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How to waste $70k on a vehicle

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  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    I originally posted this because I was of the opinion that most members here are more interested in functionality and performance features rather than fancy interiors. But I could be wrong.

    Regarding the Wrangler itself, I myself have zero idea whether it's a good vehicle or not. Some pals I have think it's a very good SUV or truck or whatever you wanna call it. Others think that the Wrangler performs best when being driven off a cliff. So I dunno, either way. I'd guess that, like most other vehicles, it's got some good and bad features and sits about halfway.

    Those of you who've owned Wranglers -- is it an "okay" vehicle? I've seen some very nice looking models but that doesn't prove anything.
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,250 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Those of you who've owned Wranglers -- is it an "okay" vehicle?

    Those of us who drive vintage Land Cruisers tend to point and laugh at Jeeps - - largely because so much gutting and cutting gets carried out to get them to where we were when the dealer's sticker came off. My opinion of my buddy's pretty much stock 2001 Wrangler I drove a couple weeks back is that it's a fair trail truck, but the low end of the gearing is not as low as I'd like for the gnarlier hunting roads more for going downhill than up. The power steering is something I wish my '78 model had, but otherwise, I'll take the 20 year older rig, thanks.

    As for Jeep's current product??? I still see a lot of brand new getting a whole lot of aftermarket attachments. The recent Toyotas are still pretty much dirt-ready out of the box, provided you lose the highway tires ASAP, or buy a model that's stock with the BFG AT's. Their great feature IMO is the "sport shift" automatic transmission. This was invented originally to let people drive their sports cars with automatics kinda-sorta like a manual. Truthfully, on my wife's Scion XB and my Sienna, it's almost worthless, but on their newer trucks, it lets you prevent the transmission from up-shifting and picking up speed on a downhill. Nice safety feature, that.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,670 Senior Member
    I'd rather have one of those big-ass Hummers.

    :driving:
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,713 Senior Member
    I'd rather have one of those big-ass Hummers.

    :driving:

    Those Hummers are an impressive vehicle.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • NCFUBARNCFUBAR Senior Member Posts: 4,324 Senior Member
    I'd rather have one of those big-ass Hummers.

    :driving:

    H1 YES ... H2 meh ... H3 fugetaboutit
    “The further a society drifts from truth ... the more it will hate those who speak it."
    - George Orwell
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Those of us who drive vintage Land Cruisers etc.

    That's an excellent posting, Big. Thanks for such. The fact that you compared different brands and their features gives us non-truck guys some good info.
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,733 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    The recent Toyotas are still pretty much dirt-ready out of the box, provided you lose the highway tires ASAP, or buy a model that's stock with the BFG AT's. Their great feature IMO is the "sport shift" automatic transmission. This was invented originally to let people drive their sports cars with automatics kinda-sorta like a manual. Truthfully, on my wife's Scion XB and my Sienna, it's almost worthless, but on their newer trucks, it lets you prevent the transmission from up-shifting and picking up speed on a downhill. Nice safety feature, that.

    My Tacoma has yet to let me down, though there are times I wish I'd gotten the Off Road because that one has the factory locking rear differential. With that said, I've yet to need it.

    As far as the gear limiting feature on the automatic transmission, I can vouch first hand for how useful that is. When I was driving down the road leading from Pikes Peak, about halfway down a Park Ranger checks the temp on your brakes and makes you stop until you get below 300 F. I had kept my transmission limited to second gear, and when they tested my brakes I was only 10 F above ambient air temperature.

    As far as my original comment about the Land Cruiser, I might rescind that. Looking at the price of the "Troop Carrier" version I would want, it would come in at well above $60,000 USD. More than double what my Tacoma 4x4 cost.
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,250 Senior Member
    As far as my original comment about the Land Cruiser, I might rescind that. Looking at the price of the "Troop Carrier" version I would want, it would come in at well above $60,000 USD. More than double what my Tacoma 4x4 cost.

    I can only tell you in detail how they compared to the Hi Lux pickups "then" as opposed to how they compare now. Most noteworthy was the brakes - bigger disks and 4-piston calipers instead of the P.U.'s 2. Dual pistons in the rear drums as I recall (though it's been a long spell since I had those apart). A lot of that kind of added overkill throughout the vehicle.

