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Weird Feeling

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  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,620 Senior Member
    You're observant, Doc. But perhaps your vision isn't clear. You've certainly misinterpreted what I said. I'm making fun of no one in stating the reason I don't usually carry. I've never, if you re-read my posts, suggested anyone should NOT carry.

    My personal reasons for carrying, when I do, have to do with fear for my safety, paranoia of those around me, etc. These reasons may not be anyone else's but mine, but then I have always posted about MY preferences. And I, personally, have never saved my life or anyone else's life, with a handgun. You must have had an interesting past. I've drawn my gun for safety purposes, but never had to use it. Thank God.

    I don't remember you pushing your preference for a model of firearm, and don't remember taking exception. (could it have been on the "best firearm" thread?) If doing so, I wasn't trying to demean anyone's choice, while at the same time rejecting the very idea of the "best" firearm. And especially "pushing" a preference.

    Lastly, you're completely unqualified to psycho-analyze my post, which you did in the first paragraph after saying . And if you think I'm making fun of you, perhaps you need to question your own paranoia.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Well, Gene, this thread has certainly turned interesting.

    You got jumped and, as I think, unduly ratted with what you said about carrying or not.

    My own assessment of my personal situation has led me to maybe act similarly to you, at least it seems such to me.

    I've merely said that where I live, I don't feel so threatened or in constant danger that I consider it advisable to, for example, carry in a side holster all the time I'm home. But that's an assessment I've made relative to the perceived dangers.

    I have not told anyone in this thread that it's unnecessary or silly to carry all the time. It's apparent that with some members, they live in a neighborhood or environment where they feel it necessary to carry all the time. One person here (I forget who) said that he keeps a gun handy beneath a towel while he's in the bathroom, maybe using the facility or showering or whatever. In this thread I've not said that such a person is "wrong" to do so. Each person needs to assess the environment and if the places that these people live are that hazardous, okay, fine by me. Living in such a constantly dangerous environment or neighborhood, such as feeling the need to wear a sidearm all the time at home? I am simply glad that I don't live in that hazardous of a neighborhood.

    We often talk about "situational awareness" and how critical this is when deciding about concealed (or open) carry and how to react. Where I live, I've "assessed" the environment and have decided that I don't need to wear a sidearm 24/7, and that having a pistol within easy reach when I'm in bed or in my living room is sufficient.

    Understand, I don't criticize others here who feel that their environment is more dangerous, such that they need to be side-armed all the time. They have, just as I have, analyzed where they live, and have decided that a much more elevated threat level exists. This is up to the individual.

    But Eli, I kinda think you were rude to Gene. And if Gene responded with sarcasm, he did so due to being ragged even though he'd not done so to start it.

    I don't criticize anyone here who's decided that the place he lives is so dangerous that he feels the need to go armed 24/7, maybe wearing a holstered sidearm while walking around at home. That's perfectly reasonable depending on where you live, perhaps a plethora of home invasions and breakins all the time, constant thuggery all over the area. That's a decision each person makes depending on the "threat level" where he lives.

    Makes sense to me. And personally, it makes sense to me that I don't live in such a dangerous area and therefore don't feel compelled to wear a sidearm all the time I'm home. My neighborhood is simply not that dangerous. I might be wrong, but hey, thus far it's been a plus for me.

    I do however take care when I go out, and I'm pretty okay with self defense here at home too. I've had more than my share of encounters and I've managed to come out okay.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,894 Senior Member
    I think Gene's use of the word "paranoia" is part of the issue. It is a bit of an inflammatory word to some. Or most. I won't make an assumption as to what he means by that word, whether it's heightened attentiveness and more extreme caution, actual paranoia, or what.
    I'm just here for snark.
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »

    But Eli, I kinda think you were rude to Gene. And if Gene responded with sarcasm, he did so due to being ragged even though he'd not done so to start it.

