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Big Chief
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Family’s Home Raided over Facebook Photo of Child’s Rifle
Big Chief
Senior MemberPosts: 32,995 Senior Member
http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/familys-home-raided-over-facebook-photo-of-childs-rifle.html
By Todd Starnes
"New Jersey police and Dept. of Children and Families officials raided the home of a firearms instructor and demanded to see his guns after he posted a Facebook photo of his 11-year-old son holding a rifle.
FOLLOW TODD ON FACEBOOK FOR CULTURE WAR NEWS. CLICK HERE TO JOIN!
“Someone called family services about the photo,” said Evan Nappen, an attorney representing Shawn Moore. “It led to an incredible, heavy-handed raid on his house. They wanted to see his gun safe, his guns and search his house. They even threatened to take his kids.”
Moore was not arrested or charged.
This is the Facebook photo that led to the police raid.
This is the Facebook photo that led to the police raid.
A Dept. of Children and Families spokesperson told Fox News they could not confirm or deny an investigation or raid had taken place due to government regulations.
“The department has a child abuse hotline for the state of New Jersey and anybody can make a call to that hotline,” spokesperson Kristen Brown said. “We are required to follow up on every single allegation that comes into the central registry.”
Moore, of Carneys Point, is a certified firearms instructor for the National Rifle Association, an NRA range safety officer and a New Jersey hunter education instructor.
He recently posted a photograph of his son wearing camouflage and holding his new .22 rifle. The child has a New Jersey hunting license and recently passed the state’s hunter safety course.
“If you look at the picture, his finger isn’t even on the trigger – which is proper,” Nappen told Fox News. “If half of Hollywood could follow that rule we’d be thankful.”
Brown said their role is not to go out and search Facebook for photos of children holding weapons.
“In general our role is to investigate allegations of child abuse and neglect,” she said.
The family’s trouble started Saturday night when Moore received an urgent text message from his wife. The Carneys Point Police Dept. and the New Jersey Dept. of Children and Families had raided their home.
Moore immediately called Nappen and rushed home to find officers demanding to check his guns and his gun safe.
Instead, he handed the cell phone to one of the officers – so they could speak with Nappen.
“If you have a warrant, you’re coming in,” Nappen told the officers. “If you don’t, then you’re not. That’s what privacy is all about.”
With his attorney on speaker phone, Moore instructed the officers to leave his home.
“I was told I was being unreasonable and that I was acting suspicious because I wouldn’t open my safe,” Moore wrote on the Delaware Open Carry website. “They told me they were going to get a search warrant. I told them to go ahead.”
Moore took this photo of police outside his home.
Moore took this photo of police outside his home.
Nappen told Fox News the police wanted to inventory his firearms.
“”We said no way, it’s not happening,” he said. “This is a guy who is completely credentialed and his son is also credentialed.”
The attorney said police eventually left and never returned.
“He has a Fourth Amendment right and he’s not going to give up his Fourth Amendment right or his Second Amendment right,” he said. “They didn’t have a warrant – so see you later.”
Brown told Fox News that it’s “prudent and wise to protect children.”
“In many cases we may follow up on something and we don’t find any problems and the case is closed,” she said.
But the person who reported the false allegations of abuse cannot be held liable, she noted.
“You can’t be prosecuted for making an allegation of child abuse –even if it’s false,” she said.
Nappen said what happened to the Moore family should serve as a warning to gun owners across the nation.
“To make someone go through this because he posted a picture of his son with a .22 rifle on his Facebook page is pretty outrageous,” he said. “Does that mean that anyone who posts a picture like that has to consent to a home inspection and a gun inspection? I don’t think so.”
Nappen said they are considering taking legal action against the state FOR the late night raid."
By Todd Starnes
By Todd Starnes
"New Jersey police and Dept. of Children and Families officials raided the home of a firearms instructor and demanded to see his guns after he posted a Facebook photo of his 11-year-old son holding a rifle.
FOLLOW TODD ON FACEBOOK FOR CULTURE WAR NEWS. CLICK HERE TO JOIN!
“Someone called family services about the photo,” said Evan Nappen, an attorney representing Shawn Moore. “It led to an incredible, heavy-handed raid on his house. They wanted to see his gun safe, his guns and search his house. They even threatened to take his kids.”
Moore was not arrested or charged.
This is the Facebook photo that led to the police raid.
This is the Facebook photo that led to the police raid.
