Won my subrogation arbitration

JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior MemberPosts: 6,659 Senior Member
Last May, I was involved in a fender bender. After waiting at a stop sign for crossing traffic to clear, I started straight through the intersection only to be hit by an oncoming vehicle that turned left into me. My car was hit mostly in the driver side front fender, with a little damage to the passenger door. No one was hurt, thankfully.

An officer arrived at the scene and cited the other driver with wreckless driving. I did not get a ticket. At that point, I figured it was a slam dunk as to which party was liable, and expected her insurance company to fix my car.

I was wrong.

The other driver was insured by good ol' Flo (Progressive), and claimed I was 100% responsible because their driver entered the intersection first. This may be have been true, as she had to ease out into the intersection to see around a vehicle parked to her right. They argued some arcane law that stated she had the right of way due to this.

Any way, I filed with my insurance company, paid my $500 deductible and got my car fixed. The body shop we used is very good, and you can't tell the car was ever wrecked.

My insurance company (American Family) subrogated the claim to Progressive, and the case went to arbitration. I learned earlier this week that we won, and that the other driver was deemed 100% responsible. Progressive is 100% liable for the damages, and I'll be getting my $500 back.

$500 isn't enough to make us or break us, but it's not pocket change, either. There's also a principle involved, and I'm very glad we won for that reason as well. Needless to say, I have a very low opinion of Progressive Insurance, and hope I never have to deal with Flo and her pals ever again.

I've been holding back on posting this until I knew the outcome. Now that it's a done deal, I thought I would share.
Jerry

Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.

Replies

  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,767 Senior Member
    I'm glad it all worked out in your favor, but I'm not sure I see the difference between her insurer trying to get out of paying it, or yours. It seems that they backed up their client. Of course, her rates will probably go up, and yours won't.
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 7,436 Senior Member
    Congrats on winning this one, Jerry. It seem like standard procedure for insurance companies to pull these sorts of capers.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    My insurance agent knows better than to even mention Progressive as an option, regardless of price. Isn't "progressive" one of the dummycraps' buzzwords? Guess where that company makes all of its political contributions? I don't wear Levi's, or support the Sierra Club, either!
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 6,659 Senior Member
    bisley wrote: »
    It seems that they backed up their client. Of course, her rates will probably go up, and yours won't.

    I see it differently. To me, it was Progressive trying to weasel out of paying a claim they rightfully should have paid without making me and my insurance jump through their hoops. As for whether or not my rates will go up, I don't know. I don't think they should, but one never knows with insurance companies. Also, I will be getting my $500 deductible back.

    Now, Progressive is out the cost of the claim, as well as the cost of arbitration. That's probably pocket change to a big insurance company, though.

    If I did not have collision insurance, the cost would have been all mine, and it would cost more to fight it than it was worth. In other words, I would have been royally screwed when I was in the right.

    Honestly, I don't know why Progressive took the position they did. Maybe it's SOP for them to deny such claims in hopes that the other party doesn't have good enough coverage to fight it, or will just eat the deductible. It could also be a case of an overly ambitious claims adjuster and her manager trying to score points with their company.

    Whatever the case, what they did was wrong, and they got their wrists slapped.

    One last thing. Would you feel the same if you had been in my shoes?
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • zorbazorba Senior Member Posts: 20,164 Senior Member
    Insurance companies are the scum of the earth. 5 years ago, I got T-boned in the old MBZ to the tune of $3,800. State Farm spent a considerable amount of time and effort trying to total my car - I told them "not only 'No', but 'HELL NO!'". It took me 5 weeks to convince them of the error of their ways. THEN they STILL wanted to total my car for $5,800! Body shop guy told me SF had totaled a car for $3,000 that only had an $1,800 repair bill - what's up with that?
    -Zorba, "The Veiled Male"

    "If you get it and didn't work for it, someone else worked for it and didn't get it..."
  • Six-GunSix-Gun Senior Member Posts: 7,436 Senior Member
    I can't see how your rates would go up. You were formally cleared and the net cost to the company (for the arbitration and accident, at least) was $0. Of course, that doesn't factor in wages for the people who worked the claim, etc., but in the end, you have no fault and shouldn't see a cost adjustment against you.
    Accuracy: because white space between bullet holes drives me insane.
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 19,140 Senior Member
    A lot of (most) insurance companies try to come across as "a friend" when their main goal is making money.

