Election analysis, my late opinions

samzheresamzhere BannedPosts: 10,923 Senior Member
Taking all the frustration and anger out of the results, I've got some general observations on how to change things next time around. You're welcome to challenge my opinions.

Obama won simply because he had more voters than Romney and enough majority in swing states to cover it. I'm sure there was local fraud but not enough to tip the count, and if you try to search for cheating as the cause, you'll end up wearing tinfoil hats. No, the voting was legit enough.

What we had, essentially, was an increasing minority electorate that mostly went to Obama. 98-99% of the black vote, and frankly, if during the last 3 weeks of the campaign, Obama and his staff had dressed in SS uniforms and begun reading from Mein Kampf, the votes would not have changed. Black people would have said it was a joke or a reaction created by the Tea Party.

After dumping on the Roman Catholic church, members still went for Obama 55-45. After shamming the Israeli government, Jews still voted 70% for him.

Hispanics the same, as well as union members, other minorities (Hindis, Asians, etc). all down the line. The majority varied but it still leaned to Obama. Young women, too. And of course low income people on the dole.

There simply weren't enough middle income white voters who actually VOTED to make a difference.

As Limbaugh said, this country has slid from right-of-center to left-of-center in just a few years.

Some voters are probably right to vote Democrat, if they want extensive free stuff and don't want to actually work for a living.

Some will vote D until they die.

Some however are fools and patsies, particularly Hispanic, Jewish, and Roman Catholic voters, who are being used and don't have the alertness to realize it. And as for the black voters, they will continue to be slaves to their black and white masters until they wake up.

Much of this problem with the vast middle class which is slipping to the left is based on our continually leftist educational system. If you can't afford private schools for your kids, next best thing is to fight every day against the system and try to enlighten your kids to the real truth.

In the meantime we have to fight locally for conservative mayors and governors, and hunker down as best we can until the current liberal admin burns itself out. That happened with Carter and it can happen with Obama.

And yeah, of course -- get away from politics before it rusts you out. Spend time with family and friends, go camping or fishing, see some good movies, take your kids shooting, try to ignore the chaos.

Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
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Replies

  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    For some weird reason, the edit function isn't working. I wanted to add that no, Romney wasn't the ideal candidate but he was the only candidate running who could have defeated Obama, after he won the nomination. Over 3 million potential Republican voters stayed home. Thanks, pals. I'm sorry, but Ronald Reagan wasn't running. So you do the next best thing possible to eliminate Obama. And no, Ron Paul wouldn't have even carried Texas.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • robert38-55robert38-55 Senior Member Posts: 3,621 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote:
    Some however are fools and patsies, particularly Hispanic, Jewish, and Roman Catholic voters, who are being used and don't have the alertness to realize it. And as for the black voters, they will continue to be slaves to their black and white masters until they wake up

    ^^^^ That^^^^ reminds me of Nazi Germany 1938.
    samzhere wrote:
    Much of this problem with the vast middle class which is slipping to the left is based on our continually leftist educational system. If you can't afford private schools for your kids, next best thing is to fight every day against the system and try to enlighten your kids to the real truth
    Just goes to prove what I have been saying, and knowing all along!!!! Remember, a school house, or any institute of learning is nothing more than a building,until some truth is put/placed into it. Once the truth has been installed in a building used for learning,then and only then does it become a school,by deffinition.
    samzhere wrote:
    In the meantime we have to fight locally for conservative mayors and governors, and hunker down as best we can until the current liberal admin burns itself out. That happened with Carter and it can happen with Obama.
    There simply weren't enough middle income white voters who actually VOTED to make a difference.
    I remember those Jimmy Carter days sam, and you make a good comparison. But don't ya think that we had more middle white right wing conservatives,in the voting populus then? You mentioned this in your original post.
    "It is what it is":usa:
  • JermanatorJermanator Senior Member Posts: 15,518 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    For some weird reason, the edit function isn't working. I wanted to add that no, Romney wasn't the ideal candidate but he was the only candidate running who could have defeated Obama, after he won the nomination. Over 3 million potential Republican voters stayed home. Thanks, pals. I'm sorry, but Ronald Reagan wasn't running. So you do the next best thing possible to eliminate Obama. And no, Ron Paul wouldn't have even carried Texas.

