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Rifled Slugs through a Rifled Barrel?

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Replies

  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 7,278 Senior Member
    Pain means stop. 

    Science can wait.
  • PFDPFD Senior Member Posts: 1,482 Senior Member
    edited March 23 #33
    If leading truly becomes an issue, get one of Mr. Lewis' lead removers.
    They are made for shotguns.  Works great on my Redhawk.
    That's all I got.

    Paul
  • RaftermanRafterman New Member Posts: 261 Member
    A tornado brush works well on lead and wad plastic too.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 6,937 Senior Member
    edited March 23 #35
    The first time my forehead met Mr. Scope was shooting a Mossberg Slug gun I decided to scope and sight in.  They DO come back at'cha for sure...
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    I’ll have the PAST Pads this afternoon. See if it’s any better. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    edited March 23 #37
    Well, leading is apparent. The groups started going to hell while I attempted to zero the gun today. But, I got a usable 50 yard zero, I guess, while shooting from the bench. 
    Used 2 PAST Pads and recoil wasn’t an issue at all. No pain. Could even shoot without blinking. The only other gun I use 2 pads with is my 7lb .458 Win Mag and 500gr Handloads. 
    Not happy with the 50yrd groups, I moved up to 25yrds and shot a group from standing supported off a tripod.

    Functional for an HD, around the yard, and maybe thick brush. Not much more than that. 
    But, I’m still pleased for the price of the gun and I have a spare Turkey barrel without a home as well. So, dual purpose now!
    But yes, I didn’t imagine the leading being bad but I was quite wrong. Seven rounds yesterday and fifteen today resulted in this. 

    I have a Scattergun Tech +1 Tube extension on the way and am considering the Williams Fiber Optic Peep Sight system as well. 

    Overall, it was an 870 for a great price and will put a hole in someone ore something inside of 50 yards. Not bad. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • SpkSpk Senior Member Posts: 4,289 Senior Member
    Clean that sucker up and use sabots, they work for HD also.
    Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience -- Mark Twain
    How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and [how] hard it is to undo that work again! -- Mark Twain

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    Spk said:
    Clean that sucker up and use sabots, they work for HD also.
    I ain’t buying ammo when I have cans full of foster slugs. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • earlyagainearlyagain Posts: 7,278 Senior Member
    Lee Alox
    Its a cheap try. A small bead between the exposed edge of the slug and the hull. Might not work. But if it does, it beats scrubbing.

  • SpkSpk Senior Member Posts: 4,289 Senior Member
    Oh well, it still makes a good close up HD gun. I had high hopes for the low recoil slugs to keep leading down but I'm not too surprised by the full house slugs.
    Anyway, good info. Thanks for posting the results. 👍
    Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience -- Mark Twain
    How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and [how] hard it is to undo that work again! -- Mark Twain

  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,496 Senior Member
    Kind of frustrating that the most common launch platform for what could be the ideal poor man's dangerous game rifle starts with the weight, geometry, and balance of a bird gun.  Little wonder they hurt with loads that stomp on the gas.

    Considering that you have ACTUAL big bore rifles, the low-recoil slugs you're well stocked with are probably the better part of valor.  I've always regarded the basic 12 gauge payloads as the nuclear weapons of home defense - - even with low recoil, you're already delivering kilotons - the target probably won't notice if you aren't stepping up to megatons.

    Leading. . .Invest in a couple dozen-count boxes of Brownell's "Double Tuff" bore brushes.  They use stiffer bronze wire on those,and they really speed up the job.

    Is your fouling worse towards the chamber end, or uniform throughout?  I'm pretty curious about the mechanics since, due to the base wads, the usual rules of gas blowby and base sealing may not 100% apply.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    I was mistaken about the reduced recoil label. The buckshot ammo I have is reduced recoil. The slugs, however, are full bore ammo. Not reduced. 
    The majority of the leading is at the chamber end. Lessening towards the muzzle. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    I’m going to try and clean it well and shoot some more groups. If they shrink after cleaning, I’ll just keep the damn barrel clean before I kill something/one
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 6,937 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    I’m going to try and clean it well and shoot some more groups. If they shrink after cleaning, I’ll just keep the damn barrel clean before I kill something/one
    Sound plan.
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,496 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    I was mistaken about the reduced recoil label. The buckshot ammo I have is reduced recoil. The slugs, however, are full bore ammo. Not reduced. 
    The majority of the leading is at the chamber end. Lessening towards the muzzle. 
    With standard cast bullets and no shotgun wad stack, I'd say that's classic gas blow-by / flame cutting taking place before the bullet gets fully obturated.  It could also be that the wads are sealing fine, but the pure lead slugs are just ablating away and leaving skid marks.

    I got as far as buying a mold and casting a few, but never got around to loading (California's lead-for-hunting ban pretty well clipped the wings of my desire for inquiry). . .the Lee "unrifled" slug molds are dimensioned to use a birdshot wad's cup as a sabot, which makes MUCH more sense to me than running bare lead with no form of bullet lube.

