Late to the party here. I have been considering this a lot since social media has been blowing up about it. I think the jury got it right...I think "justice" here is for that officer to lose his job and never be hired in an LEO capacity at any level again. I think a very large monetary settlement ($5million+) and a public formal apology by the police chief and city/state leadership be issued to the family of the deceased as well as a review of the training policies as it relates to instances like these.
I do NOT think putting the guy in jail would have been the answer. I would think there would have to be malicious intent, or a chain of behavior, that was corrected by leadership, that this officer willfully ignored in order to merit prison. I don't believe you can ask someone to do the job, a very dangerous job, and then hang them out to dry if it was a mistake, even a fatal one. For me, I'll assume it was a terrible mistake unless they can prove otherwise, which by the jury's decision I don't believe they could.
Late to the party here. I have been considering this a lot since social media has been blowing up about it. I think the jury got it right...I think "justice" here is for that officer to lose his job and never be hired in an LEO capacity at any level again. I think a very large monetary settlement ($5million+) and a public formal apology by the police chief and city/state leadership be issued to the family of the deceased as well as a review of the training policies as it relates to instances like these.
I do NOT think putting the guy in jail would have been the answer. I would think there would have to be malicious intent, or a chain of behavior, that was corrected by leadership, that this officer willfully ignored in order to merit prison. I don't believe you can ask someone to do the job, a very dangerous job, and then hang them out to dry if it was a mistake, even a fatal one. For me, I'll assume it was a terrible mistake unless they can prove otherwise, which by the jury's decision I don't believe they could.
Yeah, Graham v. Connor gave the cops “use of force must be judged from the perspective of a reasonable officer on the scene, rather than with the 20/20 vision of hindsight.”
This explains why about a dozen cops were tried for murder or manslaughter in the last few years without a conviction.
When our governing officials dismiss due process as mere semantics, when they exercise powers they don’t have and ignore duties they actually bear, and when we let them get away with it, we have ceased to be our own rulers.
Dashcam video has now been released. Listening to Yanez after the shooting provides context, but it still doesn't demonstrate that his actions were appropriate, IMO.
Like I said, I'm no alarmist, but this is really troubling. We can't see in the video what the officer saw that led him to believe that Castille might shoot him, but the general tenor of the interaction does not convey confrontation, or conflict, or hostility. These situations jump off quickly; I get that. But this was too quick for me.
I can't honestly say what charge I would have voted to convict on; I'd have to read the laws of Minnesota more closely to determine that.
I definitely agree that he shouldn't be a cop. Beyond that, the video doesn't show malicious intent.
Knowledge is essential to living freely and fully; understanding gives knowledge purpose and strength; wisdom is combining the two and applying them appropriately in words and actions.
Dashcam video has now been released. Listening to Yanez after the shooting provides context, but it still doesn't demonstrate that his actions were appropriate, IMO.
Like I said, I'm no alarmist, but this is really troubling. We can't see in the video what the officer saw that led him to believe that Castille might shoot him, but the general tenor of the interaction does not convey confrontation, or conflict, or hostility. These situations jump off quickly; I get that. But this was too quick for me.
I can't honestly say what charge I would have voted to convict on; I'd have to read the laws of Minnesota more closely to determine that.
I definitely agree that he shouldn't be a cop. Beyond that, the video doesn't show malicious intent.
With the luxury of hindsight available to us, I'd have to say I agree. My first impression of this incident was that the officer panicked, seeing the dashcam video reinforces that impression. He was absolutely convinced that Castille was intent on doing him harm. In his mind, the police Chaplin was already at the front door to tell his next of kin.
"Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
George Carlin
36 years of being a LEO taught me that every story is like a pancake, no matter how thin it is, there are always two sides, and none of us were there. robin
I don't often talk to people that voted for Obama, but when I do I order large fries!
Life member of the American Legion, the VFW, the NRA and the Masonic Lodge, retired LEO
Now the NRA is being criticized for not standing up for the guy who including by Martha MaCallum on Fox news who just said they are not being very "Brave" for remaining quite.
That is absurd because they will be dammed if they do and dammed if they don't.
It was up to a jury and they made their decision. We may not all agree with it and it kinda sucks the young man got killed when he was being upfront with the cop he had a gun. He should have put his hands on the steering wheel and informed the cop I have a gun and a permit. How do you want me to proceed and show you my permit and drivers license?
Maybe the cop should have done something like step back and give him commands I dunno. It was a bad situation any way you look at it.
He could have waited to see what the driver was retrieving with his gun drawn or a 100 other things. I thought they would find him guilty of something...............it was a young black man and in today's racially charged atmosphere.............like Hawken said we weren't there and hindsight is 20/20.
It's only true if it's on this forum where opinions are facts and facts are opinions
Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
If he said he had a gun, then reached down with numerous commands to keep his hands visible, all apparently not obeyed, at what point is the officer supposed to act? The gun half way up, first shots? First hit to the chest?
He already handed over his ID and permit. What else would the deceased have to reach for? He wasn't asked to get out of the car. Why would he reach for his seat belt? And the officer had a suspicion the deceased was a possible armed robbery suspect. The image of the actual robber look strikingly similar to the deceased.
