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gunner81gunner81 MemberPosts: 488 Member
I would like to build an AR for varmint [coyote] killing I was looking at the 20 inch stainless bbl. 6.5 Grendel for the caliber. I was going to get a .243 but I think I like the AR idea for follow up shots. I never hunted coyote's but they are killing all the deer down deer camp. I don't know if you would even get a follow up shot with coyotes. Can you build an accurate AR or would you go another way. If you were to build a varmint AR without going broke how would you do it?I'm looking at 200 yards - 300 yards

Replies

  • gunner81gunner81 Member Posts: 488 Member
    Just the thought process I do think a 243 bolt is good & will more than do the job I was kinda thinking if I ran into a pack if I would be better off to be able to get multiple shots
  • gunner81gunner81 Member Posts: 488 Member
    cpj wrote: »
    For that distance, the .223 is more than adequate. You will gain more power with the 6.5, but you need to ask if the extra expense of ammo (and possibly the build)is worth it.
    As far as accuracy goes, it's not at all hard to have accuracy rivaling that of a bolt action. My preference is with a bolt gun, but that's a personal opinion. I simply like them better. No reason, other than...I just do.
    It's huge can of worms, the AR world....
    I have a 22 mag with a 3x12 scope that will do the job its dead on but this is a good reason to buy or build another gun or 2
  • Elk creekElk creek Senior Member Posts: 6,667 Senior Member
    I watched a coyote get shot with some frangible 223 meant for indoor range use.....there was couple vertabrea holding it together. Almost cut it in two at about 50 yards.
    Aim higher, or get a bigger gun.
  • Elk creekElk creek Senior Member Posts: 6,667 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Interesting! Never thought of those for hunting. I'm not a pelt hunter so my favorite load in the .223 are 45 gr HPs. They devastate internal organs so it's a bang/flop but are hell on pelts. My buddy was a pelt hunter and usually went for tougher .223 bullets so he'd just get two small holes on pass through.
    My Dad shoots a 22-250 loaded with 55 gr HP going fast. The are deviatatng on song dogs.
    Aim higher, or get a bigger gun.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    gunner81 wrote: »
    I would like to build an AR for varmint [coyote] killing I was looking at the 20 inch stainless bbl. 6.5 Grendel for the caliber. I was going to get a .243 but I think I like the AR idea for follow up shots. I never hunted coyote's but they are killing all the deer down deer camp. I don't know if you would even get a follow up shot with coyotes. Can you build an accurate AR or would you go another way. If you were to build a varmint AR without going broke how would you do it?I'm looking at 200 yards - 300 yards

    6.5 Grendel is about 33%-50% higher in cost. If you invest in even a modest reloading setup, 55gr VMAX can be loaded into 223Rem cases on the cheap.

    To evolve the 22 mag suggestions, I use a 17HMR a lot. Inside of 75 yards you can shoot them with confidence.

    Check out the DPMS Oracle and an inexpensive Nikon Buckmasters or Leupold Rifleman scope. Its not really going to be done cheaper than that combination. 2 MOA accuracy is more than adequate for coyote.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Interesting! Never thought of those for hunting. I'm not a pelt hunter so my favorite load in the .223 are 45 gr HPs. They devastate internal organs so it's a bang/flop but are hell on pelts. My buddy was a pelt hunter and usually went for tougher .223 bullets so he'd just get two small holes on pass through.

    The 40gr Berger HP varmint bullets turn their insides into...well
    .burger.

    3390-fps in my 18" barrel AR15 SPR.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 8,155 Senior Member
    As a now former 6.5 Grendel owner, I can say that in an AR platform, I was thoroughly underwhelmed with what I had. Even out of a 24" barrel, I was topping out at 2400 fps and 3/4" groups was about the absolute best I could muster, even with handloads. For that reason, I ended up selling off that upper and used the funds to order a 6x45 for a slightly more deer-worthy option than a .223. This is purely to give my daughter a very low recoil "next step" deer gun when she outgrows my .223 AR.

    Like the others have said, for a coyote gun, .223 is a way more practical and offers much better performance where it matters in that game: faster, flatter shots and an enormous bullet selection.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    Six-Gun wrote: »
    As a now former 6.5 Grendel owner, I can say that in an AR platform, I was thoroughly underwhelmed with what I had. Even out of a 24" barrel, I was topping out at 2400 fps and 3/4" groups was about the absolute best I could muster, even with handloads. For that reason, I ended up selling off that upper and used the funds to order a 6x45 for a slightly more deer-worthy option than a .223. This is purely to give my daughter a very low recoil "next step" deer gun when she outgrows my .223 AR.

    Like the others have said, for a coyote gun, .223 is a way more practical and offers much better performance where it matters in that game: faster, flatter shots and an enormous bullet selection.

    Basically my sentiments.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Wow that's a hot little number!

    Indeed. The AR isn't over-gassed either. 0.6 MOA to boot.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 21,545 Senior Member
    As one of the few Grendel fans still here, I wouldn't consider if the best yote round. I think the 223 would be a better choice.

