The truth about global warming

NomadacNomadac Senior MemberPosts: 890 Senior Member

The truth about global warming


Dr. Patrick Michaels, director of the Center for the Study of Science at the Cato Institute, provides insight into the debate over climate change and the political games played to create policy.



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Replies

  • CHIRO1989CHIRO1989 Senior Member Posts: 10,725 Senior Member
    Nice, it would be interesting to have this Dr. in a debate.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 9,458 Senior Member
    Most Scientists will say whatever the person handing over the grant money wants them to say
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • CHIRO1989CHIRO1989 Senior Member Posts: 10,725 Senior Member
    Not saying they are not correct, but who fact checks them?
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 3,252 Senior Member
    CHIRO1989 said:
    Not saying they are not correct, but who fact checks them?
    The fact checking fact checkers. Anything beyond that requires multiple mirrors held at precise angles so as to reflect the same image redundantly.
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 18,662 Senior Member
    This one sentence shows me that the "factcheck" has a left lean themselves
    While Cato does not deny that global warming is occurring and influenced by humans they also minimize the impact, which does not coincide with the consensus of science.
    Sorry, but I have yet to see this "consensus" ... for every report you find, from scientist, that agrees  with YOUR perspective, there's normally just as many that dispute it.

    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 3,252 Senior Member
    "Consensus of science," as a phrase can then be realistically classed with the phrase, "experts say."

    I can't imagine that anyone would disagree with that. It's use could be indicative of left leaning bias. It would be somewhat time consuming to confirm or disprove.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    (Forgive me Lord for I have sinned) I JUDGE ALL scientists, reporters on science, and polls by the same metric when it concerns some thing important that is subject to debate and fraudulent action. Is the data supporting the position given, ALL DATA, not just the cherry picked data to support the position? If not, the I consider the source to be a lying sack of dog excrement fit only for dawn target practice. 'A consensus of scientists say' is liar speak for a lie that will be told next. Same as 'the majority of Americans want' is politispeak for another gawdawful lie that follows that phrase. If I am denied the raw data that lead to the conclusion proffered, or how the polling was done, then I know that the person spouting the nonsense is all about pushing an agenda and trying to foist a fllthy dung covered lie on an unsuspecting populace.

    Dr. Patrick Michaels is a man cring out in the wilderness. He's speaking the truth and no one will listen because it does not fit the agenda being foisted on a public too lazy to seek out the truth.


    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 3,252 Senior Member
    I can't watch videos, but I did Google Dr Michaels. Very interesting. Wikipedia does offer some attempted discrediting in the form of association with big coal and petroleum. IMO those attempts don't completely hold water. It appears, unless Im mistaken that some of the association evolved after or post publication of initial research. Also the funding he recieved was for additional and not initial research, and the amount assuming honest transparency was not alarming or overly compensative. A lone voice in the wilderness could be a fair characterisation. It does however remain difficult for the layman to confirm.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 851 Senior Member
    I dont think you will find a single reasonable person out there that wont agree that "climate change" happens.  All you have to do is look at history that can be shown by science, that predates humans all the way through to modern times.  Through science it has been determined that there has been several major ice ages with minor ice ages between the major ones.  This is only possible if the Earth heats up and cools down.  I dont think many will deny that these events have happened.  I also do not think the humans have as big of an impact on the climate as the "climate change" scientists would like us to believe.  I wouldnt be surprised if one volcano having an eruption releases more greenhouse gases than all the people in the world do in a year.

