Shotgun opinion for home defense

2»

Replies

  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    Choosing between the Mossberg 590 and the Remington 870 is a no-brainer - the obvious decision for home defense is to buy a...Remington 1100. Autoloaders are just as reliable as pumps, simpler to operate simply because they operate themselves, and if you want to add a red dot or reflex sight, or a tactical flashlight, the much reduced recoil will be appreciated. The 1100 shares the 870's and 590's versatility with after-market stocks, rails, barrels, magazine tubes, side saddles, and/or whatever else tickles your fancy.

    Of course, if money is less of an object, the ultimate defense shotgun is the Saiga 12. The Kalashnikov action is unsurpassed for reliability, and with an available 20 round drum magazine this becomes a most formidable weapon, providing overwhelming firepower for any foreseeable scenario.
  • Jack BurtonJack Burton Member Posts: 379 Member
    Zee wrote: »
    Either will do ya.

    Just remember bet to use bird shot. Less chance of over penetration and negates the need to aim. It's a shotgun after all. Besides, at HD distances, the load of 7 1/2 bird shot will likely cut your perpetrator in half.

    Last gem of information, leave the chamber empty. Racking the slide of the shotgun when the evil doer is in your home is the most effecient way to avoid a confrontation. The noise alone will scare the snot out of them and they'll run away in fear. You won't wven have to get out of bed.

    I am, respectfully, not in agreement with either of these options.

    Bird shot will hurt like an SOB, no doubt about it, and it may be persuasive enough on that score alone. However, if I were to employ a shotgun for home defense I want it to be persuasive well into the third dimension first and foremost. Over penetration is of course a concern in the confines of your home, but not at the expense of utter ineffectiveness.

    A loaded chamber still gives the option for the persuasive pump if you so wish, while still retaining the ever more persuasive bang with little sound or movement required.

    Personally I'd only consider a shotgun for use while inside a safe-room/hold-up defensive type place where I know (or can even prepare) the backstops beyond the entrance ways, allowing me to load much more effective ammo like full buck or even 00.
    Came for the fishing, stayed for the guns.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,780 Senior Member
    I am, respectfully, not in agreement with either of these options.

    Bird shot will hurt like an SOB, no doubt about it, and it may be persuasive enough on that score alone. However, if I were to employ a shotgun for home defense I want it to be persuasive well into the third dimension first and foremost. Over penetration is of course a concern in the confines of your home, but not at the expense of utter ineffectiveness.

    A loaded chamber still gives the option for the persuasive pump if you so wish, while still retaining the ever more persuasive bang with little sound or movement required.

    Personally I'd only consider a shotgun for use while inside a safe-room/hold-up defensive type place where I know (or can even prepare) the backstops beyond the entrance ways, allowing me to load much more effective ammo like full buck or even 00.

    How dare you disagree with my opinion!!! You're gonna hurt my feelings and I'll have to pout and be upset. Now you done it!!!

    In reality, I was playing around. If you notice my second post in this thread, "Did I cover all of them?"

    I was referring to all the usual **** answers we hear around here. You will notice, reading further down, that several of the other members understood the irony of my post. And again, further down still you will see where I posted, "In all seriousness, they will both work well for you.

    I prefer the 870 and have beat one of mine pretty well with no issue. I run slugs in mine."


    So, my original post was a joke.

    I don't believe or follow any of the theories in my first post.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Jack BurtonJack Burton Member Posts: 379 Member
    Zee wrote: »
    How dare you disagree with my opinion!!! You're gonna hurt my feelings and I'll have to pout and be upset. Now you done it!!!

    In reality, I was playing around. If you notice my second post in this thread, "Did I cover all of them?"

    I was referring to all the usual **** answers we hear around here. You will notice, reading further down, that several of the other members understood the irony of my post. And again, further down still you will see where I posted, "In all seriousness, they will both work well for you.

    I prefer the 870 and have beat one of mine pretty well with no issue. I run slugs in mine."


    So, my original post was a joke.

    I don't believe or follow any of the theories in my first post.

    So, wait, the .410 is NOT superior? Now had you started off with "Taurus" I'da known a joke was coming forthwith.
    Came for the fishing, stayed for the guns.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,780 Senior Member
    So, wait, the .410 is NOT superior?

