Home Main Category Second Amendment/Politics

Is there hope?

bruchibruchi Senior MemberPosts: 2,581 Senior Member
After the Virginia Tech killings all the usual suspects came out clamoring for a gun ban, etc., mass media ate all of this up but it did not happen. Stuff was hard to procure for a while but got back to normal after a spell.

I guess too many folks don't care for any ban and want their guns and for the government to stay away from their right in this area, this proven by huge skyrocketing of guns sales, in particular "assault rifles" and high capacity magazines, same as they did when Obama got elected first time, this enough then to scare those "in charge" that jobs/meal tickets rely on voters, in the heat of the moment they "played along" on the political correct scenario but no ban, no nothing came about.

Any chance of this repeating?
If this post is non welcomed, I can always give you a recipe for making "tostones".

Replies

  • BullgatorBullgator Member Posts: 393 Member
    That's pretty much the way I see it. We are going to give up something. Maybe it will just be a reinstatement of the 94 AWB along with an end to private sales without the background check. Hopefully we can avoid outright banning of existing guns and mags. That would be a nightmare, making law abiding gun owners into criminals while not impacting the criminal element at all.
  • wildgenewildgene Senior Member Posts: 1,036 Senior Member
    ...the "Real Problem" is the hysteria will be used to push thru some ambiguous, innocuous sounding legislation that lets the Fed "interpret" the law, instead of some sound, reasonable, tight legislation. You might want to look @ the UN World Heritage Sites & "Agenda 21" as a sample of how the liberal Presidents have "backdoored" regulations & the consequences of the US signing onto the UN Small Arms Treaty. Even w/ out Senate ratification, Slick Willy & Obama have managed to circumvent Congress, & implement UN strategies by the simple expedient of renaming them & calling them "agency directives"...
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    NO. There is no hope. Even if we weather this current storm, we're only 1 Supreme Court Justice away from crossing out the 2nd Amenrdment. The liberals only care about 2 things - power and money. Millions of flippant, disinterested Republicans and conservative Independents didn't even bother to vote in the last election - not even in the scant numbers that turned out for Senator McCain. Sign petitions all you want, call your Congressman and Senator, email the White house - none of it will matter. Because YOU DON"T VOTE AND THEY KNOW IT. They know that you'll conjur up any silly rationalization you can think of to not vote. Stupid stuff like religion, wealth, what he said or did in the past, anything that you can think off that will get you off the hook. We have a bunch of voters too stupid to realize that it's the PRIMARIES that are TACTICAL - that's where you vote for the best CANDIDATE, and the GENERAL elections that are STRATEGIC - that's where you vote for the PARTY that you want to control the agenda, set priorities and policies. In a general election, it's not the candidate that matters, it's the party platform. Period. If every registered Republican had cared enough to cut a few decent checks to pro-gun candidates, volunteered in their campaigns, and then turned out to vote for Romney and every GOP Senatorial candidate, we'd own the government, and we wouldn't be having this dreadful discussion. No fear, no apprehension, no anxiety. No product shortages, no price spikes. Instead, we have it all.

    Well, you asked for it, you got it, now live with it. I hate to say it, but I truly hope that any Republican or conservative Independent that didn't vote for Romney, and every GOP Senatorial candidate, or voted for some alternate reality 3rd party, or didn't vote at all, has a lot to lose, and loses it all. All his guns, his money, his freedom, whatever it takes to wake him the eff up. And he never ever sits out another election again - financially or behaviorally. From now on, He pays. He votes. And then maybe He wins.

    This rant is not meant for everybody here -I'm sure lots of members on this board contributed, worked, and voted for freedom. To you patriots, I thank you and apologize if you bothered to read this far. But I'm also sure there are those to whom this criticism is richly deserved, and I hope they choke on it. And NO, I don't want to hear their side of it.
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    This is my hope, but I'm not as optimistic as I was in Obama's first term. There seems to be a much stronger push this time given that this time it was "an evil high capacity bushmaster rifle" that was used rather than a simple 9mm glock 19 and 22lr. walther p22 which aren't nearly as scary looking. Add in the fact that this time it was small children and all logic gets thrown out the window. I have no doubt something is going to get passed. The best we can probably hope for is that it gets watered down enough in the political process to have only a minimal effect on law abiding gun owners. From all the chatter in the media I'd guess the primary targets are going to be private sales and high capacity magazines. That said it will still be hard to get anything too strong passed through the strong Republican majority in the house.