    Less people voted for Obama this year than they did for McCain in 2008. This tells me that Republicans sat home. I am very disappointed.
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    Jermanator wrote: »
    Less people voted for Obama this year than they did for McCain in 2008. This tells me that Republicans sat home. I am very disappointed.

    Correction...Conservatives sat home. I didn't stay home, but I didn't vote for any candidates that pushed mandatory healthcare or banned guns.


    samzhere wrote:
    I wanted to add that no, Romney wasn't the ideal candidate but he was the only candidate running who could have defeated Obama, after he won the nomination. Over 3 million potential Republican voters stayed home. Thanks, pals. I'm sorry, but Ronald Reagan wasn't running. So you do the next best thing possible to eliminate Obama.


    Ah...the GOP blame game.

    Sorry to point out the obvious, but Romney couldn't have beat Obama. To put it in simple terms, if you have a football coach that the players do not support, he will not win any close games. The GOP continues to run RINOs election after election. The GOP needs to get a clue. If you want the conservative vote, run a freaking CONSERVATIVE candidate.
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,956 Senior Member
    CaliFFL wrote: »
    If you want the conservative vote, run a freaking CONSERVATIVE candidate.

    Problem is you also can't win a national election with just "conservatives" voting for you and unfortunately I don't see many so called conservatives in politics these days that seem like they can also appeal to the other 65-70% of the country.
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    I got this email a couple of days after the election. it makes a lot of sense!



    Subject: Inner Peace after this election......





    I'm passing this on because it worked for me today.

    A doctor on TV said that in order to have inner peace in our lives after this election, we should always finish things that we start. Since we all could use more calm in our lives, I looked around my house to find things I'd started & hadn't finished.

    I finished a bottle of Merlot, a bottle of Chardonnay, a bodle of Baileys, a butle of wum, tha mainder of Valiuminun scriptins, an a box a choclutz. Yu has no idr how fablus I feel rite now.

    Sned this to all ur frenz who need inner piss. An telum u luvum.


    Peace, all!
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    CaliFFL wrote: »
    Correction...Conservatives sat home. I didn't stay home, but I didn't vote for any candidates that pushed mandatory healthcare or banned guns.


    samzhere wrote:



    Ah...the GOP blame game.

    Sorry to point out the obvious, but Romney couldn't have beat Obama. To put it in simple terms, if you have a football coach that the players do not support, he will not win any close games. The GOP continues to run RINOs election after election. The GOP needs to get a clue. If you want the conservative vote, run a freaking CONSERVATIVE candidate.

    Good commentary, Cal. Now just tell me: which candidate would have been the one to beat Obama instead of Romney. Who, exactly (no, please don't defer by telling me "any conservative", either).

    Please name that possible candidate, someone who may have been on a good run for the nomination but was turned down by the establishment, but if only had he been on the ballot.... who was this person?

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    ^^^^ That^^^^ reminds me of Nazi Germany 1938.

    I'm serious, and it scares me. Look how the mainstream press has gang tackled anyone who tried to criticize Obama. They've thrown themselves under the wheels. Most pernicious is the suggestion that ANY criticism of Obama or Eric Holder, etc, was racist. It gives them carte blanche.

    I've read fairly extensively about the Nazi era. Why? Because part of my heritage is Jewish but the other part is German, and my German ancestors were proud, loyal, and GOOD people. So were most Germans. How did it happen? How did a country with Beethoven, Mozart, art, culture, strong values for decency and family sink so low?

    I tell these folks who support Obama regardless -- and that's totally different from maybe liking his immigration policy or tax increase policy or whatever, those are simply points of political opinion that can be argued each way... but "Obama right or wrong" is dangerous. I warn these people, you do not know what doors you're opening. We was mindless, absolute loyalty to a national leader once before, 1938, in Germany. That's how it starts.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,781 Senior Member
    I've been voting Republican for several elections because I perceived them as slowing the slide into a nanny state. They can no longer do that. It's here and it's only going to get worse and the Republicans couldn't stop it if they wanted to.

