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Batman Premier in Colorado, 14 dead many more injured

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  • NomadacNomadac Senior Member Posts: 902 Senior Member
    jbp-ohio wrote: »
    The North Hollywood shooters had vests on, and they didn't look to concerned with the police shooting at them.

    If someone is mentally defective enough to shoot a room full of people, I can see them thinking a vest will make them bulletproof.

    If you study the North Hollywood Bank Robbers and their considerable criminal background, they were harden criminals with numerous fully automatic weapons, very capable and intent on a shootout if it came to that. Having lived in Southern California at the time, the news had many programs that covered their background and their was even a special on TV with live footage of the actual shootout. The police that responded to the shooting were completely out gunned and had to visit a local Gun Store and borrow some higher power weapons that allowed them to end the shootout.
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    Many of these crazies put their gun to their own head at the end, so I wouldn't count on them trying to dodge my bullets.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,871 Senior Member
    jbp-ohio wrote: »
    Yeah, making a headshot in the dark thru tear gas is gonna be hard to practice for.

    Now they're saying it was smoke. Maybe, maybe not.

    Those who were in the military: what did your tear gas training consist of? Any shooting?
    I'm just here for snark.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,447 Senior Member
    jbp-ohio wrote: »
    My PM9 vs AK/AR wielding body armored gunman???? Don't like those odds.

    I cannot begin to speculate about the situation. All we can do is theorize as we weren't there.

    But..........I'd take those odds over waving my middle finger at him, telling him he's #1, while he proceded to shoot in amongst the crowd. In fact, I'll take those odds anyday over being a fish in a barrel.

    I may win..........I may lose..........either way........he'll know I was there.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    Now they're saying it was smoke. Maybe, maybe not.

    Those who were in the military: what did your tear gas training consist of? Any shooting?

    Go into a room with mask on. Stand for a few minutes, they want you to know the mask works.

    Take mask off. stand for one minute while you cough and hack, tears flow and boogers fly out your nose.

    Walk outside. If you run they make you go back in. Pour canteen of water in your face.

    Thats it.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,577 Senior Member
    jbp-ohio wrote: »
    There goes Sam's theory of BG's never wear vests...... Since this is in the PD section, would anyone carry AP rounds if they were available??

    57.gif

    Sure, if they weren't selling at around $400 to $500/per 50.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I cannot begin to speculate about the situation. All we can do is theorize as we weren't there.

    But..........I'd take those odds over waving my middle finger at him, telling him he's #1, while he proceded to shoot in amongst the crowd. In fact, I'll take those odds anyday over being a fish in a barrel.

    I may win..........I may lose..........either way........he'll know I was there.

    What if you arent there alone? Your first shot brings his line of fire to you seat.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I cannot begin to speculate about the situation. All we can do is theorize as we weren't there.

    But..........I'd take those odds over waving my middle finger at him, telling him he's #1, while he proceded to shoot in amongst the crowd. In fact, I'll take those odds anyday over being a fish in a barrel.

    I may win..........I may lose..........either way........he'll know I was there.

    +1 I would rather be found dead with my .45 locked back on an empty mag than laying there without being able to fight back.

    Prayers to all the families and the wounded.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • bruchibruchi Senior Member Posts: 2,581 Senior Member
    This is very sad indeed, lots of innocent folks, all genres and ages sitting at a movie theater probably quite dark taken by surprise.

    No clue on the specifics, the geography of the theater and so many other things, only clear thing is that regular people minding their own business got murdered in cold blood.

    I find quite reprensible that some will use a situation like with so many unknowns outside the sad part to claim how they would put this guy down, double taps to the head and all that Hollywood stuff, there's even descriptions of what gun they carry and how effective they know it will be! Hope that is not due to very badly placed "bravado" but instead a case of frustration.

    Not the time to talk "about guns" even this being a gun forum, not the image we want to present IMHO.
    If this post is non welcomed, I can always give you a recipe for making "tostones".
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    bruchi wrote: »
    This is very sad indeed, lots of innocent folks, all genres and ages sitting at a movie theater probably quite dark taken by surprise.

    No clue on the specifics, the geography of the theater and so many other things, only clear thing is that regular people minding their own business got murdered in cold blood.

    I find quite reprensible that some will use a situation like with so many unknowns outside the sad part to claim how they would put this guy down, double taps to the head and all that Hollywood stuff, there's even descriptions of what gun they carry and how effective they know it will be! Hope that is not due to very badly placed "bravado" but instead a case of frustration.

    Not the time to talk "about guns" even this being a gun forum, not the image we want to present IMHO.

    This is tbe PD forum, the perfect place to discus the 'what if's'.....

    Guys practice weak hand press drills for a 'what if'...

    This actually happened, hopefully the next time it happens ( cause it will). Someone will be there who has thought of enough 'what ifs' to be prepared for it.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,447 Senior Member
    jbp-ohio wrote: »
    What if you arent there alone? Your first shot brings his line of fire to you seat.

    The deal is, they take cover or move away. I will be moving laterally to or pressing the threat. That's the plan we have layed out, if escape is not an option.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • David WhiteDavid White Member Posts: 37 Member
    wahoo4db wrote: »
    dont think my 38 special plus p is enough for defense with a guy with riot gear on. what caliber do i need??

    I don't know but I sure would like to know how comfortable he would be after 15 rounds of 135grn +p Critical duty! 🔫👀
  • David WhiteDavid White Member Posts: 37 Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I cannot begin to speculate about the situation. All we can do is theorize as we weren't there.

    But..........I'd take those odds over waving my middle finger at him, telling him he's #1, while he proceded to shoot in amongst the crowd. In fact, I'll take those odds anyday over being a fish in a barrel.