A Dept. of Children and Families spokesperson told Fox News they could not confirm or deny an investigation or raid had taken place due to government regulations.
“The department has a child abuse hotline for the state of New Jersey and anybody can make a call to that hotline,” spokesperson Kristen Brown said. “We are required to follow up on every single allegation that comes into the central registry.”
Moore, of Carneys Point, is a certified firearms instructor for the National Rifle Association, an NRA range safety officer and a New Jersey hunter education instructor.
He recently posted a photograph of his son wearing camouflage and holding his new .22 rifle. The child has a New Jersey hunting license and recently passed the state’s hunter safety course.
“If you look at the picture, his finger isn’t even on the trigger – which is proper,” Nappen told Fox News. “If half of Hollywood could follow that rule we’d be thankful.”
Brown said their role is not to go out and search Facebook for photos of children holding weapons.
“In general our role is to investigate allegations of child abuse and neglect,” she said.
The family’s trouble started Saturday night when Moore received an urgent text message from his wife. The Carneys Point Police Dept. and the New Jersey Dept. of Children and Families had raided their home.
Moore immediately called Nappen and rushed home to find officers demanding to check his guns and his gun safe.
Instead, he handed the cell phone to one of the officers – so they could speak with Nappen.
“If you have a warrant, you’re coming in,” Nappen told the officers. “If you don’t, then you’re not. That’s what privacy is all about.”
With his attorney on speaker phone, Moore instructed the officers to leave his home.
“I was told I was being unreasonable and that I was acting suspicious because I wouldn’t open my safe,” Moore wrote on the Delaware Open Carry website. “They told me they were going to get a search warrant. I told them to go ahead.”
Moore took this photo of police outside his home.
Moore took this photo of police outside his home.
Nappen told Fox News the police wanted to inventory his firearms.
“”We said no way, it’s not happening,” he said. “This is a guy who is completely credentialed and his son is also credentialed.”
The attorney said police eventually left and never returned.
“He has a Fourth Amendment right and he’s not going to give up his Fourth Amendment right or his Second Amendment right,” he said. “They didn’t have a warrant – so see you later.”
Brown told Fox News that it’s “prudent and wise to protect children.”
“In many cases we may follow up on something and we don’t find any problems and the case is closed,” she said.
But the person who reported the false allegations of abuse cannot be held liable, she noted.
“You can’t be prosecuted for making an allegation of child abuse –even if it’s false,” she said.
Nappen said what happened to the Moore family should serve as a warning to gun owners across the nation.
“To make someone go through this because he posted a picture of his son with a .22 rifle on his Facebook page is pretty outrageous,” he said. “Does that mean that anyone who posts a picture like that has to consent to a home inspection and a gun inspection? I don’t think so.”
Nappen said they are considering taking legal action against the state FOR the late night raid."
By Todd Starnes
It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
Replies
The requirement is that they follow up. The above is a major major over reaction that needs to be addressed which is hard since the government is always right. From the book the correct action would have been a phone call stating that someone had reported this and a follow up is required by law. This is what was reported and based on the reliability of the person it closed at that point. Call, check the above credentials, done. All two phone calls.
Let that be a lesson to everyone. If Johnny Law comes knocking and demands to see your stuff (firearms or otherwise), no warrant = no-go.
Our freedom is not derived from their authority, their authority is derived from our consent.
"Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
Why is this an exception? If you lie about any other crime, that in itself is a crime!
Adam J. McCleod
The person reporting the alleged child abuse isn't prosecuted, I suppose, to keep people informing on others in what they perceive is a crime. If the allegations prove false and the person making them is prosecuted, people would be less likely to report crimes. Kind of like it is now in a lot of places where no one trusts the police.
― Douglas Adams
Just remember that for future reference. It could be an interesting tool if it ever comes down to being a 'resistance'.
-Mikhail Kalashnikov
Been on the stinky end of this stick.
As the accused, you have no right to know your accuser, and they are immune from prosecution as is CPS. As the accused, even after the CPS pukes find nothing, you are still on probation (not called that but it is what it is) until the CPS puke decides that you are not. Its how govt. drones justify their existance and why I won't pee on a CPS puke if they are on fire.
Things done wrong, where do you start. A phone call, fax the credentials, closed. No more. A person with a father like that is going to proudly show off his new hunting license. It is still part of society regardless of what is wanted by some. The push should be to get higher powers on line and push down.
The fact is that any one who has a grudge can report you and it must be investigated. With a guilty until proven otherwise attitude. So the rules do need to provide protection for those reporting, but penalties if falsely reported.
