-06.
    I want to say it's a mid 1890s cartridge.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Not sure when it came out. But with good brass and in a good rifle it should be a great cartridge.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,594 Senior Member
    Snake,  just a bit of fact to consider.
    Case capacity of water
    6.5 Creedmore              52.5 gr h20
    .260 Rem                       53.5 gr h20
    6.5x55                            57.9 gr h20
    6.5x57                            58.0 gr h20
    6.5-284                           68.3gr h20
    6.5-06                             68.3gr h20
    264 win mag                 82.0gr h20

  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #58
    jbohio said:
    Snake,  just a bit of fact to consider.
    Case capacity of water
    6.5 Creedmore              52.5 gr h20
    .260 Rem                       53.5 gr h20
    6.5x55                            57.9 gr h20
    6.5x57                            58.0 gr h20
    6.5-284                           68.3gr h20
    6.5-06                             68.3gr h20
    264 win mag                 82.0gr h20

    Yep, that's about what I was guessing. The 6.5x57 holds right at 5 more grains of water (not sure how that will translate to Propellant) than the .260 and 6 more than the Creedmore. The 10 grain difference in it and the 6.5x284 and 6.5-06 don't add up to me. When you compare an 8x57 and an 06 you have very little difference in performance. This comparison is almost the same thing. Same cases actually. The performance doesn't bare this difference in capacity between the 57mm case and the 63mm case out. There performance is close.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,540 Senior Member
    I have always wanted a 6.5x55 on a M98 or some other "strong" action to see what it can actually do when loaded to more typical modern pressures.  I'm not willing to push things on my M96 actions.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #60
    Yes me too mitdr, I've always been curious about that. Yugo actions are strong and would work fine for the 6.5x55 I would think. Seeing as the 6.5 x 55 case is only a hair larger in diameter than the 57mm case it should still work fine in a Yugo.

    I'm thinking about going a little different route and just going with the 6.5X57 case since I have a couple of Yugo donor actions. It holds .1 grain more of water and the Yugo is made for the 57MM case.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    edited December 2018 #61
    snake284 said:
    jbohio said:
    Snake,  just a bit of fact to consider.
    Case capacity of water
    6.5 Creedmore              52.5 gr h20
    .260 Rem                       53.5 gr h20
    6.5x55                            57.9 gr h20
    6.5x57                            58.0 gr h20
    6.5-284                           68.3gr h20
    6.5-06                             68.3gr h20
    264 win mag                 82.0gr h20

    Yep, that's about what I was guessing. The 6.5x57 holds right at 5 more grains of water (not sure how that will translate to Propellant) than the .260 and 6 more than the Creedmore. The 10 grain difference in it and the 6.5x284 and 6.5-06 however doesn't quite add up to me though. I believe there's that much difference but it doesn't make sense that you can have 10 grains difference in capacity but very little difference in performance. When you compare an 8x57 and a 30-06 you have very little difference in performance. This comparison between the 6.5X57 and the 6.5-06  is the same thing, same cases, just different bullet diameter. The performance doesn't bare this  much difference in capacity between the 57mm case and the 63mm case out. There performance is closer than that.

    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
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