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Turkey 'downs Russian warplane on Syria border'

shushshush Senior MemberPosts: 6,259 Senior Member
Oops!!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34907983

34 minutes ago;


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"Turkish warplanes have reportedly shot down a Russian military aircraft on the border with Syria.

Russia's Interfax news agency cited the Russian defence ministry as saying that a Su-24 had crashed in northern Syria, and that its two pilots had ejected.

Turkish military officials said Turkish F-16s had shot down the plane after repeatedly warning its pilots that they were violating Turkish airspace.

Video footage showed the plane crashing into mountains in Latakia province."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-34908469

Live;

"The Russian defence ministry has confirmed its plane downed on the Turkish border, was an Su-24 fighter jet."

"Syrian activists have been quoted as saying that one of the pilots of the Russian Su-24 has been captured. He is said to be being held in the mountainous Utayrah area in Turkmen Mount, Qatar-based Al-Jazeera Arabic TV reports."

"Turkey is a member of the Nato alliance, which has said it is ready to defend Turkey if Russia violated its airspace"

Replies

  • shushshush Senior Member Posts: 6,259 Senior Member
    Half a mo. :confused:

    We are supporting the Western-backed rebel groups against President Bashar al-Assad's government and the Islamic State (IS).

    A US-led coalition has been carrying out air strikes against Islamic State militants and Russia's military is also now involved.

    Russian air strikes are supporting President Bashar al-Assad's government against Western-backed rebel groups and the Islamic State (IS).

    Now Turkey says its forces have shot down a plane on the border with Syria, Russian.

    "The BBC's Selin Girit says there are reports that one of the pilots has been captured by an ethnic Turkmen rebel group, but this has not been confirmed by independent sources.

    Some reports are also suggesting that the remains of the plane fell into a Turkmen refugee group. Turkmen have been fleeing Russian air strikes and the war with President Assad's forces.

    Turkey has previously expressed concern about the fate of Turkmen, who are ethnically quite close to the Turkish, in Syria."

    And;
    " Nato 'in touch with Turkish authorities' after downing of Russian plane."

    Just an abstract thought, thinking out of the box, as it were. :uhm:

    Is it too early to start supporting the Islamic State (IS), along with the Western-backed rebel groups and the ethnic Turkmen rebel group against the Russian aggressor? :roll:
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,495 Senior Member
    It's weird.... Russia is supporting the war AGAINST ISIS. In that aspect they're very much going with the world sentiment. But regarding the Assad regime, they're the only world power/major country that is FOR that butcher. So they go against the flow on that one.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Hard to make sense of who/whom is allied with who over yonder.

    BTW...............Obammy's magic diplomacy doesn't seem to be working on anybody...............he is a great world leader in his own mind.
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • shushshush Senior Member Posts: 6,259 Senior Member
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-34908469

    US confirms Turks warned Russia before shooting down jet
    Posted at 15:39

    A spokesman for the US-led coalition against Islamic State, Col Steve Warren says it can confirm that the Turks warned the Russian plane 10 times before shooting down the jet.

    He said they were working to establish exactly where the plane was when it was shot down.


    Radar images 'show plane penetrated Turkish airspace'

    Posted at 14:54

    Onur Oymen, a Turkish member of parliament who once served as Turkey's permanent representative to Nato, says the Turkish government has evidence to prove that the Russian jet was flying over Turkey when it was shot down:

    They already broadcast on Turkish television the radar images of the Turkish general staff showing how the plane penetrated Turkish airspace, and how it remained in Turkish airspace despite warnings."


    Moscow insists its plane never strayed from Syrian airspace.



    'Both of the pilots were retrieved dead'
    Posted at 14:43

    Syrian Turkmen brigade deputy commander Alpaslan Celik tells Reuters:

    Both of the pilots were retrieved dead. Our comrades opened fire into the air and they died in the air."

    'Turkmen forces shot dead pilots as they parachuted'
    Posted at 14:39

    The deputy commander of a Turkmen brigade in Syria says his forces shot dead two pilots of the downed Russian jet as they descended with parachutes, says Reuters.

    They will not be best pleased.
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,798 Senior Member
    Well, if a Turkish plane (or two) gets accidentally shot down, it will all blow over, unless the Turks escalate.
  • AntonioAntonio Senior Member Posts: 2,696 Senior Member
    Russians shot down DOZENS of U.S., British and other nationalities planes, including clearly civilian ones, (Remember the KAL 007 in the '80s) during the Cold War, and no retaliation ever occurred despite quite a few were done over international waters, foreign airspace, and without any warning.
    Hardly will see other than a diplomatic tantrum from the Russians...they know better than going to war against Turkey and therefore NATO because of a couple of dead pilots, and they also know that in such kind of military operations, something like that is going to happen anytime.