    HMMMMMM. . .

    What we MIGHT try is to borrow/modify a pre-moly tip from the bad old days of competition shooting back before they had perfected jacket material and had HORRIBLE fouling from the early cupro-nickel jackets ablating away against the rifling.  The old boys had a small grease pot from which they would smear a light bead at the border of case mouth and bullet.

    In the case of a factory-loaded slug, I'd modify the grease-smear theory by filling the crimped end with a dab of Johnson's Paste Wax (a common additive to home-brewed bullet lubes) from a putty knife and single load for the test string.  The sudden acceleration of the slug and spin of the rifling SHOULD cause the wax to proceed outward, giving you a seal and a lubricant.  Might also improve the accuracy since reduced fouling would give a more consistent shot-to-shot bore condition.  If it works, a stiffer, less gloppy, proper bullet lube could be heated and poured to fill the space.

    Potentially messy and impractical, I know, but since the makers of our ammo seem to be clueless on this topic. . .
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,594 Senior Member
    What about taking it to your mentor, and having it un-rifled? Or lessening the rifling?

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    jbohio said:
    What about taking it to your mentor, and having it un-rifled? Or lessening the rifling?

    There is hardly any rifling to begin with. I’ll try cleaning it first. See how hard that is. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 6,937 Senior Member
    Wrap pure copper wool(scour pad) around an appropriate bronze bore brush.  Easy cleanup...
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 17,293 Senior Member
    jbohio said:
    What about taking it to your mentor, and having it un-rifled? Or lessening the rifling?

    I would surmise that finding a smoothbore slug barrel for an 870 would be a less expensive proposition
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • JayJay Senior Member Posts: 3,952 Senior Member
    GunNut said:
    Wrap pure copper wool(scour pad) around an appropriate bronze bore brush.  Easy cleanup...
    This ^

    Easy lead remover brush. You can still find Chore Boy pure copper pads in some stores or they sell them on Prime.
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 6,937 Senior Member
    Jay said:
    GunNut said:
    Wrap pure copper wool(scour pad) around an appropriate bronze bore brush.  Easy cleanup...
    This ^

    Easy lead remover brush. You can still find Chore Boy pure copper pads in some stores or they sell them on Prime.
    I get mine from prime.  They are cheap by the dozen.  When I buy a used gun the standard first bore scrub is with this combo and it usually takes out any old lead and such in just a few passes.  It's great when I'm shooting lead reloads in my 1911s or revolvers.
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    A friend let me borrow a Lewis Lead Remover and that worked like a charm!
    I added some BoreTech Rimfire Blend to the screen. 

    After a few passes, I removed the screen and put a .30cal patch on the end with more BoreTech and pushed through. Holy crap!  Sludge came out!  Another patch. Another push with screen. Two more patches and clean. 

    I’m ordering one of those Lewis Lead Removers!!
    Also added a Scattergun Technologies +1 Tube Extension and I have the Hand of God in a viable HD package. 

    I am very pleased with this purchase for the price.  
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 11,378 Senior Member
    That is some potent stuff.
    Gun potent medicine for an uninvited intruder
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • BigDanSBigDanS Senior Member Posts: 6,992 Senior Member
    You mentioned the recoil of your 500 gr .458... well a 1 1/8 oz slug is nearly 500 gr and moving at 1300 fps or so. I have a Savage 500 deer barrel setup I have yet to fire with Hastings Slugs. I think Joe B. shot a few at Jerry’s 10 years ago and liked them.
    "A patriot is mocked, scorned and hated; yet when his cause succeeds, all men will join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.... now who's bringing the hot wings? :jester:
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    BigDanS said:
    You mentioned the recoil of your 500 gr .458... well a 1 1/8 oz slug is nearly 500 gr and moving at 1300 fps or so. I have a Savage 500 deer barrel setup I have yet to fire with Hastings Slugs. I think Joe B. shot a few at Jerry’s 10 years ago and liked them.
    Normally, pain is bearable. But, with a recently rebuilt shoulder........I’d rather not pay for a second build. The PAST Pads made it a non-issue. 
    Seriously, biggest fear these days is tearing up what was recently fixed. Not worth it. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    I’ve changed my mind. Going to move the Scattergun Tech 1-Round tube extension to my Remington Tac-14 and just ordered at 2-Round extension for this slug gun. 

    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • PFDPFD Senior Member Posts: 1,482 Senior Member
    A Lewis lead remover????
    Who would have thunk it. 😄
    That's all I got.

    Paul
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 24,919 Senior Member
    PFD said:
    A Lewis lead remover????
    Who would have thunk it. 😄
    Hey, least I got to try it first. 😜
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • GunNutGunNut Posts: 6,937 Senior Member
    If you’d listened to the French model and I you would have saved some money 😁
    Old West Saying: God created men, but Col. Sam Colt made them equal.

    General George Patton:  “Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.”

  • Bears4deblife89Bears4deblife89 Posts: 5 New Member
    Im new to shotguns and looking to get one soon. What is the reason for a rifled barrel ?
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