    Kind of like these companies that promise not to raise your rates if you have an accident, and give you a "safe driver discount" or safe driving "bonus". So, technically, they don't raise your rates, they just keep all the money you pay them, instead of giving some of it back. So the bottom line is, they're keeping more of your money (raising your rates) without actually increasing the amount you pay them.

    Glad things worked out for you Jerry :up:
    My parent's had something similar a few years ago. Lady blew through a red light and clipped the front of their car (admitted to the cop she didn't see the light). Her insurance company told my dad that he was 15% responsible and they'd pay 85%. Dad told them what they could do with their 85% and let them know he'd get a lawyer, they told him, "A lawyer will cost you more than the 15%" to which dad told them he didn't care if it cost more than the car.

    It actually only cost him $5 to have our cousin (a personal injury lawyer) have his secretary write a letter and fax it to them. Amazingly, they decided they could pay 100% the next day (other than changing the rental company for a loaner car. The one they paid for was closer and $7/day cheaper)
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • JerryBobCoJerryBobCo Senior Member Posts: 6,659 Senior Member
    I've seen a couple of responses to the effect that the insurance company is just trying to back up their client.

    GIMME A BREAK!

    They could not care less about their client. All they care about is their bottom line. Either way they win. They win the arbitration and don't have to pay the claim, or they lose the arbitration and raise their client's rates.

    BTW, I have no illusions that my insurance company cares about me, either. It's all a racket due to most states requiring auto insurance (New Hampshire, as I recently learned, is an exception).
    Jerry

    Gun control laws make about as much sense as taking ex-lax to cure a cough.
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,767 Senior Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    Whatever the case, what they did was wrong, and they got their wrists slapped.

    One last thing. Would you feel the same if you had been in my shoes?

    My point was simply that both insurance companies simply did what insurance companies do, to everybody, every day - try to get out of paying. You were 'in the right' and you won. Progressive should have paid, but their client feels like they stood up for her, and they will recover their expenses with higher rates that she will probably pay. They all play the odds and 'the house' always comes out ahead.

    No criticism was intended.
  • JayJay Senior Member Posts: 3,333 Senior Member
    Had a similar situation when my ex was hit years ago. Same sort of incident. Light turned green, my ex was going straight through the intersection, teenage girl on a cell phone had a green light, but not green arrow, but turned anyway. Hit my ex on the drivers side fender as well.

    The other car was owned by the girl's parents. Apparently, she called them as soon as the wreck happened and they showed up at the scene. First thing dad did was light into her for driving the car when she knew she wasn't supposed to. Their insurance company denied the claim because they said the girl was not authorized to drive that vehicle. One of those little $69 per month auto insurance deals. We had GEICO. I filed it with them as an uninsured motorist claim, they got the car fixed up good as new. Ex had some neck pain following the accident and saw a doctor. GEICO took care of that too. We got an attorney who sued the parents, since the girl was under 18. GEICO went after the insurance company. GEICO got nothing from them. We got a small settlement that was enough to cover copay, deductible and out of pocket medical expenses. Good with me. Maybe that girl will think a little more before driving a car she's not supposed to while talking on the cell phone and not paying attention to her driving. I doubt it....

    ETA - I personally really like GEICO. They have been really good to me, have not raised my rates at all in many years and took care of us quickly and without a single issue and they communicated with us through the process. They sent us letters pretty frequently updating us on the case against the other insurance company and let us know the final outcome. Really good communication. At least for us. And I get a decent little discount for being a government employee. (Government Employees Insurance COmpany)
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 10,392 Senior Member
    I've spent a great deal of time talking to insurance companies. Of course they're in business to make money, don't see anything wrong with that.

    Cops don't figure who's at fault. Can't do that. They figure out if someone was breaking traffic laws, but the insurance companies can decide in a moment who's at fault. If it's their client, they generally contact the other insurance company to try to reach an agreement. If there is an arcane law that wasn't taken into consideration, they've got lawyers to try to save their company money.

    You'll get your $500 back, but the longer the insurance company hold on to your money, the more interest they can draw off it.

    This week, Allstate sent me a check for a pretty nice bit of cash for an overpayment. I've had Allstate for at least 30 years and have (knock on wood) never filed a claim. If I had it to do over, I might look for a bargain insurance company, except I don't think there is such a thing.
    Not too many problems you can't fix
    With a 1911 and a 30-06
  • jaywaptijaywapti Senior Member Posts: 4,611 Senior Member
    With 65 years of driving I have had quite a few Ins. Co. by far the worst was Allstate and Liberty mutual, the best by far is Geico, I had 2 minor accidents , my fault, they fixed both trucks, no hassle, and never increased my rate. In spite of the good service I know that they are not my friend. IMO Ins. Co. are one step lower than politicians .

