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I need some learnin.

I've stated before that I wasn't the greatest student in civics class, not to mention how dang long ago that was. I watched the POTUS speech earlier and never heard of the insurrection act. I'm just curious what it entails besides the military putting a stop to all this madness. Would it deny anyone thats arrested their due process? Would they then have tribunals? How's this work? I honestly have no idea. Are rights suspended, etc...? 

Replies

  • DrawbarFlatsDrawbarFlats Posts: 540 Senior Member
    edited June 2 #2
    While I usually support President Trump on most domestic matters, I do not support him using active military on our own soil. This is a very dangerous game he's playing and the unintended consequences will be felt for decades. It's also worth mentioning that if and when the democrats take back control in the executive and legislative branches, they will no doubt reciprocate using martial law and the military for 2A protests. President Trump has a decision to make. Does he let the "Dice fly high and cross the Rubicon" or does he sit back and let the states deal with this crisis. I personally think that the overlords who are controlling agitators, such as Antifa and other radical communist groups, are hoping for this. Trump, in my opinion, is being manipulated into doing exactly what they want him to do.


    Edit: Also, who's to say that the military wouldn't use this opportunity to coup against the President and the Constitution? Contrary to some beliefs, many military members and certain commanders aren't all conservative/constitutional leaning. 
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,515 Senior Member
    Its more divisional rhetoric to fire up his base.

    Regardless of legality or historical precedent. It had better have majority popular support where used or it will be a political land mine for Trump and the Republican party.
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 10,476 Senior Member
    Does anyone not think that the riots are not part of a political movement?
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,515 Senior Member
    The people I saw running out Auto Zone with handfuls of spark plugs and wiper blades didn't say..........
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,171 Senior Member
    The state National Guard units could put a stop to the rioting and looting IF they were allowed to do so. Weak kneed  governors aren't using them, though. The National Guard is the correct force to use in what is happening now. The U.S. military should ONLY be used during a near nationwide insurrection, and to properly use them then declaring martial law in those areas affected would be the only way to make it pass muster, and they should be used only to augment the National Guard in making arrests unless a shooting war starts with the NG. 
    Anyway, there's a training thing that separates the NG and the U.S. military regarding civil unrest. The NG trains a lot for that situation, or at least they did when I was in the TN NG. The U.S Army military police train some for that, but use different tactics.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • SpkSpk Senior Member Posts: 3,771 Senior Member
    The way I read the act, the military can be granted police powers to affect arrests and help restore order. Basically, at the request of the governor who's state is being affected and can't bring things under control, he can call on the President to intervene on the state's behalf. There's a number of exclusions and fine points but then the President would have to release a proclamation to the crowd to disperse. If they fail to heed the warning, the newly "deputized" military members would then begin arresting people. Those arrested would have (in theory) the same rights as someone arrested by civilian law enforcement, in theory! The federal government could tack on additional charges and the whole thing could get messy not to mention using active duty military untrained in state or local police procedures.
    Let's hope we don't go down that road. Anyway, they're more to the story of the Insurrection Act of 1807. It's been amended twice and goes hand in hand with the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878. Lots to read about if you have time.




    Let's not go down that road, but it has been used before. I believe most recently during the L.A. riots of 1992 when then Governor Pete Wilson called for help.
    U.S. Marines in Compton CA 1992.
    Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience -- Mark Twain
    How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and [how] hard it is to undo that work again! -- Mark Twain

  • sgtrock21sgtrock21 Senior Member Posts: 1,931 Senior Member
    Posse Comitatus applies to Title 10 active duty Air Force and Army. Navy and Marines are exempt. While doing research I ran across a somewhat amusing report of Marines in 1992 Los Angeles. A USMC squad was supporting local Law Enforcement Officers. Two looters ran into a house. The LEOs shouted "Cover us we're going in"! In the few seconds required to achieve a cease fire the house had more than 200 bullet holes in it! The looters crawled out on hands and knees with fingers interlocked behind their necks. Apparently Marines "cover" with fire.    
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,531 Senior Member
    Just doing what they were told! :)
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • SpkSpk Senior Member Posts: 3,771 Senior Member
    edited June 6 #10
    Different training and different lingo. Marines do cover with live fire, as in, mask my activities with a distracting hail of lead. That's what the M249 SAW is for 👍
    Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience -- Mark Twain
    How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and [how] hard it is to undo that work again! -- Mark Twain

  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,515 Senior Member
    The PD here is making changes. It looks to me like they're just piling extra crap on the officers trying to do the job on the street. Rather than making administrators accountable for efficient policies. 
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 8,027 Senior Member
    edited June 8 #12
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • CHIRO1989CHIRO1989 Senior Member Posts: 12,262 Senior Member
    Wow, I feel bad for the citizens of Mpls, the Hennepin Co. Sherriffs office, and anybody that owns a business in Mpls. Me and the wife cannot shake the feeling we are getting played folks.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11
  • rberglofrberglof Senior Member Posts: 2,621 Senior Member
    In California where we lived did not have city police for years, the Kern county sheriff took care of it.
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,515 Senior Member
    The disbanding and defunding of city PDs could possibly invite their replacement with private security. Paid for with public tax revenue. I would guess a potential for many problems  to follow that. Aside from the problems that come from the interm absence of police.

    A restructuring of department administration would have been better. 
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,171 Senior Member
    Six-Gun said:
    CHIRO1989 said:
    Wow, I feel bad for the citizens of Mpls, the Hennepin Co. Sherriffs office, and anybody that owns a business in Mpls. Me and the wife cannot shake the feeling we are getting played folks.
    Disbanding the Mpls PD will require the Hennepin Co. Sheriff's office to hire on more deputies to police Minneapolis. Now I wonder where that pool of new Deputy Sheriffs will come from???? Think they might be mostly from the Minneapolis PD??? Moving what is perceived as a problem from one box to another box won't solve anything. And the city will still have to pay the county for all those new Deputies to police their streets.  Sounds like the Minneapolis City Council is mentally deficient and morally bankrupt.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
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