    It's time for conservatives and libertarians to figure out what they can agree on, and start laying the groundwork for putting the country back together, when it finishes this slide into economic oblivion. Obama is taking us over the fiscal cliff, regardless of how these sham negotiations with Republicans come out. If we don't turn into Greece, it will be because American entrepreneurs are determined to prosper in spite of our now undeniably anti-capitalist government.
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Good commentary, Cal. Now just tell me: which candidate would have been the one to beat Obama instead of Romney. Who, exactly (no, please don't defer by telling me "any conservative", either).

    Please name that possible candidate, someone who may have been on a good run for the nomination but was turned down by the establishment, but if only had he been on the ballot.... who was this person?

    I do not think any republican running this cycle was going to beat Obama. There were a couple conservatives early in the run that were discarded by the GOP establishment.

    Future candidate that would have my vote: (unless he does something stupid)

    Marco Rubio...he is conservative enough to be accepted by the Tea Partiers, and mainstream enough to get the moderate vote. Bonus: He isn't "a rich white guy".

    Sadly, in four years, the GOP will drag out yet another left-leaning candidate, and he will get his butt kicked by Hillary.
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    Problem is you also can't win a national election with just "conservatives" voting for you and unfortunately I don't see many so called conservatives in politics these days that seem like they can also appeal to the other 65-70% of the country.

    I must agree with this. I am starting to accept that the majority of Americans WANT big government.
    Democrats and Republicans just have different ideas about what they want to enlarge: Entitlements or Police State
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    bisley wrote: »
    It's time for conservatives and libertarians to figure out what they can agree on, and start laying the groundwork for putting the country back together

    :that:
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,332 Senior Member
    My take on the election is Romney was ineffective in telling the truth about Obama and the Democrats in general, and Obama was effective in telling lies about Romney. Obama got 7 million votes less in 2012 than in 2008, and Romney got 3 million votes less than McCain did in 2008. If he had gotten those 3 million votes, he most likely would have won.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • casinoroyalecasinoroyale Member Posts: 68 Member
    America is changing. America has always been changing. It is fairly easy to dig up articles from the 19th century written by people paranoid that the Catholic Eastern & Southern European scourge that was threatening to take over America.

    This doesn't mean that the Republicans, or conservatism in general, is doomed. Conservatives can appeal to minorities. They have. Many forget that in 2000, George W. Bush won the Muslim vote, or that in the 90s and early 2000s the GOP was gaining ground with Hispanics.

    The main problem is that recent Republican leaders have completely alienated most minorities. What the GOP needs is a change in leadership.
  • robert38-55robert38-55 Senior Member Posts: 3,621 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    I'm serious, and it scares me. Look how the mainstream press has gang tackled anyone who tried to criticize Obama. They've thrown themselves under the wheels. Most pernicious is the suggestion that ANY criticism of Obama or Eric Holder, etc, was racist. It gives them carte blanche.

    I've read fairly extensively about the Nazi era. Why? Because part of my heritage is Jewish but the other part is German, and my German ancestors were proud, loyal, and GOOD people. So were most Germans. How did it happen? How did a country with Beethoven, Mozart, art, culture, strong values for decency and family sink so low?

    I tell these folks who support Obama regardless -- and that's totally different from maybe liking his immigration policy or tax increase policy or whatever, those are simply points of political opinion that can be argued each way... but "Obama right or wrong" is dangerous. I warn these people, you do not know what doors you're opening. We was mindless, absolute loyalty to a national leader once before, 1938, in Germany. That's how it starts.

    I totally agree with ya Sam, and I will continue to speak that until the end. One thing I will not do, and that is give up on this country and it's founding principles, and those that sacrificed so much on my behalf... I just won't give up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Even back in 2008,when Obummy won his first election, I knew then that it was a: "Tempest in a Teapot" I also warned folks back then,just like I do now, and to quote ya Sam: "Obama right or wrong" is dangerous.. Time will not only tell,but it will reveal also. And that's so sad!!!!!!!!
    "It is what it is":usa:
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,781 Senior Member
    casinoroyale,

    Many thanks to you and all the other good-hearted liberals out there who are trying to help the Republican Party get back into the win column. When will we ever learn to conduct campaigns like you guys tell us we should? :bang:

    And yes, the Republicans do need to send their leadership packing, at least in the Senate, where the truly cowardly ones are still trying to help Democrats preside over the decline of a great nation. It's perfectly obvious now that the Democrats don't need any help to engineer this, so these guys are just dead weight.
  • snake284-1snake284-1 Senior Member Posts: 2,500 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Good commentary, Cal. Now just tell me: which candidate would have been the one to beat Obama instead of Romney. Who, exactly (no, please don't defer by telling me "any conservative", either).