    I also assume that most of these scientists and politicians. spouting off abut how we need to reduce emissions, have no issue with flying around in jets that spew all kinds of pollution into the air.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    edited March 11 #12
    Climate change is a constant, and has been since this rock cooled enough for liquid water to form. And it will be so until the ultimate 'climate change' happens when the Sun burns up all its hydrogen fuel in the fusion process, and expands as it turns into a red star, and it will expand as it starts the fusion process of Helium and any leftover Hydrogen into Lithium and Beryllium, and the expansion of the Sun eats Mercury, Venus, Earth, and possibly Mars before it collapses. And between now and then there is no guarantee that we won't heat up far higher than we are now, or cool off and all water on the Earth freezes and we become a big white marble with no life on the surface. No guarantees.
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,259 Senior Member
    And if the sun doesn't get us, the Yellowstone caldera just might pop its cork without any warning.  The poisonous gases that an eruption like that produces should take out just about everything north of Brazil, and bring on the next ice age from all the ash and smoke it creates blocking the sun for a few decades. 
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 10,051 Senior Member
    I believe in climate change, just don't know what, if anything, causes it.  Here in N GA, it's been the wettest and warmest winter I can remember.  In Chicago, they got a helluva snowfall.  It was 67 degrees here on the 10th of March.
    Not too many problems you can't fix
    With a 1911 and a 30-06
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 18,662 Senior Member
    Teach said:
    And if the sun doesn't get us, the Yellowstone caldera just might pop its cork without any warning.  The poisonous gases that an eruption like that produces should take out just about everything north of Brazil, and bring on the next ice age from all the ash and smoke it creates blocking the sun for a few decades. 
    Or another "killer" asteroid hits.
     Anything that has happened in before (super volcano, asteroid, magnetic field reversal etc et al), WILL happen again. It's not a question of IF, just WHEN.
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    Gene L said:
    I believe in climate change, just don't know what, if anything, causes it.  Here in N GA, it's been the wettest and warmest winter I can remember.  In Chicago, they got a helluva snowfall.  It was 67 degrees here on the 10th of March.
    This winter is a function of the El Nino and La Nina cycle in the Pacific ocean. They swap out every few years. BOTH mess with the jet stream, moving the dip either West and up, or East and down. We've been in the El Nino so long that when it swapped to the La Nina with the cooling of the Pacific Ocean surface temperature that everyone seems to have forgot the consequences of that. That's one reason why people are easy to fool on this global warming/cooling/climate change. The cycles of the Pacific ocean surface heating/cooling are long enough that most people for get what weather was like a few years before.
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,054 Senior Member
    When these fools start spouting "climate change" being caused by the internal combustion engine and cow farts, I have to laugh at their stupidity or outright ability to lie through their teeth. Sunspots, solar flares, volcanoes and other factors are involved. North America had an "Ice Age" about 115 thousand years ago, which was part of a larger glacial period from about 2.5 million years ago. There was a North American Inland sea running from Maine to Florida and west to West Texas and north to Manitoba Canada in the late Cretaceous period into the early Paleogene period that created two land masses in North America. This inland sea area in the west has been found to contain Dinosaur fossils from Texas to Manitoba. It is doubtful that dinosaurs could have existed in frigid climates that exist in some of those areas today. For me, this pretty much torpedoes the theory that I.C.E. greenhouse gases are solely responsible for "climate change."
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,586 Senior Member
    edited March 11 #18
    I have often thought about how much money I'm leaving on the table by not selling out my integrity and credibility. With the degrees and resume I have I could write a book right now that could make me millions and get me on every conservative news outlet almost constantly. I could market myself as the liberal scientist who saw the light and was converted against the hoax of climate change. It would then lead to a high six or even seven figure job in a think tank funded by the Kochs. I could then spend the next decade or two going on speaking tours and spinning out pseudo science questioning climate change while amassing millions in income.

    I could set up paid public debates with well known climate scientists. You all know already how skilled I am at driving those who's opinions are opposite of mine absolutely crazy. It would be great entertainment plus highly lucrative I'm sure. Maybe someday...
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    I have often thought about how much money I'm leaving on the table by not selling out my integrity and credibility. With the degrees and resume I have I could write a book right now that could make me millions and get me on every conservative news outlet almost constantly. I could market myself as the liberal scientist who saw the light and was converted against the hoax of climate change. It would then lead to a high six or even seven figure job in a think tank funded by the Kochs. I could then spend the next decade or two going on speaking tours and spinning out pseudo science questioning climate change while amassing millions in income.