    Naww, they're not accurate either (5 shot group)
    123AMax-fouled-1.jpg

    [video=youtube_share;KxLbXKoL2Vs]
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 8,155 Senior Member
    Was that group was shot out of your bolt gun or the Alexander Arms upper?

    I should caveat my prior post with the fact that I bought the Alexander Arms lightweight upper, which has a 24" pencil barrel.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 21,545 Senior Member
    Six-Gun wrote: »
    Was that group was shot out of your bolt gun or the Alexander Arms upper?

    I should caveat my prior post with the fact that I bought the Alexander Arms lightweight upper, which has a 24" pencil barrel.
    Both above were shot with my AA 24" "Overwatch" upper, Topped with a Burris 6-24x and using Hornady 123gr Amax, 26.0gr H4895, AA cases and Wolf SR primers.

    My bolt gun is only about a .75" gun, it has a #1 contour Shilen barrel on it and was built strictly as a hunting rifle, so 3/4 MOA is perfectly fine
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 8,155 Senior Member
    I was using the same bullet and went through God knows how many powders with very similar load-to-load results. Everything stayed between .70 - 1.20" at 100 yards. The bigger issue was the velocity (or lack thereof). That was a pretty remarkable rainbow going on, and the drop between 200 and 300 yards got downright ugly. Any hope I had for taking it out West pretty much died right there. There was just no way to justify the baggage weight of an AR that was materially limited to being a 250 yard gun.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • orchidmanorchidman Senior Member Posts: 8,161 Senior Member
    If we had coyote's over here I would get one of these...................( if I could afford one)

    https://www.lesbaer.com/204Ruger.html :tooth:

    But we don't :bang:

    And I cant :bang:
    Still enjoying the trip of a lifetime and making the best of what I have.....
  • WeatherbyWeatherby Senior Member Posts: 4,953 Senior Member
    orchidman wrote: »
    If we had coyote's over here I would get one of these...................( if I could afford one)

    https://www.lesbaer.com/204Ruger.html :tooth:

    But we don't :bang:

    And I cant :bang:

    well it's 204 Alec and a tack driver

    IMG_0210-2.jpg

    IMG_0219.jpg

    IMG_0223.jpg
  • orchidmanorchidman Senior Member Posts: 8,161 Senior Member
    Weatherby wrote: »
    well it's 204 Alec and a tack driver

    IMG_0210-2.jpg

    IMG_0219.jpg

    IMG_0223.jpg

    I close my case...............and you suck!
    Still enjoying the trip of a lifetime and making the best of what I have.....
  • FisheadgibFisheadgib Senior Member Posts: 5,797 Senior Member
    knitepoet wrote: »
    As one of the few Grendel fans still here, I wouldn't consider if the best yote round. I think the 223 would be a better choice.

    Naww, they're not accurate either (5 shot group)
    123AMax-fouled-1.jpg

    [video=youtube_share;KxLbXKoL2Vs]

    You should bring that to the next SE shoot. The 300yd contest would be almost guaranteed.
    snake284 wrote: »
    For my point of view, cpj is a lot like me
    .
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,954 Senior Member
    A basic AR is more than adequate. I have less than $550 invested in mine, and it shoots thumbnail sized groups when I do my part. It is EASY to put together a nice lower/upper for under $600 if you just shop around.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • gunner81gunner81 Member Posts: 488 Member
    All my 223 AR's have 16 inch bbls.I never got crazy about long range accuracy what bbl. would you suggest for an accurate rifle?
  • DanChamberlainDanChamberlain Senior Member Posts: 3,395 Senior Member
    I bet you cheated and used a scope.
    It's a source of great pride for me, that when my name is googled, one finds book titles and not mug shots. Daniel C. Chamberlain
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,798 Senior Member
    My 'varmint' style AR has a 20" 1:8 heavy barrel DPMS upper that shoots groups under MOA at 300 yards (in zero wind). I use 68 grain Hornady Match hand loads over Varget, and have gotten a couple of 0.4 groups at 100 yards. It has a Nikon 6-18x40, with side focus' on a Burris PEPPR mount. I also load Barnes 70 grain TSX's and they group almost as well as the Hornady Match ammo, at 100 yards. This is on a RRA lower with NM trigger.
  • WeatherbyWeatherby Senior Member Posts: 4,953 Senior Member
    I bet you cheated and used a scope.

    A Brake too.........Didn't want to be shooting too fast

    IMG_0307.jpg
  • gunner81gunner81 Member Posts: 488 Member
    I bet you cheated and used a scope.

    I bet I did too
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,798 Senior Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    A basic AR is more than adequate. I have less than $550 invested in mine, and it shoots thumbnail sized groups when I do my part. It is EASY to put together a nice lower/upper for under $600 if you just shop around.

    My Palmetto budget rifle has pleased me well, though the short-range scope with 'pig-plex' reticle that I put on it prevents me from knowing how well it would really group at 100 plus yards. But it shoots tiny groups at 25 and 50 yards with the 68 grain Hornady Match hand loads, where the scope reticle does not blot out the bulls eye. This is with the 1:7 16" pencil barrel and a $55 free-float handguard and $62 NM trigger.
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