    Alphasig, you can't be worried. After all YOU told the rest of us that we were unnecessarily worried about a second term of your buddy Obama, and that there wouldn't be any further restrictions.... just like his first term. <sarcasm>

    Sorry bud, but while I respect you as a person I still think you are horribly deluded about the real liberal agenda and that you are now going to see just what sort of legislation he REALLY wants to enact. I just pray that you (and everybody else who voted for him) haven't screwed the rest of us over too bad.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • ThatMattGuyThatMattGuy Senior Member Posts: 666 Senior Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    Alphasig, you can't be worried. After all YOU told the rest of us that we were unnecessarily worried about a second term of your buddy Obama, and that there wouldn't be any further restrictions.... just like his first term. <sarcasm>

    Sorry bud, but while I respect you as a person I still think you are horribly deluded about the real liberal agenda and that you are now going to see just what sort of legislation he REALLY wants to enact. I just pray that you (and everybody else who voted for him) haven't screwed the rest of us over too bad.

    Luis

    X 1 million!!!!
    The poster formerly known as '69MercCougar
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,798 Senior Member
    Until the American people and our politicians realize that "doing something" is not always or even usually better than doing nothing we're going to be stuck with stupid knee jerk reactions to extreme, but rare events.

    That's really very funny, coming from a guy who supports a political party that can only win elections by keeping the groups funded that are known for 'stupid knee jerk reactions to extreme, but rare events.'
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,249 Senior Member
    It's not like the other party didn't bring us DHS, TSA, the Patriot Act etc. Right now there are plenty of Republicans out there (including the NRA) trying to use this tragedy to attack and restrict video games. Yeah I vote for Turd Sandwich, but don't pretend like your Giant Douche smells so sweet. This is absolutely a bipartisan problem.

    http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/154582/debate-2004

    That clip would really be funny if it weren't so true.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    I still believe that without this event there wouldn't have been, but I clearly underestimated the risk of something like this. The problem is that so much in this country is emotionally driven by overreactions to high impact, low frequency events. Without the massacre of 20 young children by an evil black rifle there would be no political will or capital to make something happen, but now the public, even lots of gun owners are jumping on the Banwagon. My inlaws who both vote Republican and are generally pro 2A started talking at dinner on Christmas about how no one need to own an "assault rifle" or have 30 round "clips". Political winds shift with public opinion. A month ago, no politician in Washington (except for a very few extreme liberals from safe districts) would even consider bringing up the subject of gun control for fear of being run out of office their next election. Now they're all afraid of not "doing something" to prevent another Sandy Hook as that is what the public at large is demanding (even if different people are demanding different things). Until the American people and our politicians realize that "doing something" is not always or even usually better than doing nothing we're going to be stuck with stupid knee jerk reactions to extreme, but rare events.

    Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

    THIS is why you don't vote anti-gun politicians into office for ANY reason. EVER. <sigh>

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,670 Senior Member
    ..............A month ago, no politician in Washington (except for a very few extreme liberals from safe districts) would even consider bringing up the subject of gun control for fear of being run out of office their next election............
    ALL the gun-grabbers were hoping, wishing, wanting and praying (except the godless ones) for an incident like this to happen, so they could use it for the nail in the coffin on the big bad "assault weapons."

    :vomit:
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • AntonioAntonio Senior Member Posts: 2,690 Senior Member
    That's true. The topic is also drawing public attention from the budget crisis that is apparently about to explode.

    Regarding the original question, from a guy living in a perpetual "evil assault rifle" ban to all of you living in what used to be a shooter's paradise: Sadly, no.

    Only hope is a future Republican administration with the will and political power to overturn any measure about to be implemented....maybe they can use this topic as a bargain chip to deal against the budget issue and reinstate the not-so-harsh original AWB, but who knows?
  • stepmacstepmac Member Posts: 172 Member
    IMHO Nothing is going to improve in anyway whatsoever under this second term of Obama's. The man is a tyrant and not only inept but also incompetent. We may benefit from a few of his failures, but in general we are all going to be screwed blue.
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Hard to say, bruchi, what will come of this.