    Please name that possible candidate, someone who may have been on a good run for the nomination but was turned down by the establishment, but if only had he been on the ballot.... who was this person?

    Sam, one problem, in your answer to this post it looks like YOU said, "Ah...the GOP blame game,

    Sorry to point out the obvious, but Romney couldn't have beat Obama. To put it in simple terms, if you have a football coach that the players do not support, he will not win any close games. The GOP continues to run RINOs election after election. The GOP needs to get a clue. If you want the conservative vote, run a freaking CONSERVATIVE candidate."

    when it was actually Califf who said it. Anyway, I agree totally with what you said. I also think Mitt was a very good candidate except he didn't seem aggressive enough. He let Obammy slide on some key issues in the last two debates. He may could have beet him if he'd ramped it up a bit. However, Califf isn't too far off here. The DummyCrats ain't too dumb, they've almost made it impossible for a conservative to win. Like was said after the election, "All that give away stuff is a hard act to follow!"
    I'm Just a Radical Right Wing Nutt Job, Trying to Help Save My Country!
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    I do agree that Romney wasn't ideal. He was too mild and he should have hit and hit hard re. the Libya murders and other failures.

    Romney was "okay" and I said so early when he emerged as a choice. No, he is NOT a RINO, he's simply a moderate Republican -- and this is an okay type to run a Republican state but not aggressive enough to win the presendincy.

    For the future, Marco Rubio or Bobby Jindal, and some others, for sure. But for right now, I simply did not see another candidate with Romney's general appeal.

    I asked Calif specifically WHO ELSE and he was silent. I'll ask ANYONE: who better than Romney in this election cycle? I was enthusiastic for Caesar's Pizza dude till it looked like his dirty laundry would get him. I simply did NOT know of a better candidate for this cycle (Rubio, jindal aren't national enough yet).

    Hey, I had no "saviour" candidate this time around. Romney emerged as the best organized, best overall. And then he ran a lukewarm campaign. Red hot compared to McCain, but not nearly firey enough to swing voters as was needed. He should have bashed Fast & Furious into the ground, demanded resignations and hearings -- he should have hit on the Libya disaster like a hungry shark.

    Hey, you're gonna likely lose, right? So pull out all the stops, burn your bridges, take no prisoners. He may have been able to turn it around. We all know that Romney's a nice guy but he needed to be the tough guy, pushing every minute, asking those embarrassing questions.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,956 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    I do agree that Romney wasn't ideal. He was too mild and he should have hit and hit hard re. the Libya murders and other failures.

    Romney was "okay" and I said so early when he emerged as a choice. No, he is NOT a RINO, he's simply a moderate Republican -- and this is an okay type to run a Republican state but not aggressive enough to win the presendincy.

    For the future, Marco Rubio or Bobby Jindal, and some others, for sure. But for right now, I simply did not see another candidate with Romney's general appeal.

    I asked Calif specifically WHO ELSE and he was silent. I'll ask ANYONE: who better than Romney in this election cycle? I was enthusiastic for Caesar's Pizza dude till it looked like his dirty laundry would get him. I simply did NOT know of a better candidate for this cycle (Rubio, jindal aren't national enough yet).

    Hey, I had no "saviour" candidate this time around. Romney emerged as the best organized, best overall. And then he ran a lukewarm campaign. Red hot compared to McCain, but not nearly firey enough to swing voters as was needed. He should have bashed Fast & Furious into the ground, demanded resignations and hearings -- he should have hit on the Libya disaster like a hungry shark.

    Hey, you're gonna likely lose, right? So pull out all the stops, burn your bridges, take no prisoners. He may have been able to turn it around. We all know that Romney's a nice guy but he needed to be the tough guy, pushing every minute, asking those embarrassing questions.

