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.44 Spl - Should I?

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  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Between Ft Lauderdale and MiamiPosts: 12,556 Senior Member
    Should you?  Why YES you should.
    Why?  Because you have a want/desire. Backed up by a need for the wife.
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Global NomadPosts: 6,071 Senior Member
    I'm .44 Special curious myself. Make mine a GP-100, though.
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Western IdahoPosts: 2,460 Senior Member
    Had the Charter Arms. Good gun. I had to buy 3 boxes of ammo and force myself to shoot it as the recoil is....lively to say the least due to the 21 ounces weight. 

    Loaded with hollowpoints, I would NOT feel under-gunned at all with a 44 special.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • bobbyrlf3bobbyrlf3 Senior Member Renton, WashingtonPosts: 2,598 Senior Member
    Have you had a look at the GP100?
    Knowledge is essential to living freely and fully; understanding gives knowledge purpose and strength; wisdom is combining the two and applying them appropriately in words and actions.
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Miami, FL almost in the USA ;)Posts: 6,992 Senior Member
    I've got a Smith 638 and a Charter Arms bulldog and the .44special Bulldog weights 6.4 oz more than the j frame. If I recall, you're a fairly big guy, 6'3" or so. That extra 6.4oz actually affects you?
    Not the weight, the size.  I like to pocket carry, so even if I am 6'3", my pockets are about the same size as everyone else.  That being said, my favorite pocket carry is the 431 pd, a .32 H&R mag round in a J frame with an exposed hammer, and 6 rounds.   Not as powerful as a .32 Federal Mag, but more than .38 special. 
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member crusted in sandPosts: 5,797 Senior Member
    BigDanS said:
    I've got a Smith 638 and a Charter Arms bulldog and the .44special Bulldog weights 6.4 oz more than the j frame. If I recall, you're a fairly big guy, 6'3" or so. That extra 6.4oz actually affects you?
    Not the weight, the size.  I like to pocket carry, so even if I am 6'3", my pockets are about the same size as everyone else.  That being said, my favorite pocket carry is the 431 pd, a .32 H&R mag round in a J frame with an exposed hammer, and 6 rounds.   Not as powerful as a .32 Federal Mag, but more than .38 special. 

    I don't even like to pocket carry my LCP without the techna clip. Everything goes in a holster and my bulldog hides just as well as my 638.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Merrritt Island, FLPosts: 25,219 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    I bet. My wife has a .357 Mag Pug. Its "OK" with .38 spcl, but downright unpleasant to shoot with mags.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 28,061 Senior Member
    I still want one. Just may not be the right choice right now. 

    I will have a .44 spl. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    I still want one. Just may not be the right choice right now. 

    I will have a .44 spl. 
    I say get one, in spite of the abuse you'll suffer. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    I bet. My wife has a .357 Mag Pug. Its "OK" with .38 spcl, but downright unpleasant to shoot with mags.
    Indeed.  Though, I do partly blame the grip design. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Merrritt Island, FLPosts: 25,219 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    I bet. My wife has a .357 Mag Pug. Its "OK" with .38 spcl, but downright unpleasant to shoot with mags.
    Indeed.  Though, I do partly blame the grip design. 
    How would you improve them? Their soft rubber design seems to me to be about the best you could hope for. I always figured it was because its a lightweight snubby.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 28,061 Senior Member
    This one is growing on me. 



    But with these grips. 



    Probably not very practical compared to a stainless with shrouded hammer. But, I doubt it will be carried much. More a house gun. . But, I like the classic design and the smaller grips will fit the bride better. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 7,928 Senior Member
    edited July 2019 #45
    I like the way the crane locks up. I don't like the exposed ejector rod. In use it might be a plus, but Ive never used one. Looks a bit short too. The bolt stop notches appear to be offset for strength and the gun looks diminutive enough to benifit well from the cartidge.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    I bet. My wife has a .357 Mag Pug. Its "OK" with .38 spcl, but downright unpleasant to shoot with mags.
    Indeed.  Though, I do partly blame the grip design. 
    How would you improve them? Their soft rubber design seems to me to be about the best you could hope for. I always figured it was because its a lightweight snubby.
    Some grip designs allow for a higher grip and that's helpful for me.  Soft rubber or hard G10 or wood doesn't make any difference to me.  Grip geometry is a better recoil management tool than material anyways. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 9,696 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    At the above numbers, the Special might be a tad stout for the bride. She is used to .38 Spl revolver and 9mm auto. 

