A couple of My ideas on Personal Defense

DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior MemberPosts: 9,496 Senior Member
I don't follow certain mainstream dogma of the personal defense World:

1. Concentrate on the front sight.

I actually sort of ignore the sights.

I many times have held a sidearm at My side pointed down as I scanned visually for threat(s), then brought the sidearm up into My field of vision and cover the threat without hunching My head down.
And even then I concentrate on the threats(s) not the sight, aware that there may be other unseen threat(s)

After seeing the humpback some shooters have after many years of hunching, I am convinced of the wisdom of not hunching.

2.Time yourself during shooting exercises and drawing etc....

I have never timed Myself, I think it is more important to hone all of the elements involved in shooting and drawing and the sum total of all ones efforts will result in good time, in due time.

3. Sights and type of sights are extremely important on a defensive sidearm.

Yes and no, maybe, I remember shooting a friends Officers model type 1911 and it had no sights, just a somewhat pronounced and etched rib, and I liked it very much.
I have always felt that at defensive distances 7-10 feet even out to 20 feet, sights are not as critical or essential to hitting the target accurately if you train for that method.

I believe there is some merit to learning to shoot sans use of the sights at all, sometimes called "Instinctive shooting" although the need may never arise, one really never knows.

More to follow as I remember.
"There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996

Replies

  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 23,982 Senior Member
    :that:

    Some of what you dislike or don't follow are fun to some and make shooting for some more fun than just punching paper.

    That is why I don't go to an organized range much.
    A Veteran is someone that served in the Military, it does not matter where they served.
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    I've never timed myself or had any reason to do so. I don't shoot competition so timing would, I think, just be one more distraction.

    Like you I have, in real situations, had my pistol down at my side then brought it up to presentation.

    And come to think about it, I guess I don't use the front sight much at all in "quick shoot". After a lot of practice the point of aim for the pistol is fairly well ingrained so I just point and fire.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • bruchibruchi Senior Member Posts: 2,582 Senior Member
    I trained with the guy here in PR that trains SWAT and works presently in the special arrests unit, happens to be a good IPSC bussy, a bit chubby guy that puts a lot of those very fit and experienced guys in shame, he insists on training without the use of sights at close quarters and he has had way more than once the opportunity to actually try this and prevail.

    The thing is to develop CORRECT muscle memory to perform without thinking, as with any physical endeavor you do this by pushing yourself but doing so following correct procedure, ideally you achieve a mix of speed and accuracy the latter being the most important, if not you are training to lose faster, I try to achieve this by shooting at farther distances using the sights and shorter ones without sights, many a time at IPSC matches I will not use the sights on the closer targets and if behind cover will shoot one handed, both using only my strong or weak hand, it is not great for my scores but that to me there is secondary.
    If this post is non welcomed, I can always give you a recipe for making "tostones".
  • Jack BurtonJack Burton Member Posts: 379 Member
    I've always practiced sighting with both sights. I've been in a few scrapes (distances from 5' out to 20') where I cannot recall afterword ever seeing the sights, just the threat was my focus. And the only time limit was when they were no longer a threat. I suppose muscle memory practicing with both sights helped.
    Came for the fishing, stayed for the guns.
  • NNNN Senior Member Posts: 23,982 Senior Member
    As to #3, I find I have to at least try and use the front sight as a reference so as to not shoot low.
    A Veteran is someone that served in the Military, it does not matter where they served.
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Rethinking what I wrote, I suppose it's very likely that I unconsciously do use the sights but I don't think "sights" when I'm quick-shooting. It just happens because I've practiced a lot. Probably the way it should be in a crisis.

