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Idle hands are the devils tools, or, How hard is it to drill and tap a receiver

waipapa13waipapa13 Senior MemberPosts: 838 Senior Member
I was looking Skinner sight's Lo-pro aperture sight http://www.skinnersights.com/lo-pro_sight_7.html
and thinking it would be perfect for my Rossi pump .22, a Winchester 62 cone, thing is, it looks brain dead simple to make out of a machined eye bolt, with, say a 5mm hole for threading for the apertures, a lock nut and an o-ring for the sum total of $5 worth of parts from the hardware store.
Twist for elevation and drift the front for windage.

Drilling and tapping the top of the bolt is the only hang up, I have an engineer friend who has the capability to do it, but he's not a gun guy and I don't want to butcher a fun plinker by trial and error drilling. How does one go about centreing the hole and aligning it to the bore on a rounded and tapered surface? Or should I just find a gunsmith to do it for me (rare as hens teeth and expensive down here).

Replies

  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 23,663 Senior Member
    If it were me, I'd form a committee of one, elect myself chairman, and appoint someone else to do the work. If you can't afford to screw it up, you can't afford to do it.
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • waipapa13waipapa13 Senior Member Posts: 838 Senior Member
    Probably very good advice, but inquiring minds.....plus I don't wanna pay money for one miserable hole (I will probably live to regret saying that if I do attempt it unaided)
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • waipapa13waipapa13 Senior Member Posts: 838 Senior Member
    Yep, I've googled and looked at other forums, I know that the Forster is what the pros use. Do you use one in your operation? I just wonder if there is a redneck way to get a halfway decent result, if I have to pay the money, I have to pay, I get that.
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    waipapa13 wrote: »
    I was looking Skinner sight's Lo-pro aperture sight http://www.skinnersights.com/lo-pro_sight_7.html
    and thinking it would be perfect for my Rossi pump .22, a Winchester 62 cone, thing is, it looks brain dead simple to make out of a machined eye bolt, with, say a 5mm hole for threading for the apertures, a lock nut and an o-ring for the sum total of $5 worth of parts from the hardware store.
    Twist for elevation and drift the front for windage.

    Drilling and tapping the top of the bolt is the only hang up, I have an engineer friend who has the capability to do it, but he's not a gun guy and I don't want to butcher a fun plinker by trial and error drilling. How does one go about centreing the hole and aligning it to the bore on a rounded and tapered surface? Or should I just find a gunsmith to do it for me (rare as hens teeth and expensive down here).

    Find a competent gun smith and pay him $30-$40 to do it right. You'll be glad you did. Not that you're not capable but if you're not capable, but someone that does it once in a while is far less likely to **** it up than someone who has never done it.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • jaywaptijaywapti Senior Member Posts: 4,958 Senior Member
    The hardest part is finding dead center, best done on a milling machine with a dial indicator, than I either spot drill with a small center drill or use a center punch, hi-speed or cobalt drills and taps will work for most receivers, on very hard or case hardened ones, I either spot anneal or use carbide drills and taps. Any good machinist should be able to do the job, remember your not paying him to drill some holes, but for his expertice and knowledge of doing it right.

    JAY
    THE DEFINITION OF GUN CONTROL IS HITTING THE TARGET WITH YOUR FIRST SHOT
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    Tape measure and a hand drill. Take a drink or two before you do it to steady your nerves.
    Overkill is underrated.
  • Big Al1Big Al1 Senior Member Posts: 7,826 Senior Member
    I have a Forester jig, but that's a pricey set up for two holes. A good machinist should be able to set it up properly on a milling machine. Then you only need the proper drill and tap. Of course complete disassembly is required.
    The Skinner is a good sight, I have one on my 1893 Marlin in .32-40, love it.
  • TugarTugar Senior Member Posts: 2,222 Senior Member
    Snake hit it on the head. Unless you are looking for experience, get a gunsmith to do it. Some actions are more of a pain to do than others. Just ask anyone that has done any Mauser actions how many bits they broke.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
    Winston Churchill
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Redneck method:

    Use a piece of 1/2" square key stock and drill and tap two holes about 1/4" wider than the part you intend to drill. Install bolts with the heads cut off into these holes and lock them into place with a thread locking liquid such as Loctite. Drill a hole exactly halfway between the threaded holes just big enough to be a snug fit for a 1/4" "transfer punch". Secure the part you want to drill in a vise. Twist the fixture snugly against the sides of the part and be sure it's level with a small bubble level. Insert the transfer punch and tap it firmly with a small hammer. The punch mark will be dead center of the part, regardless of its shape. Drill and tap!
    Jerry
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 7,941 Senior Member
    Gorilla glue.