    IMHO the candidate that wins in 2016 actually won't be the one that can hit the other side the hardest, but the one who can best raise himself above partisan bickering and craft a coherent and positive vision for the future of this country that appeals to most Americans.
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    I asked Calif specifically WHO ELSE and he was silent.

    I wasn't silent. I answered your question.
    I do not think any republican running this cycle was going to beat Obama

    The GOP could not produce a single candidate that appealed to their own base. Romney was the best they could come up with. Millions of republicans, conservatives, and libertarians REFUSED to vote for him. You can't have FOX News railing against ObamaCare and in the next sentence telling us that RomneyCare was somehow different. Or that Romney's gun ban was OK because it was only at the state level.

    Sorry bud, but Romney is no moderate. Signing gun bans and socialized medicine laws make you a liberal.
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Yet to hear, Calif, for whom your presidential vote went. Or did you simply not vote for anyone for Pres? I can't seem to get the straight answer. And, if you prefer not to say, okay.

    Matters not anyway, as pro-Romney California votes were chaff in the fire, wasn't even close.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,685 Senior Member
    Well mine didn't go to Romney or Obama, either choice was not acceptable. If the Republicans cant field anything better than Romney we will repeat the cycle again.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • snake284-1snake284-1 Senior Member Posts: 2,500 Senior Member
    Well, I guess we cut off our nose to spite our face. This is brilliant, we would rather keep Obama to make a statement. Because if you Californians did this, I figure some in Ohio and Pennsylvania and some other battle ground states did it too. I know your vote didn't mean anything in California, but that same mindset in places like Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia, and Flordida Probably kept Obama in four more years.
    I'm Just a Radical Right Wing Nutt Job, Trying to Help Save My Country!
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,685 Senior Member
    Well there is know one to blame but the Republican party. Folks are tired of a crap sandwich on rye or a crap sandwich on wheat.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,383 Senior Member
    I know it might not be a popular idea, but if Obama was really as bad as folks said, the Republicans should have been able to beat him easily. Unless they ran an incompetent campaign.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Matters not anyway, as pro-Romney California votes were chaff in the fire, wasn't even close.

    This is the third time you've said ^this^ or similar. I know my handle starts with "Cali" but my location clearly says "ID".

    If you must know who I voted for, I wrote in my wife's name.
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • CaliFFLCaliFFL Senior Member Posts: 5,120 Senior Member
    snake284-1 wrote: »
    Well, I guess we cut off our nose to spite our face. This is brilliant, we would rather keep Obama to make a statement. Because if you Californians did this, I figure some in Ohio and Pennsylvania and some other battle ground states did it too. I know your vote didn't mean anything in California, but that same mindset in places like Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia, and Flordida Probably kept Obama in four more years.

    It is really simple. If you want me to vote for a candidate, the candidate must have more qualities than "he isn't the other guy". The way the election played out, I'm not alone.

    It is painfully clear that you and Sam would vote for ANYTHING that the GOP served up. Both of you are an embarassment to conservatism. You really should demand better.
    The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.

    Ayn Rand
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    snake284-1 wrote: »
    Well, I guess we cut off our nose to spite our face. This is brilliant, we would rather keep Obama to make a statement.


    I've never understood the whole "wasting a vote" argument. I'll NEVER vote against someone, sorry perhaps I'm just not smart enough. If someone is getting my vote, it's because I'd like to see them office, not because I don't want to see someone else in there.
  • ghostsniper1ghostsniper1 Banned Posts: 2,645 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    I've never understood the whole "wasting a vote" argument. I'll NEVER vote against someone, sorry perhaps I'm just not smart enough. If someone is getting my vote, it's because I'd like to see them office, not because I don't want to see someone else in there.
    My thoughts exactly.
  • snake284-1snake284-1 Senior Member Posts: 2,500 Senior Member
    My reasoning in voting for the lesser of the two evils, and I really didn't think Mitt R was evil, is that anybody on the Republican ticket would be better for the country and our rights than big O. Just my opinion.
    I'm Just a Radical Right Wing Nutt Job, Trying to Help Save My Country!
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