    But the impression I've had from my old man's 2010 4-Runner is that the recent Tacoma platform has become similarly beefy with the newer, bigger V6 to push them around. It seems to occupy the niche of the mid-wheelbase FJ-43 L.C. that never got imported to the U.S.

    Not sure what Toyota's reasoning is in not giving us the real thing anymore. Possibly, they think so much of this country is paved and that off-roading so minimal that the Taco platform is good enough. . .or that we're a nation of pickups and the Tundra is good enough.

    Still, I can't figure their non-importation of diesels.:bang:
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • jaywaptijaywapti Senior Member Posts: 4,958 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Those of us who drive vintage Land Cruisers tend to point and laugh at Jeeps - - largely because so much gutting and cutting gets carried out to get them to where we were when the dealer's sticker came off. .

    I have never owned a Land Cruiser, but had a lot of buddies that did, most of them did just like us in the jeeps, they added lift kits, duel shocks, F & B lockers, changed axle ratios, winches, tires etc. most of the stuff came from Man a Free in Calif.

    I have owned 4 jeeps from a MB-38 thru a TJ Wrangler, a 67 Bronco, and several Dodge 4x4s, and every one had to be modified to some extent.

    JAY
    THE DEFINITION OF GUN CONTROL IS HITTING THE TARGET WITH YOUR FIRST SHOT
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    Their great feature IMO is the "sport shift" automatic transmission. This was invented originally to let people drive their sports cars with automatics kinda-sorta like a manual. Truthfully, on my wife's Scion XB and my Sienna, it's almost worthless, but on their newer trucks, it lets you prevent the transmission from up-shifting and picking up speed on a downhill. Nice safety feature, that.

    The "sport shift" feature was, I agree with you, apparently added so that sports car wannabes could pretend to be Jackie Stewart. It was not much more than a gimmick.

    What's happened, of course, is that technology has lately caught up with the gimmick and surpassed it. Nowadays, all "formula" type race cars use electronic shifting and many high-end on-road sports cars do the same. I don't know at all about whether this sort of properly designed automatic shift system works off-road, but on-road, from what I read, it works great.

    I think back to the old SCCA says, when Hap Sharp & Jim Hall and their Chaparrals were the only race cars with automatic trannys. Btw I met both of those guys, interviewed Jim Hall for a newspaper article. Great guys!
  • LMLarsenLMLarsen Senior Member Posts: 8,337 Senior Member
    SCORE off-road racers have been using built-up auto trannies for over 30 years, ever since Walker Evans took home every Class 7 trophy that was offered.
    “A gun is a tool, no better or no worse than any other tool: an axe, a shovel or anything. A gun is as good or as bad as the man using it. Remember that.”

    NRA Endowment Member
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    LMLarsen wrote: »
    SCORE off-road racers have been using built-up auto trannies for over 30 years, ever since Walker Evans took home every Class 7 trophy that was offered.

    Thanks for the info. I know nuttin about offroad racing.

    I kinda didn't state my point clearly enough. I was thinking more about the electronically actuated manual shifts, like you see on some steering wheels nowadays. These auto-shift trannies allow you to select gears manually by flicking a button on the steering wheel or setting it to auto and letting the car decide. I've never driven a car with this type of quick-response shifting but I'm guessing it could be lotsa fun in a performance vehicle (Porsche 918, Ferrari, etc)
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,670 Senior Member
    NCFUBAR wrote: »
    H1 YES ... H2 meh ... H3 fugetaboutit

    The H1 is the one I was referring to. Love those things.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 6,713 Senior Member
    The H1 is the one I was referring to. Love those things.

    The H2 and above is just a GMC truck chassis with a box on top.
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie, just look at the flowers.
  • Farm Boy DeuceFarm Boy Deuce Senior Member Posts: 6,083 Senior Member
    Buford wrote: »
    The H2 and above is just a GMC truck chassis with a box on top.

    Yup. Basically a 4X4 Chevy Astro with a V8.
    I am afraid we forget sometime that the basic and simple things brings us the most pleasure.
    Dad 5-31-13
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,650 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    I'm a rebel in a 4 cylinder, 4 door, economy car bitches!
    Who knew?

