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The new mid engine Corvette.

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  • N454casullN454casull Member Posts: 567 Senior Member
    It has a dual clutch and paddle shifters. Which allows you to shift in a fraction of the time an old school manual stick does. You can even pull both paddles back at the same time and effectively put the transmission in neutral. If your about old school then get a stick if your about actual performance the dual clutch paddle shifters are the ticket. 
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,445 Senior Member
    It has an overly complicated and costly to repair transmission that is controlled by a computer.  Pass on that one.  Just ask Ford how its going with the DCT they have/had been using.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    mitdr774 said:
    It has an overly complicated and costly to repair transmission that is controlled by a computer.  Pass on that one.  Just ask Ford how its going with the DCT they have/had been using.
    And its *still* boring...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,167 Senior Member
    Congratulations Chevrolet... you made a Lotus.



    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    At least the electrical system should be better... ;)
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • AccipiterAccipiter New Member Posts: 885 Senior Member
    jbp-ohio said:
    Congratulations Chevrolet... you made a Lotus.



    Didn’t one of the old Lingenfelter Vettes use a Lotus engine?  So what is old is now new.
    Apparently free thought is punished, and conformity is required, while peckerless cowards run the show.

    ECHO...ECHO....echo...

    Ah......One savors the hypocrisy!

    Karma.........It’s a bitch.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    YAUDSSD
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,445 Senior Member
    The LT-5 engine was a Lotus design at GM request that was built by Mercury Marine.
  • AccipiterAccipiter New Member Posts: 885 Senior Member
    Thanks.  I knew Lotus had something to do with the Lingenfelter.
    Apparently free thought is punished, and conformity is required, while peckerless cowards run the show.

    ECHO...ECHO....echo...

    Ah......One savors the hypocrisy!

    Karma.........It’s a bitch.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,445 Senior Member
    It was a GM engine and vehicle package from the factory.  1990-1995 Corvette ZR-1.  DOHC 5.7L V8.  1990 had 375HP and 1995 was up to 425 HP.  Mercury Marine built them in a Mercruiser plant in Oaklahoma (if memory is correct) and then sent them to Bowling Green.  
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    The c3 is the only Corvette I'd consider owning.
    Yep. If it were "my kind of car", the C3 is what I'd want. Has all the curves in all the right places for this type of automobile.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,167 Senior Member
    There were a lot of restomod Vettes at th the televised auctions this year. They were cool..... not the $150,000 they were bringing cool........

    A 1964-67 Coupe with a LS7 and a six speed and C7 suspension would be a blast to drive
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 2,222 Senior Member
    I am not much of a Chevy guy, but credit where credit is due. Trying finding anything as fast as the new C8 (mid engine and all) will be and I'll bet you're looking at a minimum of three times what you'll pay for the Corvette. Just not in love with the looks.

    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    knitepoet said:
    Pass
    There is no manual transmission—not even as an option...

    Ick. Just Ick. What is the point of a "sports car" without a manual? Might as well drive a minivan. And don't get me started on not one, but TWO screens (that I can see, maybe more?) in the car, and 50 million buttons on the steering wheel. More expensive, unnecessary, and unreliable "technology" to break...

    I don't have a problem with it being mid-engined, there's a lot of good reasons for going with that layout. But the effete North American automobile market has killed the stick shift!
    Not me dude. I love a good automatic trans. I had a '57 4 door hard top and I put a 350 bored .030 and a Turbohydramatic 400 in it. Of course the Turbo 400 was pre overdrive so it was a gas hog but it had a B&M Shift Kit and you knew when it shifted either up or down. It also had a 2000 RPM Stall converter that I liked. It allowed you to get into the torque  band before coming off the line. It was nothing radical, just a little boost. That trans allowed for a stock four point mount. The bell housing had been milled off and a custom unit that bolted onto the front pump bolts. That saved a lot of fabricating for a three point mount. Some people used the stock '57 front engine mounts together with the transmission tail shaft mount. That was a long stretch between mounts and the engine torque would twist the engine over too far, because the two front mounts were so close together and the tail shaft mount was a one point deal so nothing there to counter the torque. With the after market bell housing the mounts were on each side of the bell housing. This prevented the engine from torquing over and breaking the mounting bolts. Anyway, it worked like a stock .57.
    .
    zorba said:
    knitepoet said:
    Pass
    There is no manual transmission—not even as an option...