    I don't think Gene responded with sarcasm at all. He responded the way he did because he (incorrectly) thought I was attacking his life choices. I wasn't, I couldn't care less how he chooses to live his life. I was merely expressing the opinion that the justification that he used for his life choices (you too, according to your numerous post on the subject) was stupid.

    This has been my position for as long as I can remember, I have expressed this opinion multiple times on the forum (pretty much every time you've posted about a "safe" kroger parking lot), I really don't understand why you seem to be surprised by it.


    Lastly, Gene is retired now, but as far as I know, he spent his entire adult life being a man among men. He was an Army Ranger, then became a LEO. He eventually ended up working for one of the last Sheriff's Office in the country that still occasionally issues Glock 18s. That level of badassedness is really hard to match, and is not something a delicate flower of sensitivity can pull off.

    I SERIOUSLY doubt that my words did any sort of irreparable harm to Gene's psyche. Really, don't worry, he'll be completely over it by the next time we both participate in a thread where we disagree with one another.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,620 Senior Member
    Paranoia is why I carry, when I do carry, since I have no personal experience of needing a firearm as a citizen. It's a personal thing for me and may not apply to anyone else. And it's "actual" at least in my personal definition and not extreme. Or it may be known by another less offensive name, like "situational awareness." Personally, I don't see being paranoid as offensive.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,894 Senior Member
    I thought you meant "situational awareness," but I wonder if some aren't turned off by "paranoia" because of its association with mental illness?
    I'm just here for snark.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,620 Senior Member
    I'm thinking of Clint Eastwood's character in "In the Line of Fire" where he says if he'd been half as paranoid at the Kennedy assassination as he was now, maybe he could have prevented the assassination.

    I was paranoid, I think most cops are. And I still am, occasionally. Paranoid enough to keep a firearm handy when I'm at home, but not paranoid to the point where I feel I have to strap one on at all times.

    No, Eli didn't hurt my feelings. As for environments like Kroger parking lots, six years ago an officer got stabbed in a Kroger in Athens on a moonlight security job. She almost bled out before the EMTs got to her and took several years to recover. She's now back on the job. The knife was under the armpit, I believe, and she was wearing a vest. The guy was arrested later on. A good justification for deadly force if you're ever attacked with a knife.

    But you need to read the case before you can use it as a defense. The officer's name is Courtney Gale and here is a reference: http://onlineathens.com/stories/042408/news_2008042400108.shtml

    If an armed citizen had been there, I don't think he could have prevented the injury as it was a sudden thing, but if willing, he could have killed the suspect. The officer was attacked because she was doing her duty and because she was wearing a uniform. I'm not sure about why the original confrontation occurred, but I think it was a misdemeanor originally.

    Edit: the perp was a mentally ill guy who was opening up packages of meat with a large knife at Kroger's.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    I thought you meant "situational awareness," but I wonder if some aren't turned off by "paranoia" because of its association with mental illness?

    Same here. I think that "paranoia" was maybe not the best choice of phrases. But I understood the meaning regardless.
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    This has been my position for as long as I can remember, I have expressed this opinion multiple times on the forum (pretty much every time you've posted about a "safe" kroger parking lot), I really don't understand why you seem to be surprised by it.

    Not exactly understanding how you thought I was "surprised" -- I wasn't surprised by your postings or by others' here, either.

    I have to try to explain this a little... If I said that a Kroger parking lot was "safe" I misspoke. I did however try to present a scenario that's "relatively safe" compared to, say, a drugged-out shady and shabby strip shopping center in the heart of the ghetto. I also made the point that 2pm on a Wednesday afternoon is different from 2am on a Friday night.

    I am essentially trying to make a point that personal recognition of security and potential hazards are a sliding scale from 0 to 100 or from, ha ha, Defcon 4 to Defcon 1 --- that's what I meant to present, and perhaps you didn't understand me. My bad.

    I don't think it's "stupid" to make reasonably intelligent assessments of your environment and to then make what I think is a reasonable reaction to the perceived threats and to then decide on how to react -- to carry a firearm or not.

