You can make a .308 Win into a Blackout.........

ZeeZee Senior MemberPosts: 19,443 Senior Member
But you can’t make a .300 Blackout into a .308 Winchester. 

Trying to make a reduced load for my boy to use handgun hunting next season. Using my .308 Win BA Specialty Pistol. 



I found this in the Hornady Handloading Manual:



I just happen to have some 110gr Nosler Varmageddon bullets on hand. So, I used Hodgdon reduced H4895 load data and guesstimated some test loads for slowing the bullet down to .300 BO velocities. 



Gonna try 41 & 43gr tomorrow and see how fast they are going. My goal is 2,200-2,400fps with as little recoil as possible. 

Stay tuned. 
"To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
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Replies

  • Farm Boy DeuceFarm Boy Deuce Senior Member Posts: 5,994 Senior Member
    So.... don’t you have an Contender .30-30 barrel? 
    I am afraid we forget sometime that the basic and simple things brings us the most pleasure.
    Dad 5-31-13
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    So.... don’t you have an Contender .30-30 barrel? 
    Yeah. I already have a reduced load worked up for that gun running 2,000 fps and the bullet penetrated 2 water jugs and stopped in the 3rd with full expansion at 60 yards. 


    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • jbohiojbohio Senior Member Posts: 5,382 Senior Member
    That's a pretty interesting endeavor.  
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 6,658 Senior Member
    Hmmmmm. . .

    I know they and their expense aren't your normal thing, but the 110 grain Barnes might be just the ticket for this.  It's going to give you the recoil threshold you want for the little guy, and we know there's plenty of penetration despite the reduced speed.

    I'm thinking your cheap practice bullet option is going to be to find someone selling bulk FMJ M1 carbine bullets.

    This sounds like FUN!
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    I’ll stick with the bullets I have and maybe get some 110gr V-Max. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    edited April 6 #7
    Zedrick, to test the "300 BO solid copper HPs" (From midsouth shooters supply) before I built my BO, I loaded them with 39.0 of H4895 in the wife's Ruger compact 308 (16.5" barrel)

    Here's a copy of my chronograph data
    Created: 11-03-2017 12:23:52
    Description: 125schp 39.0 H4895
    Shots
    #     FPS        FT-LBS     PF
    7     2373       0.00       0.00     
    6     2361       0.00       0.00     
    5     2345       0.00       0.00     
    4     2336       0.00       0.00     
    3     2356       0.00       0.00     
    2     2339       0.00       0.00     
    1     2323       0.00       0.00     
    Average: 2347.57
    StdDev: 16.91
    Min: 2323
    Max: 2373
    Spread: 50
    True MV: 2347.57

    For what it's worth, those bullets perform nicely at that velocity, at least they did on the 2 deer she killed this past season.
     If you're interested, all they have left are the 100 packs  for $32.99

    They're also VERY accurate in the Ruger AND my BO. They're the most accurate bullet I've tried in the wife's rifle.
    https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/00247p300schp100/300-blackout-point308-diameter-125-grain-solid-copper-hollow-point-(schp-projectile)-100-count






    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    Thanks. I’ll try what I have for now. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    Thanks. I’ll try what I have for now. 
    No worries, mainly wanted to give you an idea of the velocities.

    For comparison, here's 40.0gr of H4895 and a 125 Nosler Ballistic Tip (It has worked well for her on deer also)
    Shots
    #     FPS        FT-LBS     PF
    5     2292       0.00       0.00     
    4     2282       0.00       0.00     
    3     2381       0.00       0.00     
    2     2330       0.00       0.00     
    1     2380       0.00       0.00     
    Average: 2333.00
    StdDev: 46.91
    Min: 2282
    Max: 2381
    Spread: 99
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    edited April 6 #10
    Well, FINALLY found something to like about the new forum software. (Besides the easy picture uploading)

    I can cut and paste data from my Chronograph files and it retains its formatting
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    41.0gr = 2,350 fps 
    43.0gr = 2,500 fps

    Gonn go lower. 

    39.0gr
    40.0gr
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,068 Senior Member
    I predict that all efforts to modify the .308 for a kid will yield inferior results to a plain old .243. Still, it's a worthwhile endeavor if it involves the boy.
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    41.0gr = 2,350 fps 
    43.0gr = 2,500 fps

    Gonn go lower. 

    39.0gr
    40.0gr
    IIRC, I started with 38.0 with 125 NBTs in her rifle
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    39.0gr gave me an average MV of 2,201 fps which I was shooting for. But, did this at 100 yards in 3 water jugs. 



    I’m gonna slow it down some more. 

    37.0gr next
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    37gr = 2,082 fps

    Shredded 1st & Stopped in 3rd




    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • shushshush Senior Member Posts: 6,260 Senior Member
    edited April 6 #16

    Have a care there now, you will be reinventing the .300 Sherwood, before you know it  :)

    Henry Sharp, in his 1906 book Modern Sporting Gunnery, quotes hunters in British Columbia who used the .300 Sherwood to kill bears, bighorn sheep, and one verified caribou at 220 yd.






    cjp wrote: »..... Oh dear God, I've admitted to liking something Limey.I'll never hear the end of this.

    Jayhawker wrote: »...But seriously Shush....

    Big Chief wrote: ».........walking around with a greasy butt ain't no fun, though!

     


     

  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    I’ve noticed that reduced loads ain’t the most accurate out there. But, they will do at 100 yards. 

    Probably gonna run the 36-37gr load with a little more tweaking. 

    That speed end seems to do well with the .300 BO and the 110gr bullet from the reviews I’ve read. 

