Seems like Bump stocks are back…

Wambli Ska

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/fifth-circuit-mandates-ruling-in-favor-of-plaintiff-in-cargill-v-garland-legalizing-bump-stocks-in-three-states/

At least in 3 states… Texas, Louisiana and Mississippi.

From the article:
“Three other circuits have upheld the ATF’s ban. The Fifth Circuit’s order officially creates a Circuit Court split, setting up an almost certain review by the Supreme Court which could go much farther than just bump stocks, possibly limiting the extent to which regulatory agencies and the administrative state are free to “interpret,” alter, and create laws. “

GrapeApe

Good

Diver43

While I have no use for bump stocks or binary triggers, it is the correct decision and will certainly make others look at Government Agency overreaching 

PFD

Diver43 said:

While I have no use for bump stocks or binary triggers, it is the correct decision and will certainly make others look at Government Agency overreaching 

This. 

Laws should be made by elected officials.

Wambli Ska

Agree on all counts.  The ATF has overreached their powers on just about all aspects of firearms issues while being outside the reach of the voting population.

bullsi1911

Michael Cargill is a badass. He is local to me, and I kinda know the guy. My wife and several friends took thier CHL classes from him, and he is a straight up defender of the 2nd Amendment. 

This is such great news 

breamfisher

Too bad we didn't have a Republican as POTUS, AG, and a Republican Congress when the rule happened to keep the ATF from making that ruling.

Oh, wait... 

bullsi1911

Yep. And too bad we had a huge amount of gun owners who were willing to let the bump stocks get thrown under the bus in the hope they would not go after more. 

Appeasing tyranny never works. 

Wambli Ska

bullsi1911 said:

Yep. And too bad we had a huge amount of gun owners who were willing to let the bump stocks get thrown under the bus in the hope they would not go after more. 

Appeasing tyranny never works. 

👍👍👍

YEP!  and I’m guilty of this because I didn’t care about bump stocks but since then I figured out this was a psychological win for the left and I screwed up.

breamfisher

bullsi1911 said:

Yep. And too bad we had a huge amount of gun owners who were willing to let the bump stocks get thrown under the bus in the hope they would not go after more. 

Appeasing tyranny never works. 

You would think that we'd have learned since NFA 1934 and all the legislation that came after it that compromising on rights doesn't work, it just emboldens those who seek to restrict. We give up part of our rights but get to keep an abridged version of liberty. So we don't get a total removal of freedom and convince ourselves it's a win. 

Wambli Ska

breamfisher said:

bullsi1911 said:

Yep. And too bad we had a huge amount of gun owners who were willing to let the bump stocks get thrown under the bus in the hope they would not go after more. 

Appeasing tyranny never works. 

You would think that we'd have learned since NFA 1934 and all the legislation that came after it that compromising on rights doesn't work, it just emboldens those who seek to restrict. We give up part of our rights but get to keep an abridged version of liberty. So we don't get a total removal of freedom and convince ourselves it's a win. 

EVERY civilization has operated as a race to a collapse based on the erosion of liberties on the people by Governments in a futile effort of keeping control of the masses.  Hell the Catholic religion was established in Rome as a futile effort to keep the crumbling empire united.  

But invariably at some point in time the people invariably say, enough and break up into smaller likeminded groups and start again.  Have you seen the latest, rather public, calls for "Political Divorce"?  30 years ago you would have not heard this from anyone but the fringe as they whispered in dark corner and dimly lit meeting rooms...

Jeeper44mag

I've said for years, that every government has a size limit (population cap) beyond which, it will find itself unable to cater to (or provide for) the diversity therein.  I think we exceeded that size dozens of years ago (like in the 1920's or 30's) and that only the individual states rights have prevented a breakup already, since you can vote with your feet and move to a state that more closely matches your desired laws.   But as the Federal government seeks further and greater control, I forsee a shakeup of some sort eventually.

What worked (and very well initially IMO) for 13 states, won't necessarily work for 50.   The primary advantages of a strong Federal government are that it prevents wars/strife between the states, promotes interstate commerce, and provides for the common defense (which should include economic defense from other countries).   

Beyond these objectives however, the Federal government needs to basically keep it's nose out of everyone's business, and remain as small as possible.... and THAT isn't happening. 

Luis

Bigslug

Seemed to me then, and seems to me now, that much effort is being spent on protecting a mechanically cheesy semantic workaround to the unconstitutional NFA34 that could be better spent on disposing of NFA34.  I can't see how fighting B.S. with more B.S. is an effective strategy. 

breamfisher

Or, maybe, setting boundaries for an executive branch regulatory agency to... regulate based on the laws and not reinterpret the already written laws to meet the desires of the executive branch is a good thing because it reinforces the other Constitutional idea of separation of powers is a really good precedent to set.  Furthermore, it's probably more attainable, especially in the short term, to get a regulatory agency to roll back its overreach than to take a court case all the way to the Supreme Court to repeal a 89 year old law.

I suppose the NRA has the money to do it, but being not really advocates, it doesn't seem they've been to eager to flex the muscle.  I mean, they even supported the bumpstock ban in the first place.

bullsi1911

Bigslug said:

Seemed to me then, and seems to me now, that much effort is being spent on protecting a mechanically cheesy semantic workaround to the unconstitutional NFA34 that could be better spent on disposing of NFA34.  I can't see how fighting B.S. with more B.S. is an effective strategy. 

Having bump stocks and braces being normal and “in common use” is an effective way to fight the NFA.  If pseudo full auto and pseudo SBRs are being used and sold every day, it removes most of the argument for keeping the NFA.

plus, as Picard said in “First Contact”: “The line must be drawn here! This far, and no farther!”

we can’t advance to repealing the GCA and NFA if we are retreating from cheesy bits of plastic that can be made in any garage or basement buy people with no tools and no training

Freezer

State rights? Look at Kaliforniastan! A law enforcement officer can buy and own, privately, any firearm they want. All guns must pass their drop test. "Assault weapons" have to meet their criteria, ammo is heavily taxed and municipalities have taxed the guns store so heavily that they were put out of business. 

What about concealed carry permits? I can, almost, understand background checks, but, you only regulate the honest. Beyond the background check, there should be no law "requiring" training, insurance, or justifiable need, nor should it regulate you to carry a specific weapon. That should be left to the individual's good judgement and moral code. "Infringed"!

Their Woke/political correctness infringes on the first amendment also! Hate speech? Really? The First Amendment gives you the right to disagree, be offended and to offend.

We need one standard when it comes to our constitutional rights. "No person is entitled to title or privilege", "Shall not be infringed".

The NRA has abandoned California and other states. Their overreach should have been in the Supreme Court years ago. It is partly responsible for the ATF's overreach. If the states can overstep the constitution, we can too! 

I knew I shouldn't have read this thread!

Wambli Ska

Californians have abandoned their state.  People vote in their own masters…