    I was watching ABC network news tonight (they're the least insane of the 3 established networks) and was very surprised to see a non-accusatory story on concealed carry classes for teachers that are springing up across much of the country. If ABC even bothered to report it, and report it without snarky comments, it means something. It means that there is a substantial proportion of the people who think this may actually be a good idea.

    If the network news (not Fox) gives a fair report on such a trend, that will in itself spark other pro-gun people across the country doing the same thing. We all know this for a fact: had even one of those poor teachers at that school been armed and even halfway trained in self-defense, there's a good chance that idiot killer would have been stopped. As LaPierre said, the only way to stop a bad armed guy is with a good armed guy.

    If the NRA keeps up its message, and does so carefully and with aplomb (which they seem to be doing), the message may sink in a bit, and help deter the anti-gun clamor for "AW" bans. We as ordinary citizens need to chat with our friends if the topic comes up -- not at the range or here -- we're on the same page here -- but in a club, or with friends otherwise, should the topic arise, to clearly define what a real assault weapon is, that they are mostly outlawed anyway, and that even "sort-of" assault weapons were already outlawed where the shooting happened. That what most folks consider an "assault weapon" is simply a repeating rifle.

    With the financial crisis looming, and which will probably grow immensely into yet another recession or worse this spring, I don't think the government will have time to meddle in gun laws very much. Lots of smoke, not much action. At least I hope so.

    We've got to do our part, speak out (sensibly and gently) to teach our friends that 1) AW bans don't work, 2) gun-free zones are merely an invitation for the criminal, 3) strong enforcement of lawbreaking that puts offenders in prison for years does work, even at minimum for that one thug. And 4) armed self defense is not only a right, but is becoming a necessity.

    Just last night, a Houston homeowner was surprised by a thug breaking into his house. Not however surprised too much, because he shot and killed the intruder. Chalk up another for the good guys.
  • stepmacstepmac Member Posts: 172 Member
    It's not like the other party didn't bring us DHS, TSA, the Patriot Act etc. Right now there are plenty of Republicans out there (including the NRA) trying to use this tragedy to attack and restrict video games. Yeah I vote for Turd Sandwich, but don't pretend like your Giant Douche smells so sweet. This is absolutely a bipartisan problem.

    http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/154582/debate-2004

    This man speaks like a Democrat.
  • stepmacstepmac Member Posts: 172 Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Hard to say, bruchi, what will come of this.

    Just last night, a Houston homeowner was surprised by a thug breaking into his house. Not however surprised too much, because he shot and killed the intruder. Chalk up another for the good guys.

    I read that situations like this happen about 40,000 times a year, usually without the death of the perp.
  • stepmacstepmac Member Posts: 172 Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

    THIS is why you don't vote anti-gun politicians into office for ANY reason. EVER. <sigh>

    Luis
    Yep, and if you happen to find yourself about the pull the handle to vote for a Democrat, stop and cut off your arm.
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    stepmac wrote: »
    Yep, and if you happen to find yourself about the pull the handle to vote for a Democrat, stop and cut off your arm.

    I wouldn't go quite that far. There are a FEW pro-gun democrats out there. Just like there are a few anti-gun republicans out there. You are right 90% of the time though.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • bruchibruchi Senior Member Posts: 2,581 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Hard to say, bruchi, what will come of this.

    I was watching ABC network news tonight (they're the least insane of the 3 established networks) and was very surprised to see a non-accusatory story on concealed carry classes for teachers that are springing up across much of the country. If ABC even bothered to report it, and report it without snarky comments, it means something. It means that there is a substantial proportion of the people who think this may actually be a good idea.

    If the network news (not Fox) gives a fair report on such a trend, that will in itself spark other pro-gun people across the country doing the same thing. We all know this for a fact: had even one of those poor teachers at that school been armed and even halfway trained in self-defense, there's a good chance that idiot killer would have been stopped. As LaPierre said, the only way to stop a bad armed guy is with a good armed guy.