    You go dude!
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    Our little econobox Mazda has the manual shift feature. It's smarter than the driver, and won't let you dumb things like shift from 4th to 1st doing 80 MPH. I rarely use it, save for one S curve in town. When I'm feeling froggy I'll shift into second before hitting the S curve (speed limit sign says to take it at 20) and flog hell out of it shifting into 3rd as I leave the corner at 45 MPH. I'm a rebel in a 4 cylinder, 4 door, economy car bitches!

    Ha! Your story reminds me of the old days when I would try to squeeze the last possible horsepower from my ragged little Mini-Cooper. Or years later, doing the same thing in my Nissan 240SX... "Here goes Sam, intent on securing his next Formula One championship. He seduces his lightning fast McClaren through the final sweeping turn at Monza, leaving both Stirling Moss and Jackie Stewart in his wake. The checkered flag awaits as he upshifts and..."
    "Hey, Sam, the light has changed. Wake up!" "Oh, yeah. Thanks, honey."
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    cpj wrote: »
    It's smarter than the driver

    For me, that's not a big step up.
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,733 Senior Member
    Bigslug wrote: »
    But the impression I've had from my old man's 2010 4-Runner is that the recent Tacoma platform has become similarly beefy with the newer, bigger V6 to push them around. It seems to occupy the niche of the mid-wheelbase FJ-43 L.C. that never got imported to the U.S.

    Not sure what Toyota's reasoning is in not giving us the real thing anymore. Possibly, they think so much of this country is paved and that off-roading so minimal that the Taco platform is good enough. . .or that we're a nation of pickups and the Tundra is good enough.

    Still, I can't figure their non-importation of diesels.:bang:

    I have a strong feeling that the current Tacoma frame will be on its way out with the next generation. The 4Runner is actually built on a Tundra frame, with the Tacoma transmission and a newer version of the 1GR 4.0 engine only found on the 4Runner. With the FJ Cruiser leaving production, the only vehicle built on the Tacoma frame with the older 1GR is the Tacoma itself. Historically Toyota does a 4Runner redesign and then follows up shortly with a new Tacoma using many of the same influences, so we shall see. With 4 years since the 4Runner redesign and 11 years since a new Tacoma, they are overdue a new Tacoma. Of course, it's hard to argue with the best selling midsize truck, period.

    As far as not importing diesels, from what I understand it is an emissions regulation issue. Besides VW, the only "small" diesels brought in are in the new Chrysler pickups and SUV's, and those require use of "exhaust fluid" to get the emissions within allowed limits. Too bad really, a Tacoma or 4Runner with that V8 Turbo Diesel would be a jaw dropper, or even the 3.0 diesel on the Hi-Lux.
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast, and speed is the economy of motion" - Scott Jedlinski
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 8,250 Senior Member
    The 4Runner is actually built on a Tundra frame, with the Tacoma transmission and a newer version of the 1GR 4.0 engine only found on the 4Runner.

    Then they kinda DID Land Cruiserize it. The classic Cruisers had brutish frames, bulletproof drivetrains, and unique-to-the-Cruiser 4-ish liter inline sixes that were ALL about torque - probably on the assumption that only an idiot would try to go fast in a high-clearance, short wheelbase vehicle. Out of all the Toyotas my family has had, I've liked that one the best - good mileage (for what it is), decent cargo capacity (two hunters, their packs and rifles, and one dead deer - no problem), and most of the off-road capability of the old L.C. with a lot more comfort.
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,670 Senior Member
    Buford wrote: »
    The H2 and above is just a GMC truck chassis with a box on top.
    Yeah, they were nice as SUV's go, but as you say, the H1 is impressive.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • Farm Boy DeuceFarm Boy Deuce Senior Member Posts: 6,083 Senior Member
    Yeah, they were nice as SUV's go, but as you say, the H1 is impressive.

    I still want an H1 Alpha. They stuck the Duramax/Allison combo in that one.
    I am afraid we forget sometime that the basic and simple things brings us the most pleasure.
    Dad 5-31-13
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