    I make no criticism of those who live in such a dangerous area that they are always needing to carry a firearm. I don't call that paranoid because I don't know the surroundings that made these folks decide such.

    I can however say that if it's, say, 2pm on a Wednesday and I'm parking in the front of the Kroger (handicap zone) and there's an armed security guard standing there about 30 feet away, shoppers going in and out -- no gunfire, no hostage taking, no crack dealers standing there, etc. then I feel "RELATIVELY" safe. Relative to, say, being in a crudded-out strip mall with a liquor store and "night club" next door. So yeah, given circumstances, I make decisions on what my reaction will be. Duh. Isn't that what we all do?

    I haven't had to fight my way through the checkout line lately, nor shoot my way past the drug dealers parked in front of where I live. Lucky I guess. Maybe tomorrow they'll all be there, a cordon around my home, and I'm toast.

    But you place me at a disadvantage. If I don't post a reply, then you won't have a response and if I DO reply, I'm accused of making "numerous post" (s). Duh.

    My recommend is that you simply not read my posts. That way you won't see "stupid" stuff. Same I guess for what Gene posts, his also being "stupid".
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    You analyzed your own post, I merely pointed out key points, I do not carry because I am paranoid or due to fear, I carry simply because bad things can happen to nice people, my area is pretty crime ridden, drugs, legal pot etc..... my sidearm is a precaution, just like a fire extinguisher, I do not fear fires, I like to be prepared in case something does happen.
    Also, criminals travel, good people can break, things happen , so no matter how safe a neighborhood is, something can happen to change all that.

    Paranoia and paranoid behavior is a behavioral disorder, unfounded fears, there is a great difference between CCW = being prepared, and thinking everyone is out to get you. For example: conspiracy theory nuts, thinking the paper boy is a spy, or the mailman is a serial killer etc......
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    ......I am essentially trying to make a point that personal recognition of security and potential hazards are a sliding scale from 0 to 100 or from, ha ha, Defcon 4 to Defcon 1 --- that's what I meant to present, and perhaps you didn't understand me......


    It's not that I don't understand you, I just think you're wrong.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,620 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    It's not that I don't understand you, I just think you're wrong.

    What is "right?" Need a matrix here.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • EliEli Senior Member Posts: 3,074 Senior Member
    Gene L wrote: »
    What is "right?" Need a matrix here.

    "Right".......is being honest with others and (usually much more difficult) being honest with yourself. Yes you're more likely to go through your entire life without ever having to draw your concealed carry weapon, yes if you do have to draw it, it's more than likely that it will be against someone you are familiar with as opposed to a "random" event.

    YES, random still means random. There are countless instances (especially recently) of bad things happening to good people in good neighborhoods. Folks playing the "knockout game" comes to mind, the girl getting set on fire in her nice suburban neighborhood a few weeks ago, the uniformed officer that you mentioned that was RANDOMLY attacked by a crazy person, etc...

    "I don't carry because".....if the rest of that statement isn't either "I have walk through metal detectors multiple times a day" or "I don't want to put in the effort", then you're incorrect in your justification.


    To paraphrase the old line....

    It's not the odds we're dealing with here, it's the stakes.
  • CHIRO1989CHIRO1989 Senior Member Posts: 14,296 Senior Member
    Eli wrote: »
    To paraphrase the old line....

    It's not the odds we're dealing with here, it's the stakes.

    Exactly.
    I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn away from their ways and live. Eze 33:11
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 12,620 Senior Member
    To me, it's the odds. When I gamble, I play the odds, not the stakes. If it was the stakes, I'd have retired as a salesman rather than a cop. Or a Finance officer rather than an Infantry platoon leader.

    Not my personality.
    Concealed carry is for protection, open carry is for attention.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    I will not gamble because the stakes are = my life, the odds are against me, craps, I lose......
    As Eli stated and I agree, you are one real Soldier and no pansy....... I probably am a piker or rank amateur compared to you in every way.

    I just do not get not carrying, I have seen too many victims reach room temperature because they were not able to defend themselves and help arrived too late........
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
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