    I could set up paid public debates with well known climate scientists. You all know already how skilled I am at driving those who's opinions are opposite of mine absolutely crazy. It would be great entertainment plus highly lucrative I'm sure. Maybe someday...
    Bolded statement. Who, pray tell, are these folk you are driving "absolutely crazy"? Certainly no one here of whom I'm aware. Sounds like someone is a legend in his own mind! :D :D :D :D :D You'd be just like Al Gore with that book, and would be found out as a charlatan pushing bogus pseudoscience just as he has been. The actual truth shoveled on top of your pseudoscience agenda would leave you as he is now, a rich man, but one whom is no longer relevant or listened to, except by the lower intelligence masses. Another Bill Nye 'The Science Guy' caricature.
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,586 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    I have often thought about how much money I'm leaving on the table by not selling out my integrity and credibility. With the degrees and resume I have I could write a book right now that could make me millions and get me on every conservative news outlet almost constantly. I could market myself as the liberal scientist who saw the light and was converted against the hoax of climate change. It would then lead to a high six or even seven figure job in a think tank funded by the Kochs. I could then spend the next decade or two going on speaking tours and spinning out pseudo science questioning climate change while amassing millions in income.

    I could set up paid public debates with well known climate scientists. You all know already how skilled I am at driving those who's opinions are opposite of mine absolutely crazy. It would be great entertainment plus highly lucrative I'm sure. Maybe someday...
    Bolded statement. Who, pray tell, are these folk you are driving "absolutely crazy"? Certainly no one here of whom I'm aware. Sounds like someone is a legend in his own mind! :D :D :D :D :D You'd be just like Al Gore with that book, and would be found out as a charlatan pushing bogus pseudoscience just as he has been. The actual truth shoveled on top of your pseudoscience agenda would leave you as he is now, a rich man, but one whom is no longer relevant or listened to, except by the lower intelligence masses. Another Bill Nye 'The Science Guy' caricature.
    Who is going to find me a fraud in a way that discredits me with the target audience? Faux News viewers will swallow anything that pushes their agenda. Attacks from legitimate climate scientists would only strengthen my appeal to those on the right. Climate denial is a lucrative business with a durable audience and market. Spreading doubt about complex science is easy. My past environmentalism only strengthens my case as someone who once was a true believer who has broken free from my liberal indoctrination to see and speak the truth. Ann Coulter will call me a "True American Hero". Donald Trump will invite me to speak at his re-election rallys.  
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 851 Senior Member
    As long as you are super serial about it, wear a cape, and exclaim "excelsior" every time you leave someplace, I will accept your claims for what they will be known to be.
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member Posts: 5,543 Senior Member
    I have often thought about how much money I'm leaving on the table by not selling out my integrity and credibility. With the degrees and resume I have I could write a book right now that could make me millions and get me on every conservative news outlet almost constantly. I could market myself as the liberal scientist who saw the light and was converted against the hoax of climate change. It would then lead to a high six or even seven figure job in a think tank funded by the Kochs. I could then spend the next decade or two going on speaking tours and spinning out pseudo science questioning climate change while amassing millions in income.

    I could set up paid public debates with well known climate scientists. You all know already how skilled I am at driving those who's opinions are opposite of mine absolutely crazy. It would be great entertainment plus highly lucrative I'm sure. Maybe someday...

    You could probably pull it off. You have the chart and graph thing down and if you sprinkle in a few 8x10 glossies with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one, you'll be on your way.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member

    You could probably pull it off. You have the chart and graph thing down and if you sprinkle in a few 8x10 glossies with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one, you'll be on your way.
    You dang near cost yourself a new keyboard for my computer. I read that while taking a swig of coffee. MOST EXCELLENT reference! :D :D :D :D :D
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,054 Senior Member