    Ick. Just Ick. What is the point of a "sports car" without a manual? Might as well drive a minivan. And don't get me started on not one, but TWO screens (that I can see, maybe more?) in the car, and 50 million buttons on the steering wheel. More expensive, unnecessary, and unreliable "technology" to break...

    I don't have a problem with it being mid-engined, there's a lot of good reasons for going with that layout. But the effete North American automobile market has killed the stick shift!
    Without a manual transmission, it's worthless as a sports car.  Those automatics are not going to downshift properly for tight curves...
    Not with modern transmissions. Remember, they're controlled by the computer which senses a need for downshift. Even if that wasn't the case you still have manual control of low and a couple of drives.
    I always loved the old 4 speed hydro's they put in Pontiacs, Oldsmobiles, and Cadillac's from the 40s until 1964. GM brought out the Turbo Hydros in '65. But the Turbo 400 wasn't any better than the old Dual Coupling 4 speed Hydramatic. It was just lighter and cheaper to make. with the old 4 speed Hydro had a different position for each of the four gears if you wanted to shift. manually.
    Also, my mother's 2013 Impala had a 6 speed in it and if you wanted you had manual control of everything. And these late model autos shift fast too. You're not going to beat them with a manual shift.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    edited July 2019 #46
    Yes, yes, yes, yes. And its STILL all boring, and not nearly as much fun to drive. And STILL more expensive to acquire and maintain - and more to go wrong and break.

    But Americans don't care - sometimes I feel like I'm the only one on the planet who gives a damn about cost and reliability. Maybe I am...
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,445 Senior Member
    My truck has an 8 speed in it.  I can assure you that GM does not know how to program the shift control properly.  It is constantly changing gears and quite often in a lower gear than needed.  Unless you need to accelerate and then its probably in a higher gear than it should be and wont downshift.  The "manual" control mode has always been crap since they switched to electronic valve bodies.  With the old mechanical automatics you actually controled the valve body when manually shifting.  Now you tell the computer what you want and it may or may not allow it.  This will be no different.
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 2,222 Senior Member
    Tugar said:
    I am not much of a Chevy guy, but credit where credit is due. Trying finding anything as fast as the new C8 (mid engine and all) will be and I'll bet you're looking at a minimum of three times what you'll pay for the Corvette. Just not in love with the looks.

    Except for a Tesla. The model 3 performance is in the same price/performance bracket. 3.2 second zero to 60, but it doesn't look like an exotic sports car.
    Except it's NOT a mid-engine sport car and the range is limited.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,973 Senior Member
    As to manual vs. automatic, I loved the manual trans in my FWD sport-ish cars, but when the HP and torque get to the point of spinning tires at every shift point, I think I like traction control.  

    D
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • GilaGila Posts: 1,828 Senior Member
    BigDanS said:
    As to manual vs. automatic, I loved the manual trans in my FWD sport-ish cars, but when the HP and torque get to the point of spinning tires at every shift point, I think I like traction control.  

    D
    Traction control would be using drag radials with a manual transmission.
    No good deed goes unpunished...
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    That brings up another point: Passenger cars are all way over powered these days.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 5,811 Senior Member
    Just saw an episode of those British guys that play with all sorts of cars (can't remember the name) and they were racing American Muscle cars agains each other.  The one guys kept taking his car to Manual mode thinking he would do better than the computer in the car and he went decidedly backwards on EVERY trip down the 1/4 mile.