    JAY
    THE DEFINITION OF GUN CONTROL IS HITTING THE TARGET WITH YOUR FIRST SHOT
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    Ive never liked Flo.

    All that gaudy red lipstick. She's a hussy.
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • Gene LGene L Senior Member Posts: 10,392 Senior Member
    I LOVE Flo. Her commercials are great. The gaudy red lipstick and retro hairdo are perfect.

    In those "Flo's Family" commercials, she plays ALL the parts. They're inspired.
    Not too many problems you can't fix
    With a 1911 and a 30-06
  • earlyearly Senior Member Posts: 4,950 Senior Member
    Gene L wrote: »
    I LOVE Flo. Her commercials are great. The gaudy red lipstick and retro hairdo are perfect.

    In those "Flo's Family" commercials, she plays ALL the parts. They're inspired.

    :rotflmao:
    My thoughts are generally clear. My typing, not so much.
  • Make_My_DayMake_My_Day Senior Member Posts: 7,235 Senior Member
    Teach wrote: »
    My insurance agent knows better than to even mention Progressive as an option, regardless of price. Isn't "progressive" one of the dummycraps' buzzwords? Guess where that company makes all of its political contributions? I don't wear Levi's, or support the Sierra Club, either!
    Jerry
    Yes, Progressive is a big contributor to left-wing programs and candidates. I wouldn't touch them no matter how cheap their insurance was.
    JOE MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT:
    THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE NEW COMMUNISTS!
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 24,003 Senior Member
    good news
    A Veteran is someone that served in the Military, it does not matter where they served.
  • Jeff in TXJeff in TX Senior Member Posts: 1,638 Senior Member
    Great news glad to hear it all worked out in your favor. Insurance companies are looking for any angle now. When I go to the doctor before they'll pay I have to fill out a questionnaire asking if it was work related or someone else fault. It's a pain but I can see their point.
    Distance is not an issue, but the wind can make it interesting!

    John 3: 1-21
  • JeeperJeeper Senior Member Posts: 2,952 Senior Member
    Wambli Ska wrote: »
    Actually Progressive is very good insurance exactly for that reason, they will fight for the folks that have them. I had All-State (THE WORST insurance company in the world) and I had a minor fender bender which without going into the full details was quite frankly no one's fault. The total damages came up to about $500 to the other person's car. All-State decided to make ME 100% liable for the accident and raised my insurance rates $400 a year for 3 years!!! I could have just paid for the damage to the other car and saved myself a lot of money and aggravation.

    Were you not required to carry insurance, you could just pocket the $2000+ per year, and easily pay a $500 out of pocket expense without blinking an eye.

    Vehicle insurance the third biggest scam going in this country right now... after health care and taxes.

    Luis
    Wielding the Hammer of Thor first requires you to lift and carry the Hammer of Thor. - Bigslug
  • alphasigmookiealphasigmookie Senior Member Posts: 8,862 Senior Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    Were you not required to carry insurance, you could just pocket the $2000+ per year, and easily pay a $500 out of pocket expense without blinking an eye.

    Vehicle insurance the third biggest scam going in this country right now... after health care and taxes.

    Luis
    Except of course when you need it like I'm learning right now. Hospital bills haven't started to come in yet, but total cost of the accident my girlfriend and I were in last week is probably going to be more than a lifetime of car insurance premiums. I'm also guessing there is zero probability that the trucker who hit us would ever be able come close to paying out of pocket.
    "Finding out that you have run out of toilet paper is a good example of lack of preparation, buying 10 years worth is silly"
    -DoctorWho
  • dlddld Member Posts: 381 Member
    JerryBobCo wrote: »
    $500 isn't enough to make us or break us, but it's not pocket change, either. There's also a principle involved,

    that there is a good down payment on a new gun, or a used one
  • TeachTeach Senior Member Posts: 18,428 Senior Member
    Jeeper wrote: »
    Were you not required to carry insurance, you could just pocket the $2000+ per year, and easily pay a $500 out of pocket expense without blinking an eye.

    Good luck with that when the fender bender happens with a school bus and a dozen single parents on welfare and their ambulance chaser lawyers conspire to nail your hide to the wall financially for the emotional trauma their little brats experienced!
    Jerry
    Hide and wail in terror, Eloi- - - -We Morlocks are on the hunt!
    ASK-HOLE Someone who asks for advice and always does something opposite
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