    Who is going to find me a fraud in a way that discredits me with the target audience? Faux News viewers will swallow anything that pushes their agenda. Attacks from legitimate climate scientists would only strengthen my appeal to those on the right. Climate denial is a lucrative business with a durable audience and market. Spreading doubt about complex science is easy. My past environmentalism only strengthens my case as someone who once was a true believer who has broken free from my liberal indoctrination to see and speak the truth. Ann Coulter will call me a "True American Hero". Donald Trump will invite me to speak at his re-election rallys.  
    I never thought there would be anyone else like Al Gore, but you take the blowhard award of the year! I, I, I, me, me, me, I,I,I..... Ego check at table 9 please. Driving us crazy? I doubt that, but you are the biggest burr in the saddle I ever saw.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    Speakin' of Al Gore, HE WAS NOT A TENNESSEAN. Born and educated in Washington, D.C., and only came to TN for summer vacations on the Gore farm/toxic waste dump. We don't claim him. He's about as popular in East TN as a raging case of syphilis; tis why he lives in Nashville.
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member Posts: 5,543 Senior Member
    tennmike said:

    You could probably pull it off. You have the chart and graph thing down and if you sprinkle in a few 8x10 glossies with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one, you'll be on your way.
    You dang near cost yourself a new keyboard for my computer. I read that while taking a swig of coffee. MOST EXCELLENT reference! :D :D :D :D :D

    Thank you, I wasn't sure if anyone would recognize it.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,054 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    Speakin' of Al Gore, HE WAS NOT A TENNESSEAN. Born and educated in Washington, D.C., and only came to TN for summer vacations on the Gore farm/toxic waste dump. We don't claim him. He's about as popular in East TN as a raging case of syphilis; tis why he lives in Nashville.
    In his energy-sucking 30,000 Sq. Ft. Mansion!! (just a guess)
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    tennmike said:
    Speakin' of Al Gore, HE WAS NOT A TENNESSEAN. Born and educated in Washington, D.C., and only came to TN for summer vacations on the Gore farm/toxic waste dump. We don't claim him. He's about as popular in East TN as a raging case of syphilis; tis why he lives in Nashville.
    In his energy-sucking 30,000 Sq. Ft. Mansion!! (just a guess)
    His natural gas bill is over $100,000 a year for that mansion. I'd guess his electricity bill is also enormous, too. But that fluffy turd tells everyone else to 'go green' and reduce their carbon footprint to save the planet. Freakin' hypocrite! And he travels by jet a lot to those 'save the planet' conferences. Typical Liberal Socialist that isn't concerned about anything but his bank account and spewing his 'Do as I say, not as I do' message to the mouth breathing masses.
    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,586 Senior Member
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 25,768 Senior Member
    edited March 12 #30
    Kasich is a RINO, or as I like to call RINOs, Republicrats; they say one thing and do the other. Liars are liars, and he's a Republican like a cesspool is a fast food restaurant.

    Anyway, from the article.

    cap and trade
    This is the Democratic Socialist Al Gore's idea. It taxes energy production and uses the money for everything BUT reducing carbon emissions. Like lining the pockets of politicians and cap and trade folk with the proceeds.

     Today, California and some of Canada’s provinces have agreed to apply
     a  cooperative cap and trade approach to controlling greenhouse gasses.
    California's economy should really be held up as a model for this. They're trying to match the National Debt with their unfunded mandates. Cap and trade is nothing but 'a redistribution of wealth' of which Socialist scum are so fond. It's a TAX paid for ultimately by the consumer.

    We also need to continue research supporting Corporate Average Fuel Economy standards,
     the automotive fuel-efficiency requirements that have significantly reduced greenhouse
     gas pollution in recent years. We should not eliminate or weaken these mandates.
     CAFE requirements need to stay.Get India and China to reduce emissions Get India
     and China to reduce emissions.
    I don't think I'll be taking advice from a politician that has little to no understanding of the internal combustion engine, and the finite quantity of BTUs in a gallon/liter of gasoline or diesel fuel. Until perpetual motion is perfected, he's just an idiot speaking of things for which he has zero understanding.