Wake me up when something really outrageous happens.
Armed jack booted storm troopers demanding access to your safe is not outrageous to you?
And furthermore this talk of how the father and son were "credentialed" should somehow make a difference sickens me.
What I find more disturbing (and I think more people should, too) is that some nosy busy-body can call in such things as "endangering" a child.
No more than them demanding to search my car. They were denied access. The man's rights remained intact. Cops left, didn't return. When they push into his home and search ANYway, let me know.
In hindsight, I hope the father remembers that every idiot has an internet connection, and keeps his photos private. What bothers me most is the limp wristed basement dweller that called CPS in the beginning, and will suffer no repercussions.
When the Dad got home they were already in the house. He was told he was acting suspiciously for not opening his safe so they could inventory his guns. They didn't request anything of his wife. They intimidated her for entry to the home.
This guy, like Buffy, thought hey, I'm a white guy, i pay my taxes, I nod hello to the sheriff when I go into the cafe for lunch. Things like this don't happen to people like me.
Well, they do.
'
Like Varmintmist, I've seen the ugly side of child molestation charges. Not me, but distant family. Tore the family apart, and the charge was leveled by a vindictive, bitter person.
I didn't believe it and still don't. Didn't matter. He suffered. No prison, but who cares. The accusation and subsequent social stigmatization was punishment enough
This^
Frankly, a quick look at the 'offending' picture on Facebook would have shown nothing more than a happy boy proudly displaying his gift. A follow-up phone call to the family in question and the state's DNR (or whatever it's called there) would have revealed that they are indeed both 'credentialed' and we wouldn't be hearing about this at all.
However, the fact that some body (not what I want to say) actually felt the need to drop a dime like that....
Just remember folks, they were just doing their jobs.:roll:
George Carlin
CPS is a . That's the boogey man.
I guess the auto-censor got you or something, yes CPS can be unfair but they ain't the only ones.
Recently we had a case Where an LRPD lieutenant, working off duty but in uniform at a trendy pub not far from where I live had a guy come in and sit down, expecting to be served. The cop told him the place was closed for a private party and he had to leave. So the guy left but wanted to know who had requested he leave,(this is court testimony), Anyway, long story/short, the cop slams the guy face first into a brink wall, a few elbows to the face later and it's a cuffed body slam to the sidewalk. The charge? Trespassing, on a public sidewalk.
But someone had their phone cam on. Turns out this 30 year vet's personnel jacket was full of claims of abuse, Adjudication, 2 days off with pay. This time it was 30 days no pay, Now, The civil suit is pending, and he beat the hell out of this guy.
You beat the hell outta someone and see how different things are for the lowly citizen. And i guarantee you he won't be stripped of his gun ownership rights.
Now picture yourself as a black teen pulled over by this guy for failing to signal a lane change or some crap. If someone didn't think to turn on their phone, This guy could get away with murder.
Maybe, but it's for the kids! It will all be worth it if they can save just one life.....
George Carlin
This.
Nothing wrong with the world..........its the smarmy 'poke your nose into other peoples business' 'do as I say and not as I do' intolerant bigoted wankers that try to make an imperfect society perfect with their slanted ideas of whats right or wrong.
In the past, a pic of a kid with his new/first gun would have been something to be celebrated and would draw congratulations. I wonder how the kid feels about what happened when someone decided to rain on his parade........
Because, the libtards say it is a crime and we all know that they're always right, RIGHT?
They should have to have good reason to go through with a search. Not just some jackwagon calling in. And besides, half these child abuse accusations are BS too. Nowdays you can get arrested for disciplining your own kids. Yeah sure there's a line between discipline and child abuse, but it's wider than they treat it now days. I went to school with a distant cousin whose dad was a real child abuser. Nowdays he'd probably get life in the penitentary (Well he would deserve it), but everybody knew what was going on and it was just hard to make the charge stick back in the 50s. He showed my mother and me his legs once where his insane dad beat him with a garden hose. But that's so much different than posting a pic of your kid with his own 22 rifle. How the hell is THAT child abuse? If these LEOs would have had the common sense God gave a goose, this would never have been an issue.
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
The democrats use social media with exceptional skill to market their candidates. Even the RNC has groaned about being behind the curve in technology regarding campaigning. Social media is what the youth of America are about.
We can reject social media because it's "creepy" and lose the youth vote or we can use it responsibly to further our cause.
Adam J. McCleod