    Anyway, glad to see that the regional mobster bully is the one wasting its money and burying their dead while battling the Daesh monster why supporting a cartoon dictatorship drenched in oil. What they're REALLY afraid of is that their already troublesome muslim minorities see that they can go berserk too against their masters, and loose their influence and strategic waterway access in the zone.
  • Big Al1Big Al1 Senior Member Posts: 7,827 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    BTW it was shot down by an American F-16!!!!!! Should make them think REALLY hard about what a US pilot could do with a F-35 :devil:

    Don't think all the bugs are worked out of the F-35 yet, but my old 95th Sq. (aka Boneheads) has been over there for awhile with F-22's.
    5803.jpg
  • orchidmanorchidman Senior Member Posts: 8,111 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Now it's getting real right quick...

    Things are so confused over there as to who is fighting who that I am picking Obama will finally go to war against the USA........................wait...............oh, he has already done that.................
    Still enjoying the trip of a lifetime and making the best of what I have.....
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    And then the moderate rebels on the ground who are Anti Assad (we support) not ISIS, shot down a Russian rescue helicopter allowed by Turkey to fly in and try and retrieve its 2 crewmen. The rebels claim they shot the two as their parachutes came down, all of this in a former piece of land/region that once belonged to Syria, but Turkey claimed and got.................follow all this :uhm::uhm:

    Called Turkmen Rebels and now a video shows the two parachutes coming down and being fired at and one reported dead, shot while in decent to the ground.
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,398 Senior Member
    Well, I guess Putin is finding out the hard way not to mess with the Turkish military. They tend to go batscat crazy if they think they're being invaded. They may be in NATO but they fight by their own rules.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • Big ChiefBig Chief Senior Member Posts: 32,995 Senior Member
    Here is a video of a US ground mount TOW (Tube Launched/ Optically Sighted/Wire Guided) anti-tank missile being set up and fired into the rescue copter.


    http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/477404/US-nti-tank-gun-used-by-jihadis-against-Russian-chopper
    It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
    Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
    I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
  • shushshush Senior Member Posts: 6,259 Senior Member
    bisley wrote: »
    Well, if a Turkish plane (or two) gets accidentally shot down, it will all blow over, unless the Turks escalate.

    The Russian jets have been warned to stay away from Turkish airspace, before now.
    The Russian jets have been warned to stay away from The Syrian Turkmen Brigades, before now.

    2013, Syrian helicopter shot down.
    2014, Syrian aircraft shot down.
    Both for violating Turkish airspace.

    June 2012, a Turkish F-4 reconnaissance jet was brought down over the Mediterranean Sea, with two dead pilots, reputedly by the Syrian Armed Forces.

    All the Turkish money was on a Russian warship in coordination with the Russian naval facility in Tartus.

    It would be a mistake to equate the Turkic people with the Arabs, two very different species.

    Russia may come to rue the day.
  • AntonioAntonio Senior Member Posts: 2,696 Senior Member
    tennmike wrote: »
    Well, I guess Putin is finding out the hard way not to mess with the Turkish military. They tend to go batscat crazy if they think they're being invaded. They may be in NATO but they fight by their own rules.

    I thought that lesson was already taught at the siege of Plevna in 1877, when Turkish troops armed with Winchester '66s & Peabody Martinis punished the Grand Duke's attacking troops using antique breech-loading musket conversions but confident in overcoming the Ottoman defenses with their sheer number.

    Ask the Commonwealth....don't mess with the Turks!
  • tubabucknuttubabucknut Banned Posts: 3,520 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    BTW it was shot down by an American F-16!!!!!! Should make them think REALLY hard about what a US pilot could do with a F-35 :devil:

    The Russians were flying an Su-24. That is a high speed bomber. The Turks were Flying F-16s. Those are air superiority fighters. It would have been no contest, as the Su-24 is not a fighter, and the Russians probably did not anticipate being fired upon. They are used to thumbing their noses, and getting no response. Looks like they got their nose bloodied this time. I would not extrapolate this incident into what would happen if both of our countries had their best air superiority fighters in the air at the same time. While I believe we probably produce a better aircraft, and probably have better trained pilots, our pilots have never gone up against the level of technology, and training the Russians have. This would be a bad day for both countries.