    Well........OK.......that one is true. The .410 is vastly superior to the 12ga. in HD.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • bobbyrlf3bobbyrlf3 Senior Member Posts: 2,467 Senior Member
    I think that in this day and age, it is critical that your model be tactical. And it should have plenty of rails to attach more tactical accessories to. Absolutely critical, that.
    Knowledge is essential to living freely and fully; understanding gives knowledge purpose and strength; wisdom is combining the two and applying them appropriately in words and actions.
  • Jack BurtonJack Burton Member Posts: 379 Member
    :silly:
    Came for the fishing, stayed for the guns.
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 7,099 Senior Member
    horselips wrote: »
    Of course, if money is less of an object, the ultimate defense shotgun is the Saiga 12. The Kalashnikov action is unsurpassed for reliability, and with an available 20 round drum magazine this becomes a most formidable weapon, providing overwhelming firepower for any foreseeable scenario.

    Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the triumphant return of Gecko45.:jester:
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the triumphant return of Gecko45.:jester:

    ?
  • LinefinderLinefinder Moderator Posts: 4,692 Senior Member
    Zee wrote: »



    Last gem of information, leave the chamber empty. Racking the slide of the shotgun when the evil doer is in your home is the most effecient way to avoid a confrontation. The noise alone will scare the snot out of them and they'll run away in fear. You won't wven have to get out of bed.

    And don't forget to fire your first shot into the air. Or your ceiling. Which, if you live in a downstairs apartment, could be your neighbors floor. It'll be okay. Uncle Joe said so.

    Mike
    "Walking away seems to be a lost art form."
    N454casull
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Just be sure the Saiga has the "Red Jackazz" logo laser-engraved on it- - - - -only costs an extra $2K for that little improvement!
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,246 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Just be sure the Saiga has the "Red Jackazz" logo laser-engraved on it- - - - -only costs an extra $2K for that little improvement!
    Jerry

    They're not just tactical, they are SUPER tactical.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    Got the Elzetta delivered today, and don't like the looks of it while still in the package.......kind of bulky and sticks out too far, and not square in-between the barrel and mag tube, I want this certain flashlight mount to reduce bulk projection for using the scabbard. This unit is not it, I'm disappointed. I want a barrel/mag connector with a low profile rail in-between the two.....and a separate flashlight mount that attaches to that mount........for crying out loud, when can send men to the moon and elect an idiot for President twice......but gun parts manufacturers have never thought of this........what the hell is wrong with America......where's the inventive spirit? Eff it, I'm gonna PM Teach after I try this thing out.......I know what I want makes sense, and will find a sensible nut to make one, unless CPJ wants a go at it.
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • LerchessLerchess Senior Member Posts: 550 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    I thought I was supposed to fire a blast of bird shot though my door?!?!?!

    Or off the balcony. Ya know, cause all of us who don't have 24/7 Secret Service protection have balconies...
  • tv_racin_fantv_racin_fan Senior Member Posts: 617 Senior Member
    Got the Elzetta delivered today, and don't like the looks of it while still in the package.......kind of bulky and sticks out too far, and not square in-between the barrel and mag tube, I want this certain flashlight mount to reduce bulk projection for using the scabbard. This unit is not it, I'm disappointed. I want a barrel/mag connector with a low profile rail in-between the two.....and a separate flashlight mount that attaches to that mount........for crying out loud, when can send men to the moon and elect an idiot for President twice......but gun parts manufacturers have never thought of this........what the hell is wrong with America......where's the inventive spirit? Eff it, I'm gonna PM Teach after I try this thing out.......I know what I want makes sense, and will find a sensible nut to make one, unless CPJ wants a go at it.

    It is rather bulky. I got two delivered today.

    On another note I ordered these from Primary Arms. Placed the order on the 6th before 7am and it was shipped by noon on the 6th and on my table on the 8th with FREE SHIPPING. I like that sort of service.