    No offence, Bream.
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 13,493 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    Gorilla glue.

    No offence, Bream.
    I guess if you're not allowed to use power tools, an adhesive is allowable...
    Overkill is underrated.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Youi could attach a fine-thread 5MM nut to the top of the slide with AcraGlas or some other type of high-strength epoxy, then screw a bolt into the nut to act as the aperture holder. Simply drilling a hole into the shank of the bolt will eliminate the need for an aperture, and a small setscrew through the side of the nut will allow for an elevation adjustment 1/2 turn of the bolt at a time. You might have to change the height of the front sight for a coarse elevation adjustment.
    Jerry
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    Hammer and nails?
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • JasonMPDJasonMPD Senior Member Posts: 6,557 Senior Member
    waipapa13 wrote: »
    Yep, I've googled and looked at other forums, I know that the Forster is what the pros use. Do you use one in your operation? I just wonder if there is a redneck way to get a halfway decent result, if I have to pay the money, I have to pay, I get that.

    I don't use one. All the receivers I deal with are already D&T. I may buy a Forster jig down the road, but it'll likely be moot once I get a vertical mill and a solid Kurt vice.
    “There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 22,394 Senior Member
    Tugar wrote: »
    Snake hit it on the head. Unless you are looking for experience, get a gunsmith to do it. Some actions are more of a pain to do than others. Just ask anyone that has done any Mauser actions how many bits they broke.

    Yes Bro Tugar, such procedures go better with an experienced hand.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • waipapa13waipapa13 Senior Member Posts: 838 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    Redneck method:

    Use a piece of 1/2" square key stock and drill and tap two holes about 1/4" wider than the part you intend to drill. Install bolts with the heads cut off into these holes and lock them into place with a thread locking liquid such as Loctite. Drill a hole exactly halfway between the threaded holes just big enough to be a snug fit for a 1/4" "transfer punch". Secure the part you want to drill in a vise. Twist the fixture snugly against the sides of the part and be sure it's level with a small bubble level. Insert the transfer punch and tap it firmly with a small hammer. The punch mark will be dead center of the part, regardless of its shape. Drill and tap!
    Jerry

    Many Thanks Jerry, if I attempt it I'll use your method, A jig like yours is within my level of skill, a trial run with epoxy is probably a good idea too.
    I think Breams offering to hold my beer so what could possibly go wrong? :tooth:
  • waipapa13waipapa13 Senior Member Posts: 838 Senior Member
    Thanks to everyone else too, I know a gunsmith or a Forster jig or mill is the standard right way of doing it, I'm just not keen to send the money on holes and sights when I could spend it on ammo on the rare weekends I can get away to shoot, plus I like homemade solutions and work arounds.

    The gun in question was $120 in good condition and it is a plinking toy, it is third or fourth choice when I need an accurate .22, it's great fun popping cans and shooting old plough discs with it and all I'm after is an increase in the fun factor, not cloverleaf groups.
    I'm thinking it might also be a learner rifle for me to try out some basic gun smithing, like restocking it, which doesnt look as daunting as a full stock to do , and rust bluing, just having some cheap fun learning new skills and hopefully/maybe ending up with a cool little customised rifle.
  • waipapa13waipapa13 Senior Member Posts: 838 Senior Member
    The square and scribe method was my first thought as well, it'd be a good way to double check too. The top is very softly rounded, with an ever so slight (maybe unintentional) taper front to back.
  • waipapa13waipapa13 Senior Member Posts: 838 Senior Member
    Whole thing, very slightly, unevenly as well.
  • sarg1csarg1c Senior Member Posts: 1,707 Senior Member
    To find the center of a round object to drill with a drill press, simple level the piece in a drill press vice, next with a bit in the chuck, simply move the part under the bit until the bit just touches the part. this is the highest point and center of the round object. BE SURE the part is level Verticlely and horizontaly. Use a small bit and when the part is marked, simply dimple the part berfore changing bit to proper size. On a hardened gun receiver, use a colbalt drill bit. or spot anneal the area. to prevent breaking bit off in the work piece which could create a problem. once the hole is drilled, do not remove piece from drill press, change the bit whith the tap you intend to use DO NOT RUN DRILL, just turn the chuck by hand using a good tapping oil with very little pressure to tap hole .There is a tool with a handle that fits a drill press . Remember , a small tap can be easy to break. If the top is flat then the post s above is the way to go. a good way is to find someone with a centerfinder used to drill a shotgun barrel or rib to use as pattern to make a larger centerfinder. . simplele a flat bar with three holes the two outside holes have a pin in them and the center hole is the one used to mark or drill hole
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