    I hope this does not escalate into that bad day.
  • JayhawkerJayhawker Moderator Posts: 16,928 Senior Member
    The Russians were flying an Su-24. That is a high speed bomber. The Turks were Flying F-16s. Those are air superiority fighters. It would have been no contest, as the Su-24 is not a fighter, and the Russians probably did not anticipate being fired upon. They are used to thumbing their noses, and getting no response. Looks like they got their nose bloodied this time. I would not extrapolate this incident into what would happen if both of our countries had their best air superiority fighters in the air at the same time. While I believe we probably produce a better aircraft, and probably have better trained pilots, our pilots have never gone up against the level of technology, and training the Russians have. This would be a bad day for both countries.

    I hope this does not escalate into that bad day.

    Aside from that Guided Missile Cruiser now sitting off the coast of Syria, it wouldn't surprise me if the Russians started putting a CAP up over their bomber sorties....this has the possibility of getting nasty...
    Sharps Model 1874 - "The rifle that made the west safe for Winchester"
  • Fat BillyFat Billy Senior Member Posts: 1,813 Senior Member
    Good old F-16s still work well! :applause: Later,
    Fat Billy

    Recoil is how you know primer ignition is complete.
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 24,715 Senior Member
    There is more to the story than in the news.

    Warned 10 times in 5 minutes while crossing a 2 mile wide section of Turkey; as I heard on the news.

    A/c was probably making 420 knots per hour. So, at that speed it takes 20 sec to cross that 2 mile section of Turkey.
    Shut up-----KAREN; OK Cynthia
  • BAMAAKBAMAAK Senior Member Posts: 4,484 Senior Member
    Our 70s technology can shoot down their 60s technology WOOHOO

    Hey Ned, Turkey still flys F-4s if you want to come out of retirement.
    "He only earns his freedom and his life Who takes them every day by storm."

    -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, German writer and politician
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 24,715 Senior Member
    That's ok, last time I was in a dog fight was '79.

    Navy F-4 jumped us in an EA-6B, both of us off the Midway.
    Shut up-----KAREN; OK Cynthia
  • 104RFAST104RFAST Senior Member Posts: 1,281 Senior Member
    We recently sent F-15's to Turkey to provide cover for our attack aircraft operating in Syria. The Russians have positioned Mig 29 and SU 31 aircraft in Syria to provide
    protection for their bombers, at some point we will have Fighter aircraft from Russia and the US operating in close proximity, not good!. Things could escalate
    very fast. Don't worry, Curious George and VJ are on top of the situation
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    The way an F-4 "marked its territory" on the ground with hydraulic leaks, I'm amazed it could stay airborne for long without running out of oil!
    Jerry
  • VarmintmistVarmintmist Senior Member Posts: 7,398 Senior Member
    Every time I see this thread title, my mind pictures a Godzilla sized Thanksgiving turkey eating a airplane in the desert.
    It's boring, and your lack of creativity knows no bounds.
  • tennmiketennmike Senior Member Posts: 27,398 Senior Member
    Heard this morning that Putin is bringing SAMs to Syria to take care of any curious aircraft not Russian or Syrian. Things are heating up.
      I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer”
    ― Douglas Adams
  • 104RFAST104RFAST Senior Member Posts: 1,281 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    The way an F-4 "marked its territory" on the ground with hydraulic leaks, I'm amazed it could stay airborne for long without running out of oil!
    Jerry

    In the Navy, its called corrosion control. When I was at Eglin in the early 60's we received on loan from the Navy three F-4Bs
    (small radar short nose) to be used as test aircraft, at this point the AF didn't have any F-4s.What I remember still after 50 something
    years is red 5606 covered the underside of the aircraft and wheel wells,the first thing we did was give them a bath!! I'm sure when the Navy was directed to turn these AC over to the AF they sent us the oldest clunkers they had.I thought it was the most butt ugly aircraft
    I ever saw. Funny how over time initial impressions change,3yrs later I thought it was a rather attractive bad as$ aircraft. Perhaps its a J-79 thing
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 24,715 Senior Member
    I loved listening to the compressors scream when they went around the pattern.
    Shut up-----KAREN; OK Cynthia
  • timctimc Senior Member Posts: 6,684 Senior Member
    I'm kinda hoping Russia will retaliate by bombing a couple of the Tukish steel mills. They have been dumping super cheap rebar in the U.S. All year long subsidized by the Turkish government. We aren't getting any tariffs because our government wants military bases there so those of us in the steel business here in the states are suffering right now.
    timc - formerly known as timc on the last G&A forum and timc on the G&A forum before that and the G&A forum before that.....
    AKA: Former Founding Member
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