    Now to find a decent flashlight, since the one I have doesn't seem to fit.
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    Will give an update this weekend when I put the 6P in it.
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
  • Fat BillyFat Billy Senior Member Posts: 1,813 Senior Member
    I keep my Mossberg in the closet with 4 rounds in the magazine and the hammer down on an empty chamber. This is the safest way to store the gun. Kick my door and you will assume room temperature quickly. I will shoot and kill no problem. Think of this, The well known sound could prevent you from untold paperwork, Replacing bloody carpet, Having your pump gun held as evidence, hiring a lawyer to defend you from legal action from a lawful act. Kick my door and start the room temperature assumption. Grab my door knob and try to get in, the sound may prevent above listed negatives. Don't care? It's your nose PICK IT! It's my door KICK IT! :guns: Later,
    Fat Billy

    Recoil is how you know primer ignition is complete.
  • KSU FirefighterKSU Firefighter Senior Member Posts: 3,246 Senior Member
    The sound of the safety flicking off is warning enough. 00 followed by a slug Winchester 1300.
    The fire service needs a "culture of extinguishment not safety" Ray McCormack FDNY
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 15,213 Senior Member
    Around here they get to hear the awe-inspiring, pants pooping sound of a pump action being racked AFTER the first round goes downrange...I can't believe that this bit of gun shop mythology is still around...or that people still believe it...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,780 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    I can't believe that this bit of gun shop mythology is still around...or that people still believe it...

    Consider the source.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Diver43Diver43 Senior Member Posts: 8,751 Senior Member
    Jayhawker wrote: »
    Around here they get to hear the awe-inspiring, pants pooping sound of a pump action being racked AFTER the first round goes downrange...I can't believe that this bit of gun shop mythology is still around...or that people still believe it...

    During the little amount of post military training that I have had, the first thing said was racking the slide of a pump shotgun does not scare away those meaning to do you harm. It only gives the bad guy a direction to point his gun towards.
    Logistics cannot win a war, but its absence or inadequacy can cause defeat. FM100-5
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Check out Mossberg 590A1 part number 51273. This is the Marinecoat (matte nickel plate) version with the simple bead sight, and has the five shot mag and 18" barrel. This pretty much reduces any rust concerns to the inside of the barrel.

    The main difference between the 590 and the 500 is that the front of the 500's magazine is solid and the 590's is closed off by a removable spring clip (same as the 870). You can easily remove the spring and follower to punch out the inside of a 590's magazine with a rod, brush, swab, etc... (remarkable how much crap can get inside there), whereas on the 500 you'll have to unscrew and remove the mag tube to do it right.

    I've got a Mossberg Mariner, the short version with 18 1/2" bbl. It's a 5 shot or six if you keep one in the chamber. It came with a pistol-grip kit, which I tried once with 3" magnums buckshot/4X6 Duplex loads...and even after 25 rounds of bird-shot NOPE, back to synthetic stock.

    I don't shoot it enough to really give a good comparison, but I DO trust it to throw lead when/if I ever need it to.

    There is a lot of Hollywood movie/TV baloney scenes about shotguns and it makes good theatrics to have actors rack the slide for that effect OVER and OVER again.

    However, I will be in the minority here. I think the sound of a pump shotgun being cycled does have some effect as a deterrent, to a small degree and very much depending on who hears it. I wouldn't depend on it, though.

    I and most of you on here will instantly know that sound, criminals...maybe or maybe not. I know what the bolt of an M-16 being charged/released sound like and that will get my attention real quick.

    I will repeat what a man said on 60 minutes some years ago. A South Afrikaner farmer being interviewed by 60 Minutes said when the natives were getting restless/ instigating an uprising around his place many changed their minds real quick with what he called a 'Universal Language' he then picked up his pump shotgun and racked the slide saying that changed many of their minds.

    Take that with a grain of salt, but it worked for him in some circumstances. He never did say how many it didn't work on and he had to shoot????

    Again, I wouldn't depend on it, but wouldn't completely count it out because Hollywood makes so much of it for entertainment.
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • jbp-ohiojbp-ohio Senior Member Posts: 9,599 Senior Member
    Big Chief wrote: »
    I've got a Mossberg Mariner, the short version with 18 1/2" bbl. It's a 5 shot or six if you keep one in the chamber. It came with a pistol-grip kit, which I tried once with 3" magnums buckshot/4X6 Duplex loads...and even after 25 rounds of bird-shot NOPE, back to synthetic stock.

    I don't shoot it enough to really give a good comparison, but I DO trust it to throw lead when/if I ever need it to.

    There is a lot of Hollywood movie/TV baloney scenes about shotguns and it makes good theatrics to have actors rack the slide for that effect OVER and OVER again.

