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bullsi1911
Posts: 12,428 Senior Member
The FBI backs me up- USE A HOLSTER!
bullsi1911
Posts: 12,428 Senior Member
Something I have harped on a few times here for us CHL/ CCW holders is "ALWAYS carry in a holster." It's safer. It's better for the gun, and makes it easier to draw in stress, but it was my belief that it showed you as being 'not a dirtbag'.
In my 20 years of carrying, I made it a practice when talking to cops about guns to see if they had ever taken a gun from a criminal that carried in a holster. The answer was always the same- No. People that carry in holsters are cops, legal citizens, and private security. In my mind, this means that having your gun in a holster is not just safer and smart, but it gives you instant "Good Guy" cred with any cops you might encounter in a stressful situation.
Then I came across this while reading the sites this morning:
http://www.bluesheepdog.com/2007/10/10/is-he-carrying-a-gun-more-on-spotting-an-armed-suspect/
In a 15 year study by the FBI, the conclusion is made: "The authors discovered that none of the offenders they interviewed, in 15 years of research, ever used a holster to carry their firearms"
So- Use a holster. It is not just safer, and makes it easier to draw in stress, but it shows the cops that you AREN'T a criminal if you are ever being detained.
In my 20 years of carrying, I made it a practice when talking to cops about guns to see if they had ever taken a gun from a criminal that carried in a holster. The answer was always the same- No. People that carry in holsters are cops, legal citizens, and private security. In my mind, this means that having your gun in a holster is not just safer and smart, but it gives you instant "Good Guy" cred with any cops you might encounter in a stressful situation.
Then I came across this while reading the sites this morning:
http://www.bluesheepdog.com/2007/10/10/is-he-carrying-a-gun-more-on-spotting-an-armed-suspect/
In a 15 year study by the FBI, the conclusion is made: "The authors discovered that none of the offenders they interviewed, in 15 years of research, ever used a holster to carry their firearms"
So- Use a holster. It is not just safer, and makes it easier to draw in stress, but it shows the cops that you AREN'T a criminal if you are ever being detained.
To make something simple is a thousand times more difficult than to make something complex.
-Mikhail Kalashnikov
-Mikhail Kalashnikov
Replies
over the past 15 years" with footnote 1. It's not a 15-year study. I found all 3 studies by the authors from the footnote and had put some information in the parentheses.
http://www.valorforblue.org/Home/Publications/Soft_Body_Armor_FBI_Law_Enforcement_Bulletin.pdf (published in 1992, 54 deaths)
http://www.policemag.com/resources/Design-Elements/FBI-In-the-Line-of-Fire.pdf (published in 1997, 52 victims of assaults were studied)
http://www.pdsdc.org/Resources/SLD/Violent%20Encounters,%20A%20Study%20of%20Felonious%20Assaults%20on%20Our%20Nation%27s%20Law%20Enforcement%20Officers%20by%20DOJ.pdf (published in 2006, 40 incidents involving 43 offenders)
Overall, approximately 150 criminals were interviewed/studied in the 3 studies. I won't dispute the claim that all 150 did not wear holster, I think it's important to look at the numbers used and the actual duration of the study. By the way, all 3 studies are interesting reads, as well as the March, 2006 bulletin referencing the studies.
Al
The one exception is a .38spl derrringer I carry in my riding vest pocket as a backup while on the moterbike.
I do agree with Paul if my CCW card doesn't convince the LEOs I'm ok why would a piece of leather?
-96 lbs
I spent a lot of years as an LEO and I will say this, no matter what FBI STATISTICS show: When encountering someone with a gun, no matter WHERE it has been placed, or how, on his person . . . I wouldn't trust his behavior, or him, as I far as I could see him!
I suppose I could see the point you made, but keep in mind that most of the homeboys on the streets are not the kind most LEOs encounter!
I've never seen a scum-bag yet with a nice El Paso Saddelry holster caressing his
Saturday Night Special!
The point is that is another key in a stressful situation that will make you look on the side of right, and not a homeboy carrying illegally. Take it as you will. Carrying in a holster is safer, tactically better, and one small piece is that dirtbags DON'T carry in a holster. Just another part of why you should carry in one.
-Mikhail Kalashnikov
My favorite holster for speed and when I wasn't UC was (for a 1911) an Askins Avenger, which I still prefer today, although I very seldom carry a full-size pistol.
It is needed to be state, too, that someone who isn't using a holster is not necessarily a criminal.
I think the actual FBI bulletin/article is worth the read. It has a lot more information on profiling a potential criminals, including how they dress, behave, and act, sometimes in a certain way because they were carrying a gun without a holster. The "none of the criminals in the studies used holsters" was almost a side point to the article, and was rather just a simple observation that the authors did not draw any conclusions from (especially anything remotely suggesting that "no holster" = criminal). We are definitely reading into this "no holsters" too much, way beyond what the article actually observed and concluded.
Al
State law.
I was wondering the same. I found this regarding Ohio (I think Gene is in CA though).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29#Ohio
Al
Department policy is not State law, it is that LE regulation.
I will relate an incident:
I stopped to aid a motorist stopped on the westbound Brooklyn Queens expwy one afternoon, unmarked unit, non uniform, as I approached the vehicle, it had two occupants both females,
Two males were approaching from a vehicle parked ahead, 1980's blue chevy Impala NYS plate XXX-000, the first male had a revolver in his waistband, My first impression perhaps it was a NYCPD Officer stopping to render aid, however as soon as they saw Me they bolted and hopped back into their vehicle and took off.
I called it in on citywide and the pair were stopped by a highway unit a mile downwind, they passed the unit going pretty fast.
That is the original Ohio law that has since been changed as of Sept 30 of this year. As of now, when in a vehical, the firearm can be in a holster on our person or laying on the seat in plain sight. It can also be in the console or glove compt.
Denny
I disagree 100% with that statement.
It's no longer a law. Changed in the last 3 or so years.
it shows the cops that you AREN'T a criminal if you are ever being detained."
The Police may detain and or handcuff you, while they determine if you are a criminal, as they check the criminal database records.
That adds credence to the citizens of Tombstones claim that the OK Corral Gunfight was a case of murder and police brutality. Billy Clanton and Frank McLaury wore revolvers in holsters on their belts and stood alongside saddled horses with rifles in their scabbards. The Earps carried revolvers in their coat pockets, and in their waistbands.
Dirtbags don't use holsters because in an emergency they can ditch the gun quickly, but it's more difficult to ditch the holster.
No idea why someone Necrothread'ed this thread...
-Mikhail Kalashnikov