A jury of his peers made a decision. I'm just playing devil's advocate.
“There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
If he said he had a gun, then reached down with numerous commands to keep his hands visible, all apparently not obeyed, at what point is the officer supposed to act? The gun half way up, first shots? First hit to the chest?
He already handed over his ID and permit. What else would the deceased have to reach for? He wasn't asked to get out of the car. Why would he reach for his seat belt? And the officer had a suspicion the deceased was a possible armed robbery suspect. The image of the actual robber look strikingly similar to the deceased.
A jury of his peers made a decision. I'm just playing devil's advocate.
My understanding is that he handed over the registration and proof of insurance. The license was not yet handed over. His 'reaching' was a result of being to hand over his license.
"Bipartisan" usually means that a bigger than normal deception is happening.
George Carlin
When do the burnings and lootings begin? I haven't been following this, but I can just imagine. As well as a huge settlement for his family.
The media likes ANTIFA now, not BLM. BLM is all but a dead issue.
“There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.” – Will Rogers
No matter what the name of the week happens to be, they're all the same bunch of mercenary rabble-rousers, financed by the same people. Occupy Wall Street- - - -BLM- - - - -ANTIFA- - - -might as well admit the truth and call them the George Soros Gang! Until a few dozen of them end up at room temperature with big leaky holes in them, they're going to continue to stir the pot.
I'm waiting for a few of their victims to unload some 30 round magazines into the crowd that's attacking them with baseball bats, bicycle locks, rocks and bricks. Bringing a Louisville Slugger to a gunfight is going to be pretty ineffective, but the next riot they're told to incite will probably be understaffed.
Jerry
Replies
I do NOT think putting the guy in jail would have been the answer. I would think there would have to be malicious intent, or a chain of behavior, that was corrected by leadership, that this officer willfully ignored in order to merit prison. I don't believe you can ask someone to do the job, a very dangerous job, and then hang them out to dry if it was a mistake, even a fatal one. For me, I'll assume it was a terrible mistake unless they can prove otherwise, which by the jury's decision I don't believe they could.
Yeah, Graham v. Connor gave the cops “use of force must be judged from the perspective of a reasonable officer on the scene, rather than with the 20/20 vision of hindsight.”
This explains why about a dozen cops were tried for murder or manslaughter in the last few years without a conviction.
Adam J. McCleod
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/06/20/philando-castile-shooting-police-car-dashcam-footage-released.html
Like I said, I'm no alarmist, but this is really troubling. We can't see in the video what the officer saw that led him to believe that Castille might shoot him, but the general tenor of the interaction does not convey confrontation, or conflict, or hostility. These situations jump off quickly; I get that. But this was too quick for me.
I can't honestly say what charge I would have voted to convict on; I'd have to read the laws of Minnesota more closely to determine that.
I definitely agree that he shouldn't be a cop. Beyond that, the video doesn't show malicious intent.
With the luxury of hindsight available to us, I'd have to say I agree. My first impression of this incident was that the officer panicked, seeing the dashcam video reinforces that impression. He was absolutely convinced that Castille was intent on doing him harm. In his mind, the police Chaplin was already at the front door to tell his next of kin.
George Carlin
Life member of the American Legion, the VFW, the NRA and the Masonic Lodge, retired LEO
That is absurd because they will be dammed if they do and dammed if they don't.
It was up to a jury and they made their decision. We may not all agree with it and it kinda sucks the young man got killed when he was being upfront with the cop he had a gun. He should have put his hands on the steering wheel and informed the cop I have a gun and a permit. How do you want me to proceed and show you my permit and drivers license?
Maybe the cop should have done something like step back and give him commands I dunno. It was a bad situation any way you look at it.
He could have waited to see what the driver was retrieving with his gun drawn or a 100 other things. I thought they would find him guilty of something...............it was a young black man and in today's racially charged atmosphere.............like Hawken said we weren't there and hindsight is 20/20.
Words of wisdom from Big Chief: Flush twice, it's a long way to the Mess Hall
I'd rather have my sister work in a whorehouse than own another Taurus!
He already handed over his ID and permit. What else would the deceased have to reach for? He wasn't asked to get out of the car. Why would he reach for his seat belt? And the officer had a suspicion the deceased was a possible armed robbery suspect. The image of the actual robber look strikingly similar to the deceased.
A jury of his peers made a decision. I'm just playing devil's advocate.
My understanding is that he handed over the registration and proof of insurance. The license was not yet handed over. His 'reaching' was a result of being to hand over his license.
George Carlin
When do the burnings and lootings begin? I haven't been following this, but I can just imagine. As well as a huge settlement for his family.
The media likes ANTIFA now, not BLM. BLM is all but a dead issue.
I'm waiting for a few of their victims to unload some 30 round magazines into the crowd that's attacking them with baseball bats, bicycle locks, rocks and bricks. Bringing a Louisville Slugger to a gunfight is going to be pretty ineffective, but the next riot they're told to incite will probably be understaffed.
Jerry