    I don't quite understand though why many thinks you loose control with the automatic transmission in this car.  You have paddle shifters and complete control of the gears if so inclined, just no clutch.  This is what's in use in Formula 1 cars worldwide nowadays exclusively.  Pretty sure those guys are using EVERY advantage available to hem.  Am I missing something?
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    edited July 2019 #53
    For me, its all about the interaction with the machinery - an automatic takes part of that away. With that said, I do manual shifting on automatics, esp. downshifting to help slow down and as speed regulation on hills.
    I drove a new Ford truck with an automatic - 8 speed I think. No question, it was a thing of beauty and the driver could have full control over it. I still want a stick - I want the fun and interaction - and the lower purchase price and better reliability.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 5,811 Senior Member
    GunNut said:
     Am I missing something?
    You sound like you shoot firearms made of something other than walnut and cold blue steel. Maybe even some made of aluminum and or plastic! Unacceptable.  
    Even if you love Filet Mignon and can afford it every day, if you eat enough of it you'll grow sick of it.  It's Ok to have MacDonalds every once in a while.  Actually its rather enjoyable.
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 5,811 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    For me, its all about the interaction with the machinery - an automatic takes part of that away. With that said, I do manual shifting on automatics, esp. downshifting to help slow down and as speed regulation on hills.
    I drove a new Ford truck with an automatic - 8 speed I think. No question, it was a thing of beauty and the driver could have full control over it. I still want a stick - I want the fun and interaction - and the lower purchase price and better reliability.
    I ABSOLUTELY understand but we must not confuse nostalgia and fun with true performance.  There is not ONE professional driver out there on a track with a clutch/manual transmission in their car.
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,667 Senior Member
    No argument - but then again, I don't drive on a race track.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • AccipiterAccipiter New Member Posts: 885 Senior Member
    GunNut said:
    zorba said:
    For me, its all about the interaction with the machinery - an automatic takes part of that away. With that said, I do manual shifting on automatics, esp. downshifting to help slow down and as speed regulation on hills.
    I drove a new Ford truck with an automatic - 8 speed I think. No question, it was a thing of beauty and the driver could have full control over it. I still want a stick - I want the fun and interaction - and the lower purchase price and better reliability.
    I ABSOLUTELY understand but we must not confuse nostalgia and fun with true performance.  There is not ONE professional driver out there on a track with a clutch/manual transmission in their car.
    I think NASCAR still uses manual transmissions.
    Apparently free thought is punished, and conformity is required, while peckerless cowards run the show.

    ECHO...ECHO....echo...

    Ah......One savors the hypocrisy!

    Karma.........It’s a bitch.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 5,811 Senior Member
    Accipiter said:
    GunNut said:
    zorba said:
    For me, its all about the interaction with the machinery - an automatic takes part of that away. With that said, I do manual shifting on automatics, esp. downshifting to help slow down and as speed regulation on hills.
    I drove a new Ford truck with an automatic - 8 speed I think. No question, it was a thing of beauty and the driver could have full control over it. I still want a stick - I want the fun and interaction - and the lower purchase price and better reliability.
    I ABSOLUTELY understand but we must not confuse nostalgia and fun with true performance.  There is not ONE professional driver out there on a track with a clutch/manual transmission in their car.
    I think NASCAR still uses manual transmissions.
    Ahhhhh a very interesting point, and I truly appreciate you catching that.  I should have been very specific that I was talking F1 racing which is where a lot of our car technology gets proven before it gets into normal people vehicles.  Things like Audi's Quattro all wheel drive were born out of F1 Racing.

    NASCAR has gone out of their way to stay well behind the times in car/racing technology.  They only abandoned carburetors for the 2012 season.  Well after just about every one had electronic injection engines.  They intentionally limit the use of technology to even out the field because in theory that makes the driver the star of the show.  Their transmissions could just as easily be paddle shifters since you do not need to use the clutch to shift as explained below.

    How Many Gears Does A Nascar Car Have?

    There are only four gears in a NASCAR car, but that is a very important distinction because they do not use synchros in these cars. You can change gear any time you want as long as you match the road speed. If you consider that, you will realize that the drivers have to have an incredible feel for the car. You cannot drive on this level and not understand the feeling the car gives you when you are ready to change gear, and it shows you that they are not always driving with the throttle wide open.

    What Kind Of Transmission Does Nascar Use?
    The transmission in a NASCAR car is a four speed manual. However, as mentioned above, you do not have to use a clutch. There is no need for the drivers to do the regular gear changes in your road car. You will change the gears when you have the road speed matched. That means that the drivers have to drive on feel alone. They do not even get to have that gauge in the car. They have do that all based on the sound and feel of the car.

    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 5,811 Senior Member
    zorba said:
    No argument - but then again, I don't drive on a race track.
    Great point.
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,445 Senior Member
    I can run my car all the way up and down the gears without using the clutch if I want.   It's just an economy car. 

    Huge difference between F1 and the stupidity with what the GM programmers put in the transmission controls. 

    I have helped rebuild far more automatic transmissions than I have manual transmissions.   In fact the only manual trans I have I have helped pull apart and rebuild is from the real #88 high speed test car.  That was only to make sure it was still good.
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,128 Senior Member
    I barely ever use the clutch with manual transmissions. I must be a NASCAR driver.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
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