    However, I will be in the minority here. I think the sound of a pump shotgun being cycled does have some effect as a deterrent, to a small degree and very much depending on who hears it. I wouldn't depend on it, though.

    I and most of you on here will instantly know that sound, criminals...maybe or maybe not. I know what the bolt of an M-16 being charged/released sound like and that will get my attention real quick.

    I will repeat what a man said on 60 minutes some years ago. A South Afrikaner farmer being interviewed by 60 Minutes said when the natives were getting restless/ instigating an uprising around his place many changed their minds real quick with what he called a 'Universal Language' he then picked up his pump shotgun and racked the slide saying that changed many of their minds.

    Take that with a grain of salt, but it worked for him in some circumstances. He never did say how many it didn't work on and he had to shoot????

    Again, I wouldn't depend on it, but wouldn't completely count it out because Hollywood makes so much of it for entertainment.

    Of course it will work on unarmed persons..... try it with someone who has a weapon, and you just gave them a direction yo fire their first shot.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
  • roadkingroadking Senior Member Posts: 3,056 Senior Member
    I have a few shotguns, 870, 11-87 etc., but really don't think of them as my go to for home defense...large, unwieldy, large flash. In a pinch, yes, they would do. Personally, I prefer a nice high cap pistol or two to defend my house hold.
    Rather repair a couple small-ish holes in the plaster than agiant hole or many little holes. Guess it's a personal preference.

    Matt
    Support your local Scouts!
  • horselipshorselips Senior Member Posts: 3,628 Senior Member
    roadking wrote: »
    I have a few shotguns, 870, 11-87 etc., but really don't think of them as my go to for home defense...large, unwieldy, large flash. In a pinch, yes, they would do. Personally, I prefer a nice high cap pistol or two to defend my house hold.
    Rather repair a couple small-ish holes in the plaster than agiant hole or many little holes. Guess it's a personal preference.

    Matt

    I have to agree. To a point. The weapon I select for home defense depends entirely on the time of day and circumstances. I have secreted revolvers in convenient hideaways throughout the house - in the event of a sudden need I am never more than a few feet away from an equalizer. However, if I am awakened by burglars in the middle of the night, I have no intention of venturing forth to confront an unknown number of intruders possessing undetermined capabilities, and who could be in any room or scattered about the premises, inside and/or out. That's when I resort to my Remington 1100. With its longish barrel and 10 round magazine tube, it is configured purely as a defensive "garrison" shotgun. I and Juliet (Queen of Dogs) will be comfortably ensconced behind the bed, the shotgun aimed at the bedroom door. Any evil-doer who opens my door faces intense blinding light followed by METALSTORM. If they keep to the public rooms, just grab some stuff and flee, fine. It's all insured.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 20,780 Senior Member
    I must admit, patching holes in the wall, cleaning carpet, hiring a lawyer, losing my gun to evidence, and all the other things mentioned above are somewhere between last on my list and I don't give a damn in regards to defense of my family.

    Just not important to me at that particular moment in time.
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Well, where is our .410 buddy (:banned:) when we need him. A .410 doesn't have so much collateral damage as a 12 or 20, but delivers a smaller deadly payload concentrated on the BG. It is easier to control so you get more hits. They make defensive .410 loads marked as such for a reason. The rest is overkill :jester:
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Well, there's always the Clyde Barrow special- - - - -a BAR with a cut-down stock and barrel for easier handling. Who needs a puny 12 gauge when we can fling three .30-06 rounds a second at the scumbag?
    :guns:
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
  • 5280 shooter II5280 shooter II Senior Member Posts: 3,923 Senior Member
    I think Clyde and Bonnie were the originators of the first assault rifle....at 20 lbs, cutting a little off of a BAR didn't do much to increase the recoil.....but still a handfull!
    God show's mercy on drunks and dumb animals.........two outa three ain't a bad score!
Sign In or Register to comment.
Magazine Cover

GET THE MAGAZINE Subscribe & Save

Temporary Price Reduction

SUBSCRIBE NOW

Give a Gift   |   Subscriber Services

PREVIEW THIS MONTH'S ISSUE

GET THE NEWSLETTER Join the List and Never Miss a Thing.

Get the top Guns & Ammo stories delivered right to your inbox every week.