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
  • joseph06joseph06 Member Posts: 133 Member
    I think the old mantra of "Take your time, quickly!" is pretty true when it comes to shooting. When shooting against the clock or when hunting things that move quickly and only give you a split second to shoot, I've found I hit far better when I do things smoothly. I look at the front site when I shoot a pistol, but I train that way and I do it because I hit best like that. If you train with another technique and it works for you, practice the mechanics until it becomes repeatable under stress, and I think that's about as good as you can do.
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    You can always do better, and it takes range time too, reading it in a book is not enough.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • CaptainRoadBlockCaptainRoadBlock Member Posts: 49 Member
    Ive spent hours just looking away and pointing at objects or targets at home. then when i look at the target, im usually pointed fairly close. I dont conciously think, sight picture, shoot, when i draw. The mantra at the academy was 'Get it out, Get it up, Get it off". Thats been the way ive shot for years. Call it instinctive shooting or whatever, but from 25 yards and in, i dont really care about sight picture. I have enough to worry about with threat assessment, and surroundings to worry about the perfect sight picture.
    So Officer, why did you shoot my client 8 times? Uh, the magazine ran dry.
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,425 Senior Member
    samzhere wrote: »
    Rethinking what I wrote, I suppose it's very likely that I unconsciously do use the sights but I don't think "sights" when I'm quick-shooting. It just happens because I've practiced a lot. Probably the way it should be in a crisis.

    This happens to me. I recently dropped 0 points on an IDPA stage, and I don't recall really aiming at all. Dry fire practice and knowing your handgun really does work wonders.

    My number one rule for PD is to be willing to make the decision to take someone else's life (in other words consciously decide that your life is worth more than theirs). This is followed closely by training and knowing your local laws.
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "It's far easier to start out learning to be precise and then speeding up, than it is having never "mastered" the weapon, and trying to be precise." - Dan C
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    An even better Personal Defense point of view is that you have made a decision to stand up and defend you and yours against any danger, and are willing to do whatever it takes and bear any expense in order to accomplish that.

    1. Training
    2. equipment
    3. knowledge of the law
    4. Range time
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,694 Senior Member
    I have to aim.

    Quality practice with a handgun has only been an option for me in the last few years, and even now, I don't get enough practice to to be competent with anything but aimed fire. When you go to the range once a month, or less, you spend most of your time getting back to where you were the time before.
  • shotgunshooter3shotgunshooter3 Senior Member Posts: 5,425 Senior Member
    bisley wrote: »
    I have to aim.

    Quality practice with a handgun has only been an option for me in the last few years, and even now, I don't get enough practice to to be competent with anything but aimed fire. When you go to the range once a month, or less, you spend most of your time getting back to where you were the time before.

    Dry fire is your friend, trust me. I dry fire my PD pistol 10-20x for every live round fired. It pays off big time.
    - I am a rifleman with a poorly chosen screen name. -
    "It's far easier to start out learning to be precise and then speeding up, than it is having never "mastered" the weapon, and trying to be precise." - Dan C
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Dry firing pays big dividends when you do NOT have access to mountains of ammo and lots of range time.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • bisleybisley Senior Member Posts: 10,694 Senior Member
    I do some dry fire, when I think of it. But, self-defense type shooting is hard for me to stay focused on, because, thankfully, my lifestyle exposes me to very few obvious threats. I fluctuate back and forth between being interested mostly in rifles, or handguns, and I'm usually at bare minimum levels in my handgun proficiency. I manage to practice enough to be safe for concealed carry, and I can hit targets better than most of the folks I see at the shooting range, but a fast draw will never save my life. On the other hand, I do have a few more options than a 'full-fledged' sheep. :tooth:
  • DoctorWhoDoctorWho Senior Member Posts: 9,496 Senior Member
    Here is one, last week 10:30 pm, I was closing up the service station / gas pumps, when these three guys in their late teens wanted to know where they could purchase hard liquor, I told them all the liquor stores I knew of are closed by 6 pm, only wine or beer is available at supermarkets that late.

    The way they approached Me gave Me pause, 21 foot rule and all that.
    "There is some evil in all of us, Doctor, even you, the Valeyard is an amalgamation of the darker sides of your nature, somewhere between your twelfth and final incarnation, and I may say, you do not improve with age. Founding member of the G&A forum since 1996
  • samzheresamzhere Banned Posts: 10,923 Senior Member
    Hey, Doc, a question off topic --- and please, no, I'm not being picky and cannot remember whether I've asked this of you before... just curious...

    You often capitalize "Me" or "My" in sentences. It takes extra effort to press the shift key so it's not just a typo, so I wondered if maybe you originally spoke or learned German as a kid, then English later and the habit stuck. (for those who don't know, German capitalizes all nouns, both proper and general, like "House" (Haus) or "wife" (Weib).

    Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog, it’s too dark to read. - Groucho Marx
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