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SmithCorona03A3
Posts: 138 Member
Am I playing a fool's hand for mixing 'manual of arms'?
SmithCorona03A3
Posts: 138 Member
Just wondering how much emphasis you guys put on finding a certain type of defensive pistol trigger/safety mechanism and sticking with it throughout your inventory. Belt guns, car guns, nightstand guns, and EDC/CCW guns. Some guys have striker guns across the board big & small, others DAO, DA/SA, etc. Most of my serious pistols are the DA/SA variety in full size platforms. But I'm finally going to be in a living arrangement where I'll be able to get my carry permit (i.e. no more on-base uncle sam restrictions). I've got my eye on a sig 938 for a carry gun. But it's completely backwards with the thumb safety and trigger type compared to my HK USP and the Beretta M9s (I own one of those as well) that I've fooled with the past several years. I usually carry my USP and the M9s decocked, safety off. (When Uncle Sam isn't looking that is. He wants the safety engaged on the M9, in which case it's become second nature to swipe it up and off during the draw). Which, incidentally is the reverse motion of wiping the safety off a 938 and other 1911 style platforms. Is that going to mess me up, or can multiple muscle memory/motions be learned? Should I set my Beretta in the back of the safe and start carry my HK USP cocked and locked ala 1911, just to help learn the motion? I've looked at a lot of other subcompact 9mm's for a carry gun, but I think I'm still hooked on the 938. But being that a carry gun is probably the most likely thing you'll be stuck with if the crap hits the fan, I don't want to be leading myself on a down a bad alley when it comes to mixing together all these different manual of arms. What say you?
Formerly known as SmithCorona03A3, back in the old forum days
Replies
Denny
Biting my tongue - hard.:jester:
"Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
I'm impressed with your self control 'lol'. If I remember right you're a single action auto type of fellow. "serious" is pretty subjective I admit but blasphemous as it may be I've never been a 1911 guy :uhm:
Believe me I'd love to roll with the point and click pistols but I've tried a lot of them and never could get an appreciation for them. Reliable as hell, but just not my thing. They either never fit me or the triggers were hideous. I like the idea of the simplicity of draw and squeeze but I could never hit a dang thing with'em. I've bought and sold my share of glocks and XDs. I did shoot an XDm once, tho, and I think its a big improvement. That and the M&P would be my choice if I had to be stuck with a modern Tupperware gun. But neither one of them make a subcompact that I like. XDs & shield :hand:
I'm with ya. When it comes to anything outside the realm of defensive pistols, I'll take a single action revolver any day. If it wasn't for the realm of personal defense, I wouldn't give a damn about any semiauto pistol. Long live the .45 colt
You talking about the older DA Smith's with the slide mounted safety? Those things are weird even for a guy used to the M9. Never cared for them
I grew up hunting on the farm we lived on. Never used dogs or anything. Just whatever I could kick up. Rabbit, deer, squirrel were never any problem. I got the gun up, hammer back (when I had a H&R), or safety off (when I had a 20 gauge Revelations). Didn't always hit anything, but I usually got a shot off.
Grouse on the other hand! They would just explode at your feet and I was usually so startled I forgot to turn off the safety or get the hammer back before they had a tree between me and them.
So...... I can see not remembering to turn off a safety when a gunshot goes off, or a BG's gun comes out. I don't see how you could train for being startled iike that. None of my carry guns will ever have safeties.
At the end of the day, it all comes down to FRONT SIGHT --> SMOOTH PRESS, but as basic as that sounds, it's a sometimes a real challenge to convey that concept to fruition in others. I would probably suck-start a load of 00 buck if somebody told me I had to teach basic marksmanship to an entire agency on a system with a trigger pull that changes.
But to some degree or other, I do have to teach with a little bit of everything. My practice on Glocks is to shoot high-thumbs, which translates nicely to 1911's as it puts my thumb automatically on top of the safety. Sigs have the advantage of not having a safety, and HK's can be run safety off on DA mode. For "hopeless" safety layouts following the PPK/P-38 pattern (Berettas, S&W 39 descendants, Ruger P-85's, etc...) I regard it as better to use the safety to lower the hammer, then take the safety back off and leave it that way.
Along the same line of reasoning, I typically chamber the first round after a reload by pulling the slide to release rather than thumbing the slide stop. Why? Walther PPK's and HK P7's don't HAVE external slide stops, and Sig Sauer puts theirs in a weird place.
In short, come up with a few techniques that translate broadly, and you're less likely to crash one particular system.
"Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
But, I own DA/SA's, 1911, and various types of DA only, because I like them. If I want to carry something besides a revolver or DA only, I just practice with it and 'burn in' to my mind the firing technique, because for me, the last thing I practiced is what comes to mind. The memory fades quickly, and if I can't keep practicing, I go back to DAO or revolver.
Of course, I don't know if that works, or for that matter, if any other thing that I have practiced and thought about will work.
Those are the ones. Moving the safety up for off is just something that I can't get used to.
Denny
Wish it was that simple and for the most part you may be right; but, when a revolver jams and they do on occasion, you cannot rack the slide and clear it, you need tools.
And do not kid your self, revolvers have springs that fail.
You are of course correct but I've never heard of one jamming because it was finicky about ammo. Or needed it's feed ramp polished, or problems with a magazine or any other of the many reasons we practice malfunction drills with our semis.
Revolver failures are like airplane crashes. They happen only rarely but when they do they're usually catastrophic.
Also, you will usually need your off hand to clear a semi failure. So if that hand is shot to pieces, or like mine just simply doesn't work in the first place, then you got problems. Which is why I switched to revolvers for the time being. it could lock up on me but it's not likely.
Case split in one and jammed against the recoil shield----could not turn the cylinder or open it.
The other was crud related, but, a rnd would not slide back in the cylinder after firing another rnd so that the
cylinder could advance.
Same here, most of my shooting and hunting was with a SA, I bought my first semi-auto a S&W M-59 in the late 70s. When I carry or use a semi, for me its more natural to carry safety off , hammer down, rather than cocked & locked. When shooting a PPC course I had no trouble shooting with the hammer down.
JAY
I've got a number of handguns and only two (IIRC) operate the same way. I've got a Smith 39 (SA/DA) a 1911, an HK P7, a couple of revolvers, a Shield, a Kahr, a PPK-S, and maybe a couple more, and all of these except the first and the last, operate differently.
If I ever, God forbid, need to use one of these, I don't envision it as a quick draw and shoot situation. If it comes to that, I'm screwed as I dress for concealment, not for gunfighting. I can make each of them ready to shoot in time enough and hopefully accurately enough to do the job, and I'm aware of the gun I'm toting.
As for revolvers failing, I had one become fully tied up due to an extractor rod backing out and fouling up the system, I've had specs of unburnt powder get under the extractor star and gum up the system, and had a mainspring on a Smith N-frame break in two in storage.
Bullets can also pull out, tying up the gun, you can get bullets that are too long for the cylinder, improper resizing of the cases can be an issue...
AKA: Former Founding Member
Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
Paddle faster!!! I hear banjos.
Reason for editing: correcting my auto correct