    I may win..........I may lose..........either way........he'll know I was there.

    Amen brother, amen!!


    ImageUploadedByTapatalk1342837886.183333.jpg
  • David WhiteDavid White Member Posts: 37 Member
    jbp-ohio wrote: »
    What if you arent there alone? Your first shot brings his line of fire to you seat.

    Maybe.....Maybe not. He may have a mask on but he still suffers the same limitations as others (dark room, smoke, people running to and fro)... I'll take those odds.
    I've "been there, done that". Substitute a theater with a bar....smokey room, active shooter, dark etc.
  • David WhiteDavid White Member Posts: 37 Member
    bruchi wrote: »
    I find quite reprensible that some will use a situation like with so many unknowns outside the sad part to claim how they would put this guy down, double taps to the head and all that Hollywood stuff, there's even descriptions of what gun they carry and how effective they know it will be! Hope that is not due to very badly placed "bravado" but instead a case of frustration.

    Not the time to talk "about guns" even this being a gun forum, not the image we want to present IMHO.

    There is NO BETTER time to talk about guns. What do you think will be the topic of every friggin news cast around the country for the next week or so?! It will be about how "bad guns are", "how regular people don't need these types of guns" BS on a massive scale! We better be talking about guns before they use this as another excuse to take away our rights.
    As for being armed during that chaos, don't forget.... He ALSO has to deal with smoke, poor lighting and people running crazy. I for one REFUSE to "hide" and wait to be executed. I carry and you bet your arse that I will make my self known.
    No "Hollywood heroics", just a man fighting for his life!
    Don't forget, "we" would not have known he had a vest on in that moment ( just trying to preempt you reply ). I will assure you this, vest or no vest, he would know pain and he would know I was around!
  • MileHighShooterMileHighShooter Senior Member Posts: 4,975 Senior Member
    Just pointing out, he came prepared, he was wearing a gas mask
  • David WhiteDavid White Member Posts: 37 Member
    I guess he should have used gas instead of smoke grenades......

    Just sayin.....
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 27,447 Senior Member
    Just pointing out, he came prepared, he was wearing a gas mask

    I choose to go prepared as well. As prepared as practicality dictates. The end result is up to God.

    "Trust in God but, lock your car door."
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • SirGeorgeKillianSirGeorgeKillian Senior Member Posts: 5,463 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »
    I choose to go prepared as well. As prepared as practicality dictates. The end result is up to God.

    "Trust in God but, lock your car door."

    In God we trust, everyone else keep your hands where I can see them....
    Unless life also hands you water and sugar, your lemonade is gonna suck!
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    I'm in love with a Glock
  • saxdsaxd Member Posts: 40 Member
    So, you are at the movie with your wife and teenage son. You have your CCW. You have a few options as I see it.
    1. Run (from most accounts the people who ran got shot)
    2. Stand and fight (movement in theatres is limited and you may draw fire towards your family)
    3. Hunker down or hide (you become a static target.)

    Seems like an all around poop sandwich to me. If I am there alone I will go out in a blaze of glory trying to bring this douche down, but I am pretty sure I would eat my gun if my actions in any way brought harm to my family.
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    Send the family the opposite direction and draw fire. Sucks for you but it might get them out.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • yotesalotyotesalot New Member Posts: 18 New Member
    I wonder what Dirt Bag would have done IF a number of people would have rushed him at the same time?..
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    +1
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • NomadacNomadac Senior Member Posts: 902 Senior Member
    So much for the theater;s policy of being a "Gun Free Zone" and not allowing customers to carry licensed firearms. Maybe a CCW holder that was in the theater could sue the theater for preventing him from protecting himself. Not likely I imagine, but would be interesting.

    Obviously the shooter was not complainant with this order.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    There are enough scenarios that have a great potential to go sour fast, and even fatal, however, the bottom line is is this, you are always better off armed and prepared, and discussing these topics is another way to prepare......
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,573 Senior Member
    I think there's a lot of "perfect conditions" people who advocate returning fire are fantisizing. They're not accounting for a few hundred people panicking and trying to get away. Likely, returning fire would be impossible except under ideal conditions where you're basically isolated, don't have tear gas in your eyes, and are not being over run by panicked people.

    Which doesn't mean you shouldn't carry a gun in a theatre, where it's allowed. However, in that particular situation, I doubt anyone who was there could have returned fire.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    saxd wrote: »
    So, you are at the movie with your wife and teenage son. You have your CCW. You have a few options as I see it.
    1. Run (from most accounts the people who ran got shot)
    2. Stand and fight (movement in theatres is limited and you may draw fire towards your family)
    3. Hunker down or hide (you become a static target.)

    Seems like an all around poop sandwich to me. If I am there alone I will go out in a blaze of glory trying to bring this douche down, but I am pretty sure I would eat my gun if my actions in any way brought harm to my family.

    I carry a CCW to protect my family first. Me second. My course of action will be to save my family first. Me second. If my course of action saves others, that's good, but not why I carry.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,244 Senior Member
    So the guy had a bullet proof vest and a Kevlar helmet. I obviously wasn't there and am not playing armchair quarterback, but I want to remind everyone that shots to the pelvis are very effective.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 10,662 Senior Member
    Jermanator wrote: »
    So the guy had a bullet proof vest and a Kevlar helmet. I obviously wasn't there and am not playing armchair quarterback, but I want to remind everyone that shots to the pelvis are very effective.

    Have to wait until more legit info comes out. One witness I saw on the news today said he was, ''Armored all over.''
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 16,244 Senior Member
    Nor was it likely that everyone knew he had the vest on. I am just throwing it out there.
    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it.
    -Thomas Paine
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