.45 in a .44

Armo

hopefully someone knows:
I have a Richland Arms .44 blackpowder Navy pistol, I purchased from Midway a .45 conversion cylinder that is supposed to fit, but need to know if I can safely fire a .45 Long Colt Cowboy round in the .44 pistol?
Will this increase the pressure?

Big Al1

:popcorn:This should be good!!

Big Chief

Only fire .45 Shorts...............:jester:

Armo

uh, by good do you mean I'm good to go, or good as in EXPLOSION !

Big Chief

Don't try it until you know it will be safe. A .45 Colt has a nominal bullet diameter of .451/.452 and higher for some guns. Your .44 BP revolver fires what diameter of a soft lead ball that is shaving a ring of lead as you seat the bullet. .44 caliber diameter is .429/.430 for modern centerfire revolvers.

Plenty of BP shooters on here will give you sound advice.

BTW, it's been almost 30 years since I owned a .44 BP revolver and I forgot what diameter lead balls I used.

Teach

This is a pretty common conversion. The ".44" cap & ball revolvers have a bore size that's almost .45, not the .429" bore of centerfire revolvers. Just be sure to use only low-pressure "cowboy loads", not full-house .45 Colt ammo. Definitely DO NOT use any hot .45 Colt handloads labeled for "Ruger only" revolvers in the reloading manuals. .45 Colt loads come in 3 distinct categries, "Peacemaker" loads for original Colt revolvers, "Midrange" loads for revolvers such as Smith & Wesson, Rossi, modern Colt double actions, etc., and "Geewhiz" loads intended only for Ruger revolvers and other very heavy-duty wheelguns. The C&B conversion cylinders need to use only the low-pressure loads.
Jerry

Armo

Wambli Ska wrote: »

Yep, Teach speaks the truth. Years ago I got two boxes with 1,000 cold swaged 230 gr soft lead bullets meant for .45 ACP and I loaded them in .45 Colt brass with a few grains of Unique for a softball load that was a hoot to shoot and very accurate. We tried it in my buddys conversion and it worked like a champ!!!

Now we're talkin! the only "Cowboy" rounds I could find are 250 grain soft lead Cowboy, but these are all expensive, $30 for a box of 50

mkk41

I wouldn't use it with any brass framed guns.

Armo

mkk41 wrote: »

I wouldn't use it with any brass framed guns.

this is a steel frame with brass backstrap, the .44 ball is .451 diameter.

NN

Good luck with it and 28-30 dollars is what it goes for.
I like Magtec because it does not do much leading.

Teach

Armo wrote: »

the only "Cowboy" rounds I could find are 250 grain soft lead Cowboy, but these are all expensive, $30 for a box of 50

Midway has a pretty good selection, with somewhat better prices, but .45 Colt is pricey. Good reason to reload for that one!

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/412949/fiocchi-cowboy-action-ammunition-45-colt-long-colt-250-grain-lead-round-nose-flat-point-box-of-50

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2900342954/winchester-super-x-ammunition-45-colt-long-colt-255-grain-lead-round-nose

Jerry

breamfisher

mkk41 wrote: »

I wouldn't use it with any brass framed guns.

I believe the manufacturer says not to do so. Or at least some makers of conversion cylinders say not to do it.

Razorbacker

Armo wrote: »

Now we're talkin! the only "Cowboy" rounds I could find are 250 grain soft lead Cowboy, but these are all expensive, $30 for a box of 50

Welcome to the new normal. With only a few exceptions store bought ammo is 'spensive. Even reloading the components are pricey. FYI, Obama voters don't get to complain about gun/ammo prices.

ilove22s

welcome,

dont know about your Richardson Arms, but some of the other BP clones you can do that. unless you know of the true bore diameter, i wouldnt do it. there are methods to measure your bore dia. too.

mkk41

Actually , the Colt and Remington revolvers were called .44 bore , because that is the actual bore diameter of the barrel. That is the size of the holes minor diameter. Then ya got the groove diameter to the bottom of the rifling , about .005 deep per side , .010 total. So ya got .440 bore + .010 rifling to give ya a .45 caliber. Most use a .451-.454 roundball.