    2,100ish+ fps
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    Here
    is my boy blowing up water jugs at 100 yards with the 36gr load. 






    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    edited April 8 #19
    110gr Varmageddon 
    36gr = 2,038 fps

    Blew up 2 jugs at 100 yards and the largest portion punctured and veered out the side of the third to be unfound. 



    All i recovered. 



    Accuracy aint great but functional for a 100yrd load. 


    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    edited April 8 #20
    Today, I tried sowing down a 125gr SST. 

    39gr H4895 = 2,260 fps

    Accuracy



    It blew theough 3 jugs and stopped in the 4th at 100 yards. 



    Recovered bullet.





    My boy shot it and the recoil was a little more than he anticipated. I’m going to try and slow that one down a little more. Try .38gr H4895 next and see if I can get to 2,200 fps. 

    I do do like the looks of that bullet as opposed to the 110gr Varmageddon. Though, reports say the 110gr kills deer at the slower speeds. 

    We will see. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • BigslugBigslug Senior Member Posts: 6,658 Senior Member
    edited April 8 #21
    Zee said:
    Here
    is my boy blowing up water jugs at 100 yards with the 36gr load. 


    Did he giggle the giggle of the highly amused? 

    Three jugs is pretty typical police pistol duty load level penetration.  Ought to do OK on your deliberate feeder shots.  If you're into four, I'm feeling a little more warm and fuzzy about it.

    If that's giving you pause, it might be worth a concurrent experiment with some hammer-faced 150 or 170 grain .30-30 slugs at around 1500-1700 fps. . . or even a little slower. Probably about the same kick & would get you basically a high sectional density .357 Mag.

    Track down a copy of Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook if you don't have one already.  Even if you're not pouring your own projectile, it works as a pretty good resource for figuring out reduced loads. 
    WWJMBD?

    "Nothing is safe from stupid." - Zee
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    edited April 9 #23
    If you're going that route, why not the 125 SCHPs I mentioned in post #7?

    I know they're fairly accurate in the wife's Ruger 308, I also have first hand experience of their terminal performance x2, and I approve

    edited to add: PLUS, they've got the super cool black oxide coating :rotflmao:

    Plus the added benefit of having a baseline MV with H4895 and a 16.5" bbl
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
     
    What's not to love???
    ("Stolen" MidSouth Shooters Supply pic)
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    edited April 9 #25
    I don’t have a Midsourh Account and I do have a Midway Account. 

    Might change plans again, though. 

    I want to try and shoot a pig with the 36gr H4895 & 110gr Varmageddon load to test the terminal performance. If it works to my satisfaction, I don’t need to buy any other bullets. 

    If they grenade, I’ll be in the market. 

    That could all change. It will be over a month until I can get after the pigs to test. 


    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    Zee said:
    That could all change. It will be over a month until I can get after the pigs to test. 


    Since those SCHP bullets were, supposedly, a 1 time purchase, and they've already sold out of the 250ct bags, they may, or may not be available then.

    Which is why, after seeing how they performed, I purchased an additional 3x 100ct bags.

    The downside, as far as using them in my BO is concerned, is the ogive length.
    With a proper bullet profile (Sierra 125 TMK, Barnes 110 TTSX) I can seat them out to 2.25" COAL and have them chamber.

    The SCHPs require a 1.86" COAL to chamber
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • snake284snake284 Senior Member Posts: 21,091 Senior Member
    edited April 12 #27
    bisley said:
    I predict that all efforts to modify the .308 for a kid will yield inferior results to a plain old .243. Still, it's a worthwhile endeavor if it involves the boy.
    I tend to agree with you about the .243 bisley and would stick with a .30-30 myself, since I have one. But Zee is into SCIENCE, he's a scientist. So hold his beer, step back and let him play. Every once and a while he comes out with an advance for humanity. Besides there's lots of people here that don't own a .30-30 but own a .308, or even a .300 Savage that have young kids or a recoil skiddish wife that want to hunt. I have access to a .308 so this is interesting to me also.
    Daddy, what's an enabler?
    Son that's somebody with nothing to do with his time but keep me in trouble with mom.
  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    edited April 12 #28
    If I’m gonna slow a bullet down to lessen recoil........and ultimately reduce impact and expansion capabilities............I’d rather do that with a .30cal bullet than a 6mm bullet. 

    The 6mm thrives on speed. The .30cal doesn’t need it as much for terminal effect. 

    And as to a .30-30 Win or .308 Win..........if the same bullet is slowed down to the same velocity from both cartridges......it don’t matter which case launched it. 

    Comfort of the launching platform is the deciding factor. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
  • shooter10mmshooter10mm Member Posts: 215 Member
    Zee said:
    I use the 194gr Lehigh in my Subsonic loads.......Beastly!!
    "You miss 100% of the shots you do not take!"
    "As long as there's Lead in the air there's hope!
    " -- Ralph Adkinson(Daddy) The original Marlboro Man
  • knitepoetknitepoet Senior Member Posts: 17,539 Senior Member
    Just a FYI,
    the 125 SCHPs are now completely gone.
    Only way I know to get them (uncoated) is in GBW 300BO ammo from Bud's (bought a box of them to compare my handloads against their factory counterpart in accuracy and velocity)
    Seven Habits of Highly Effective Pirates, Rule #37: There is no “overkill”. There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload”.


  • ZeeZee Senior Member Posts: 19,443 Senior Member
    edited May 15 #31
    No worries. Gonna stick with the 110gr Nosler/Hornady and the 125gr Hornady SST bullets. 

    If they will cooperate, I plan to kill a pig with the .308 Win  110gr Varmageddon reduces load tonight. They gotta show up, first. 
    "To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
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