    Not to derail a good train of thought, but Ruger and Smith have both dabbled with the concept of longer, heavier barrels and adjustable sights on their compact, steel frame .357 SP-101's and M60's.  3", 4" and even 5" have all been options at one time or another.  Solves the small hand issues, solves the recoil issues, solves the loss of steam out of a snub barrel issues.  Doesn't solve the Zee-lusts-for-a-.44-Special issues, but this is the WIFE'S gun we're talking about.

    Probably not a lot of functional difference between a dialed back .44 and a hopped up .38.  Knocks us back to our recent 9mm vs. everything else discussions, but I think for this particular application, the .38/.357 platform makes more sense.  If you're trying to get and keep her coming to the range, .38 wadcutters are an economical and highly addictive gateway drug. :p
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Living in a van, down by the river.Posts: 14,034 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    I bet. My wife has a .357 Mag Pug. Its "OK" with .38 spcl, but downright unpleasant to shoot with mags.
    Indeed.  Though, I do partly blame the grip design. 
    How would you improve them? Their soft rubber design seems to me to be about the best you could hope for. I always figured it was because its a lightweight snubby.
    Some grip designs allow for a higher grip and that's helpful for me.  Soft rubber or hard G10 or wood doesn't make any difference to me.  Grip geometry is a better recoil management tool than material anyways. 
    Very true, here. Also, some squishy grips just allow the gun to get a good running start before they hit your hand. 
    I'm just here for snark.
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member crusted in sandPosts: 5,797 Senior Member
    Mine is a stainless, 2.5" bbl, DAO, with a shrouded ejection rod and a soft rubber grip and I don't find the recoil that bad. I'm not a fan of recoil and I can run a box of ammo through it without a problem. With my 638, I can do about three cylinders and with my super blackhawk, I'm good for about two cylinders worth. I carry the Hornady 185gr XTP rounds in it and I practice with a 200gr cast load of mine that duplicates the recoil and even hits to the same POA as the Hornady loads.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    I have a late 80s Charter Arms Bulldog 44spl. It kicks--bad. 
    I bet. My wife has a .357 Mag Pug. Its "OK" with .38 spcl, but downright unpleasant to shoot with mags.
    Indeed.  Though, I do partly blame the grip design. 
    How would you improve them? Their soft rubber design seems to me to be about the best you could hope for. I always figured it was because its a lightweight snubby.
    Just one example, but the back strap lines of the wood grips prevent somewhat the rotation of the gun back, while the Charter Arms grips have a shape conducive to rotating more in your hand. The horizontal line represent the thumb line.




    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 28,061 Senior Member
    One thing I noticed, watching a Hickock45 video, is that he complained about the recoil of the Bulldog Classic. Even after a few rounds. 

    Now, I don’t  really like him. Think he’s a bad example of correct shooting and a perfect example of everything not to do. 

    But, it was a review and I watched it. Don’t know my point. Other than surprised/confused at his pain subsequent to the recoil. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • bullsi1911bullsi1911 Moderator Posts: 12,309 Senior Member
    If you get near south Austin, We can hit the range and you can shoot my Stainless Bulldog


    To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
    -Mikhail Kalashnikov
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Merrritt Island, FLPosts: 25,219 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:Just one example, but the back strap lines of the wood grips prevent somewhat the rotation of the gun back, while the Charter Arms grips have a shape conducive to rotating more in your hand. The horizontal line represent the thumb line.

    I see exactly what you're talking about. I've been bitching about revolvers for years about precisely that - with the exception of the Rhino, they haven't been updated in over 100 years. With that said, I'm not sure whether they need to be or not, based on my learning to ride the recoil upwards - I'm now thinking revolvers were intentionally designed that way. Which probably doesn't work for everyone per bullsi1911's comments in the pistol training thread. Certainly, more practice, experimentation, and learning is needed on my part!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:Just one example, but the back strap lines of the wood grips prevent somewhat the rotation of the gun back, while the Charter Arms grips have a shape conducive to rotating more in your hand. The horizontal line represent the thumb line.