Ruger always refered to their Old Army percussion revolver as a .45 caliber as it uses the same barrel as their .45 Colt Blackhawk and .457 roundballs.

Big Al1

I'm sorry, but there is now way I would invest $250 in, at best, a $150 import pistol from an unkown country, from a company that went out of business over 30 years ago, and then complain about the price of ammo!! From all I could find about that model, it is a brass frame. But, on the plus side, Midway is will accept unaltered returns!! Save your money and but a pistol built for .45 COLT!! But that's just me!!

mkk41

My first percussion revolver , bought shortly after the first time I saw the movie Outlaw Josey Wales , was a brass framed version of a Remington 1858. I actually distorted the frame trying to ram a ball on top of too much powder.

Armo

this happens to be a very fine example of Italian reproduction of the Colt Navy .44 , I am looking forward to shooting Cowboy bullets and not have to clean the gun from blackpowder fouling. the .44 balls are .451 diameter .
And I did NOT vote for B.O.

mkk41

Armo wrote: »

this happens to be a very fine example of Italian reproduction of the Colt Navy .44 , I am looking forward to shooting Cowboy bullets and not have to clean the gun from blackpowder fouling. the .44 balls are .451 diameter .
And I did NOT vote for B.O.

There was no Colt Navy in .44. The Colt Navy models of 1851 and 1861 were .36. The 1860 Army model was a .44.

There are many reproductions of blackpowder revolvers that never existed. Some of these are just conglomerations of various features.

The best replicas always have been made by A. Uberti , which is now owned by Beretta. Even the ones sold by Colt used Uberti parts.

Pietta's are OK.

Armo

yes, I stand corrected, looking at this piece again, Model 1860 ARMY .44 cal by Richland Arms, Italian.
Cylinder is engraved with a Navy battle "Engaged 16 May 1843 " , also Patent N
proof stamping PN

Teach

After a considerable amount of research, I haven't been able to find a Richardson revolver that's NOT brass-framed. If yours is brass around the trigger guard, hammer, cylinder mount, etc, DO NOT use that conversion cylinder. The open-top Colts were not as strong as the Remington revolvers, even in the iron-framed models, and a brass-frame open top would definitely be overloaded firing any type of .45 Colt ammo. The first-generation Colt cartridge guns were open-top designs, and they didn't last long at all before being replaced by the 1873 model.
Jerry

Armo

thank you, this is a Richland arms, not Richardson, it is an open top, but a steel frame with brass trigger guard , walnut grips with brass back strap, but it is steel frame.

Teach

OK, just concerned that you might be headed for some problems. The open-top Colts don't quite have as much strength in the barrel/cylinder area as the Remington style guns with the top strap, and even the brass-framed Remingtons aren't supposed to be used with cartridge conversions!
Jerry

mkk41

Info I'm finding say Richland went out of biz back in the late 80's.

Big Al1

This is probably a waste of time, but, I could not find a Colt .44 replica by Richland arms, but there are several Remington .44s.
Does it look like this??
This model was made in both steel and brass.

Armo

this one has a round barrel, and the frame and hammer is case hardened as well as the ejector.
Four screws on the side , walnut grips, looks very well made and shoots accuratly, works quite well.

Armo

Big Chief

Be safe and have fun, no guarantees from anyone on here.

mkk41

Armo , You may find this interesting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Army_Model_1860

Armo

mkk41 wrote: »

Armo , You may find this interesting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Army_Model_1860

yes, good write up, I also have a Sharps Carbine made in Italy, .54 cal lever/breech loaded carbine, I can roll my own, or just pour the bullet and powder directly into the breech, top it off with a large musket cap. Also fires .44 cal sabots.

mkk41

Yeah , I smoke on occasion too.