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Mosins and bayonets

Gene LGene L Senior MemberPosts: 11,629 Senior Member
Just about every film or photo you see of WW1 or 2 you see, the infantry are carrying Mosins with the bayonets fixed.  I wondered about this, and finally saw a remark on a video that explained it...I think.  At least, it's the best explanation I've heard.

The practice apparently started in WW 1. Emphasis on massed firepower, I guess from trench warfare.  The Russians researched and found that an infantryman could fire five or six rounds toward an attacking force in the same time it took to fix a bayonet.  So they went with fixed. Makes sense, I guess, and the only explanation I've heard that does.

Of course, an attacking Russian force against an enemy would already have a fixed bayonet.  When I had a Mosin-Nagant, it came with a bayonet that needed filing to fit and seemed to be time consuming even if it was the proper diameter.  I never did the filing since I didn't figure I'd face a Nazi hoard attacking my modest home.
Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.

Replies

  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,152 Senior Member
    They were supposedly sighted in with the bayonet fixed.

    I've heard that the Czar's munitions plant was cranking out less 7.62x54 per day at the start of WWI than a motivated couple of guys could do today with a Dillon 1050.  14,000 rounds is the number that sticks in my head.

    Then you have the opening scene of Enemy at the Gates where two men were sharing one 91/30 and two stripper clips.

    These kinds of supply problems would lead to greater reliance on cold steel.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 11,629 Senior Member
    Yes, I am pretty sure they were zeroed with bayonet fixed.  I think the idea came from before WW 2, though.  I know also that No 4 mark 2 flip peeps took into consideration zeroes for fixed/unfixed ranges. About 100 yards difference, IIRC.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,763 Senior Member
    Speaking of Mosins...has anyone seen any of the ones built by Remington? Is the quality any better than the Russian built ones?
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,748 Senior Member
    I dont think Ive ever even seen a photograph. Im might dig through cyberspace for at least a pic.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,763 Senior Member
    Remington built about 850,000 of them...Westinghouse built a bunch too...
    I've seen pictures of U.S. servicemen armed with the leftovers that never got delivered to Russia...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 6,748 Senior Member
    They appear quite similar.

    The Polish M44 looks good.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 11,629 Senior Member
    Jayhawker said:
    Speaking of Mosins...has anyone seen any of the ones built by Remington? Is the quality any better than the Russian built ones?
    I don't think so. Westinghouse  also made them, but if they made them to Russian standards at a price Russia was willing to pay, I especially don't think so.  I saw a video on American Mosins, informative, but don't remember.  Finland ended up with a lot of them after WW1 by one way or another. After the Russian Revolution a lot of American guns did not go to Russia or Finland, but left W/R holding the bag.  The US govt bailed them out at $12 a rifle, the cost of making them, IIRC.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • AntonioAntonio Senior Member Posts: 2,647 Senior Member
    Seems like the fixed bayonet sighting was their standard practice indeed.

    Heard that the opening scene in "Enemy at the gates" wasn't real at least for WWII. Sadly in WWI as soon as the unexpected enormous material wear kicked in they did had an awful logistical problem that needed help from abroad, although according to the excellent video about this rifle made by the guys of Primer Small Arms (YouTube) the inspectors sent to the US to check the contract production didn't help in accelerating deliveries. 


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