    If the NRA keeps up its message, and does so carefully and with aplomb (which they seem to be doing), the message may sink in a bit, and help deter the anti-gun clamor for "AW" bans. We as ordinary citizens need to chat with our friends if the topic comes up -- not at the range or here -- we're on the same page here -- but in a club, or with friends otherwise, should the topic arise, to clearly define what a real assault weapon is, that they are mostly outlawed anyway, and that even "sort-of" assault weapons were already outlawed where the shooting happened. That what most folks consider an "assault weapon" is simply a repeating rifle.

    With the financial crisis looming, and which will probably grow immensely into yet another recession or worse this spring, I don't think the government will have time to meddle in gun laws very much. Lots of smoke, not much action. At least I hope so.

    We've got to do our part, speak out (sensibly and gently) to teach our friends that 1) AW bans don't work, 2) gun-free zones are merely an invitation for the criminal, 3) strong enforcement of lawbreaking that puts offenders in prison for years does work, even at minimum for that one thug. And 4) armed self defense is not only a right, but is becoming a necessity.

    Just last night, a Houston homeowner was surprised by a thug breaking into his house. Not however surprised too much, because he shot and killed the intruder. Chalk up another for the good guys.

    + infinity!

    We have to educate those that are not on the same page as we are regarding this theme.
    If this post is non welcomed, I can always give you a recipe for making "tostones".
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    This is important, bruchi, as we both agree. We can post to our hearts' content here or chat among our pro-gun pals, and we'll entertain ourselves and perhaps pat ourselves on the back, but achieve nothing, since we're preaching to the choir.

    And nobody likes a self-opinionated loudmouth. So when we're in "mixed" company (ha ha, non-gun and pro-gun), we need to present our views rationally, sensibly, not with bluster and pomp, but like: "But you see, Bill, the term 'assault weapon' is misused. They want you to think it's a full auto military weapon, but..." and so on.

    Carefully, treading carefully, building a case with a smiling, congenial visage, not with thunder. Make reasonable arguments based on truth. Be willing to concede temporary points to those who are totally ignorant of guns -- realize, these folks think that guns go off by themselves and such! Phrase your arguments personally: "So your wife and kids are home one night, you're out of town, and some thug breaks in. What would you have them do?" and so on.

    If each of us can convert even one or two people, maybe not get them to join the militia and wear camos (ha ha), no, joking -- but if we can simply get them to take a reasonable, balanced attitude toward the gun law clamor, to ask sensible questions, to see that yes, some gun control laws are good (enforcing laws against felons or other undesirables having guns, etc) but letting law abiding citizens to own guns. etc etc keep the conversations simple and never get preachy, just cool headed. But if each of us converts one other, even to the point where that other person is asking sharp questions of the anti-gun law people, we're making progress.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Nothing rocks a politicians will as much as a stack of mail against his pet cause because it usually spells unemployment!!!

    Unfortunately, the ones who are screaming the loudest know they have a solid liberal base that will keep sending them back to Washington, no matter how ridiculous they get. The ones trying to straddle the fence might he swayed by public opinion, maybe, but for the most part nothing short of old age is going to stop idiots like Schumer, Feinstein, Reed, Bloomberg, etc. We're not quite ready to swap the ballot box for the bullet box. Close, but not anytime soon!
    Jerry
  • bruchibruchi Senior Member Posts: 2,581 Senior Member
    Last year a very gun friendly new "gun law" was proposed here in Puerto Rico, no registration, same day $20 CCW you got at the department of transportation, no red tape for reloading components, even full auto, suppressors with no stamp!

    It actually was approved by the senate the suppressors did not made it, everything else did, it did not get to the representatives on time, we are trying again next year once the new government gets in place which seems is not in our favor as much as the prior.

    We have a local gun forum and what was done by it's members was to post lists with both physical and email addresses of all in government that where against the new law and for those in favor as well so we could send corresponding letters and messages to all of them.

    I am sure that this aided our cause a lot. Also why just limit us to send letters to YOUR congressman/representative, send to all of them regardless!
    If this post is non welcomed, I can always give you a recipe for making "tostones".
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