    It’s also important to continue  subsidies for electric vehicles.
    Yes, please! Tax me some more to subsidize electric vehicles I can't afford so the rich and famous can buy them, get a tax credit or whatever, and use coal fired electricity to charge their batteries, and feel all environmentally conscious for doing so. What a crock of dung!
    He did give lip service to nuclear power. But again, he's so far out of the loop that it isn't even funny. The small package 500 megawatt reactors that fit on roughly a city block site have been available for 30 freakin' years. No power company can afford to build them due to the absolute hatred of nuclear power and never ending lawsuits by the NIMBYs, Greenies, and mouth breathers that scream Chernobyl! and Three Mile Island! until they cough up a lung. More smoke and mirrors from the Republicrat Kasich. Ignorance can be cured, but STUPID is an incurable curse.


    Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.


  • Billy_BuddBilly_Budd Posts: 572 Senior Member
    edited March 13 #31
    tennmike said:
    I have often thought about how much money I'm leaving on the table by not selling out my integrity and credibility. With the degrees and resume I have I could write a book right now that could make me millions and get me on every conservative news outlet almost constantly. I could market myself as the liberal scientist who saw the light and was converted against the hoax of climate change. It would then lead to a high six or even seven figure job in a think tank funded by the Kochs. I could then spend the next decade or two going on speaking tours and spinning out pseudo science questioning climate change while amassing millions in income.

    I could set up paid public debates with well known climate scientists. You all know already how skilled I am at driving those who's opinions are opposite of mine absolutely crazy. It would be great entertainment plus highly lucrative I'm sure. Maybe someday...
    Bolded statement. Who, pray tell, are these folk you are driving "absolutely crazy"? Certainly no one here of whom I'm aware. Sounds like someone is a legend in his own mind! :D :D :D :D :D You'd be just like Al Gore with that book, and would be found out as a charlatan pushing bogus pseudoscience just as he has been. The actual truth shoveled on top of your pseudoscience agenda would leave you as he is now, a rich man, but one whom is no longer relevant or listened to, except by the lower intelligence masses. Another Bill Nye 'The Science Guy' caricature.
    Who is going to find me a fraud in a way that discredits me with the target audience? Faux News viewers will swallow anything that pushes their agenda. Attacks from legitimate climate scientists would only strengthen my appeal to those on the right. Climate denial is a lucrative business with a durable audience and market. Spreading doubt about complex science is easy. My past environmentalism only strengthens my case as someone who once was a true believer who has broken free from my liberal indoctrination to see and speak the truth. Ann Coulter will call me a "True American Hero". Donald Trump will invite me to speak at his re-election rallys.  



    Listen up, youngster. You're about to get schooled. 

    We, adults, have been hearing about this b.s. since the 60s. First, it was the 'Coming Ice Age.' Then, in the 70s, it was called the 'Greenhouse Effect.' Once it was discovered that the supposed "Hole" in the ozone was completely fabricated it was then changed to Global Warming. Once it was discovered that the ice sheets around Antarctica were actually increasing in ice volume it was then changed to 'Climate Change' to accommodate any difference in weather patterns. Furthermore, ice core samples taken in Greenland, at a depth of 300' were nationally reported that scientists now had the means to look back in time to over 50,000 years! One little problem. Just 20 miles from where these supposed ice core samples were taken, the frozen corpse of 'Glacier Girl' was found at a depth of nearly 300' as well. And no, Alpha, you're not going to find 'Glacier Girl' in the latest peer-reviewed journals of anthropolgy. "Why," you ask?  Because Glacier Girl wasn't a corpse, at least in the human sense. Nope! Glacier Girl was, in fact, the remains of a P-38L Lightning that was left abandoned, along with several other aircraft, on a Greenland glacier in 1942. Not only did it become buried in nearly 300' of ice but it had drifted over a mile from its original location, which leads us into another b.s claim that glaciers take hundreds of years to migrate. Last but not least. I have lived in Nome, Alaska since 1958. The tidal markers, save for a storm here and there, are at PRECISELY the same location as they were when miners first arrived here in the early 1900s.     
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