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Weird firearm idea

JustsomedudeJustsomedude Posts: 430 Member
I have a weird idea that I have no idea if its been done before. I see the utility in AR pistols but loathe the hell out of the ugly, clunky buffer tube poking out the rear, even with the arm brace. Just doesn't feel like an actual pistol to me. Anyhow, I got to thinking about taking an AR, removing the gas system, buffer tube, recoil spring, hand guard and cutting the bbl down fairly short and then milling a slot on the left side of the upper alongside the bolt carrier (which will also be shortened) and adding a bolt handle to the BCG. Id likely make a nice looking plug for the rear threaded portion of the lower where the buffer tube went, for aesthetics. Bolt action AR pistol. It would be light, short, compact and most of all, different. Any ideas, comments, criticism?

Replies

  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,763 Senior Member
    Bolt action AR recievers have been out there for some tome



    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • JustsomedudeJustsomedude Posts: 430 Member
    Damn, learn something new everyday. I never new that. I guess that shows how popular of an idea that is 😆. Can't believe the price tag on that one pasted above. They must be proud of that thing. I think im still gonna make one for myself just because I have the parts laying around to do it.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,426 Senior Member
    Manually operated ARs have been in use in other parts of the world for decades.  The UK would be a good place to start looking at what does and doesnt work.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 5,286 Senior Member
    Remind me of this topic next time we talk... 🤣
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,152 Senior Member
    edited May 25 #7
    The main stumbling block will tend to be primary extraction without the gas pressure providing the leverage to unlock the action on a sticky case.

    Also remember that your bolt carrier will have to go someplace when you open the action, so you'd need to cut the tail end of that off if you want to plug the receiver.

    I'm kinda envisioning using an extended cam pin as your bolt handle, but putting it together in the receiver and keeping it together then become some of the engineering problems.  Additionally, you don't have the traditional bolt action's striker spring providing tension to keep the action closed.  Safety would not be a problem as the AR is really well designed to not allow firing when out of battery, but for reliability, you'll need something to keep that bolt handle from flopping out of the locked position.  Some kind of spring detent on the bolt handle (much like an AR's takedown pins or selector) comes to mind, but where does one put it?
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • JustsomedudeJustsomedude Posts: 430 Member
    Bigslug said:
    The main stumbling block will tend to be primary extraction without the gas pressure providing the leverage to unlock the action on a sticky case.

    Also remember that your bolt carrier will have to go someplace when you open the action, so you'd need to cut the tail end of that off if you want to plug the receiver.

    I'm kinda envisioning using an extended cam pin as your bolt handle, but putting it together in the receiver and keeping it together then become some of the engineering problems.  Additionally, you don't have the traditional bolt action's striker spring providing tension to keep the action closed.  Safety would not be a problem as the AR is really well designed to not allow firing when out of battery, but for reliability, you'll need something to keep that bolt handle from flopping out of the locked position.  Some kind of spring detent on the bolt handle (much like an AR's takedown pins or selector) comes to mind, but where does one put it?
    I'll try and touch on these points, as you made some good ones.
    I dont underestimate the difficulty in extracting a "sticky" case, but see it as the exception rather than the rule. 
    I'm planning on cutting the bcg just enough for full length extraction to stay within the length of the upper, so I'm hoping that won't be a problem. 
    I'll likely drill and thread my bolt handle directly into the bcg since I have carbide tipped drills and some taps to do so, but you make a good point about a detent system. I think that would be pretty simple to incorporate a ball detent in my handle that has a closed placement in the slot of the upper. (Thank you for this idea btw).
    I have a mountain of work at the moment but I'm sure I could probably knock something like this out pretty quickly. When I start, I'll post updates.
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,152 Senior Member
    Couple of further thoughts - these will require you looking into exactly where everything sits and what else your additions might run into.

    Since it looks like you're thinking about a straight-pull system where all your bolt handle does is provide something to grab onto. . .

    You MIGHT be able to replace the carrier's gas key with some kind of plate that rides in the track normally occupied by the original charging handle.  You could then drill a hole in the left side of that to install your new bolt handle into - provided that you don't have to destroy your M4 M1913 scope rail in making room for the slot it will need to ride in.  That would allow you to make the whole BCG shorter in length, as the only other place I see to attach it would require leaving some of the BCG's tail intact on the left side - remembering that you still need a clear path for the hammer to swing in.

    If the above works dimensionally, I would suggest using a spring detent system to retain your bolt handle in the BCG, like that of a Benelli or Remington 1100 shotgun, rather than thread it in -because (a) it will tend to unthread itself when working the bolt and (b), you'll need to be able to take that handle out to tear down your upper.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,426 Senior Member
  • JustsomedudeJustsomedude Posts: 430 Member
    mitdr774 said:

    Thats definitely a thought. Never knew that existed since I apparently live under a rock lol. But I guess that's what happens when AR platforms really aren't my bag.
  • mitdr774mitdr774 Member Posts: 1,426 Senior Member
    Most optins you can find over here came from the UK.  Cant own a semi auto AR there, but if its converted to be a bolt action its perfectly fine.
  • ilove22silove22s Senior Member Posts: 1,357 Senior Member
    Damn, learn something new everyday. I never new that. I guess that shows how popular of an idea that is 😆. Can't believe the price tag on that one pasted above. They must be proud of that thing. I think im still gonna make one for myself just because I have the parts laying around to do it.

    you need to get out more..... B)
    The ears never lie.

    - Don Burt
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 7,749 Senior Member
    About 20 years ago, I got this crazy notion to neck a .284 Winchester to .338.  It would be my version of a short action 338-06.  I visited a gunsmith, convinced he would have to do some fancy figuring on how to do it, and we would have to discuss it in some detail.

    I was wrong.  He just pulled out manual, flipped it open to a page that had all the specs, and I realized that my idea was far from original.

    I now wonder if there's really anything new when it comes to firearms.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,152 Senior Member
    mitdr774 said:

    Proving that involving government regulation is akin to using steel tools to make a stone knife. (can we get our head-bang/brick-wall emoji back in the menu please?)
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
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