    I see exactly what you're talking about. I've been bitching about revolvers for years about precisely that - with the exception of the Rhino, they haven't been updated in over 100 years. With that said, I'm not sure whether they need to be or not, based on my learning to ride the recoil upwards - I'm now thinking revolvers were intentionally designed that way. Which probably doesn't work for everyone per bullsi1911's comments in the pistol training thread. Certainly, more practice, experimentation, and learning is needed on my part!
    Well, recoil is as recoil does. Letting the gun free recoil makes for very slow follow ups. 

    Make that gun your bitch. It's all on the shooter to provide the platform and mechanics to make the gun shoot as many times as you require it to.  

    Being consciously dominant over the weapon in a deliberate and consistent manner is important beyond what the recoil is trying to do.

    Shoot a 44spl under pressure and that gun won't free recoil 3 inches up off target at all.  
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    One thing I noticed, watching a Hickock45 video, is that he complained about the recoil of the Bulldog Classic. Even after a few rounds. 

    Now, I don’t  really like him. Think he’s a bad example of correct shooting and a perfect example of everything not to do. 

    But, it was a review and I watched it. Don’t know my point. Other than surprised/confused at his pain subsequent to the recoil. 
    I think some manufacturers discount the free recoil impulse of "special" versions opposite their "magnum" cousins. As a result guns that probably shouldn't be very small are very small. Tiny 5 shot J frame 357 Magnums come to mind. They are a downright cruel experience. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Merrritt Island, FLPosts: 25,219 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:
    Well, recoil is as recoil does. Letting the gun free recoil makes for very slow follow ups.
    No question.

    At this particular point in my development, fighting the recoil was making me highly inaccurate. That will probably change in time!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:
    Well, recoil is as recoil does. Letting the gun free recoil makes for very slow follow ups.
    No question.

    At this particular point in my development, fighting the recoil was making me highly inaccurate. That will probably change in time!
    I should clarify. Fighting the recoil is not the objective.  In fact it's impossible.  Its affect can be mitigated,  but not stopped. 

    Proper recoil correction such as pushing the front sight back down  after recoil, or keeping the wrist very tight to aid in that effort are the objectives.

    Your job is basically to press the trigger and react to the recoil after it happens, not before. 

    If you aren't already, times drills get the stress up a little and especially if someone has a shot timer. Focusing on the task and not the gun help unlearn recoil reactions that are undesirable. 
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Merrritt Island, FLPosts: 25,219 Senior Member
    JasonMPD said:I should clarify. Fighting the recoil is not the objective.  In fact it's impossible.  Its affect can be mitigated,  but not stopped. 

    This is "where I am" right now, just figured this out.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
    )O(
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,583 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    JasonMPD said:I should clarify. Fighting the recoil is not the objective.  In fact it's impossible.  Its affect can be mitigated,  but not stopped. 

    This is "where I am" right now, just figured this out.
    If you really want to get nerdy about it, understanding that physically (as in, the science of) recoil impulse is not rotational.  Rotation is caused by wrist and elbow mechanics in pistols and hip and spine mechanics in rifles (when standing).

    If you focus on what part of your body causes the undesirable muzzle movement under recoil you can work on mitigating it. 

    Some plain words of wisdom I was told a few years ago...

    "Stop letting that gun jerk you around."

    "Will do, I'm trying to stop the recoil."

    "I didn't say stop the recoil, I said stop letting the gun jerk you around."


    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,750 Senior Member
    I'm a recoil wimp. No way would I shoot a lightweight Charter Arms light weight .44 special.  I shoot .44 special in my Ruger Redhawk, and they're gentle in this heavy revolver.  A .357 in a light-weight J-frame s&w revolver is way too much for me.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 28,061 Senior Member
    edited July 2019 #61
    Ok, so understanding that the .44 Spl in a lightweight revolver might be a bit much for the bride. 

    If we look at it for just me, do you guys think I should go with the blued 3” Classic or the 2.5” stainless?

    Utilitarian or Nostalgic?
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
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